Extended oil drain for stationary diesel generator

[Kenny O'Keefe]

We have a stationary generator= Cat 3512 that has an 86 gallon sump and 4 stand by fire pumps=Cat 3208 that have 5 gallon sumps.
We change the oil and filters once every year. I was wondering if I switched to a better quality oil and just changed the filters every year and tested oil samples every 6 months to determine when to change out the oil?
There may be a way to set these up with large bypass oil filters?
Don't know if it would be a problem with state or local regulatory agencies may be insurance company would not like it but it sure seems like a big waste to throw away oil that still looks new.
They only get run 30 minutes a week.

[ February 28, 2005, 06:03 PM: Message edited by: Kenny O'Keefe ]

 

[salesrep]

I think your thoughts are right on the money. There is no reason a premium quality oil will not last much longer than the current interval you are speaking of.
If you are sampling not only will that prove that to yourself, but to any superiors as well.
Sampling will also protect you with your ins. co.and any warranty situation that may arise. I would dbl check the state regulatory rules ( I doubt they come into play)
Sampling is the key here. With that you should be fine on all fronts.

 

[pitzel]

A unit like that should be sampled anyways as part of an overall preventitive maintenance program. Extending the life of the lubricant is just another side benefit.

I think the key here is to ensure that processes are established that will ensure that the whole cycle of testing and intrepreting oil analysis reports will continue, even as individuals move in and out of the organization. Especially if these are the few assets your organization has that are making use of oil analysis.

Also, I wouldn't be so quick just to spend a whole bunch of money on a new type of oil. Maybe talk to the equipment vendor or the vendors' oil analysis lab first -- they often have good advice as to what to use in such situations.

 

[msparks]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kenny O'Keefe:
Don't know if it would be a problem with state or local regulatory agencies may be insurance company would not like it but it sure seems like a big waste to throw away oil that still looks new.
They only get run 30 minutes a week.

---

First off, why are they only run for 30 minutes? They should be run long enough for the oil to reach full operating temp then run for about 30 minutes after that. (But hey that's just me)
Secondly, whats wrong with sampling the oil you are using first. You may or may not need to upgrade depending what you are using now.

Sure I'd love to sell you a better oil, but the usage on that thing would have me questioning weather it's worth it or not.

Secondly, even just draining a few gallons and replacing would be probably sufficient to keep the additives and viscosity in check.

Sounds like you have a good idea for saving folks money. I hope it works out.

 

[bulwnkl]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kenny O'Keefe:
...We change the oil and filters once every year...
...There may be a way to set these up with large bypass oil filters?...

---

There is more than 1 oil filter per engine, correct? That is because one (at least) is a bypass filter. I'm not familiar with the 3512. The 3208s normally have bypass filters on them in any situation I recall seeing (To clarify, I don't see many Caterpillars).

Running that little it seems unlikely to me that your engines would require increased filtration.

 

[Kenny O'Keefe]

The 3512 has 3 oil filters all the same number I don't think it has a bypass filter. The 3308s have 2 oil filters each.
We can't run stand by diesels very much in California we get penalized buy way of fines and permits. Only allowed so many hours per year.
I don't think stand by units like these are good candidates for bypass filters they just don't get run enough to turn over the oil in the bypass filters.
Thanks for all the help. Ken

 

[Steve S]

Talk to a cat rep.

 

[kenneth neeley]

Working on standby and prime Cat genset for sometime now. On 3500's most of my customers wait up to 3 years on pm's due to cost. The main thing is that the jacket water heaters are operational and to what temp. Second, what are the humidity levels at the engines. The engines need to be ran under enough load to insure that the moisture to cooked out of the engine.

 

[Stinky Peterson]

I think you can go longer, perhaps two years or maybe three. The recommended change interval on most cat engines is 250 hours but a big sump should go much longer. We have trucks running that same engine and going over 500 hours on a change. Your engine is probably heated to 140F so there is potential for some degradation to occur, but I predict it will be very slow. I would do semiannual oil samples and base your changes on the results. Pay close attention to oxidation readings and viscosity. Have a Cat lab or someone who performs FTIR analysis do the testing so you can monitor oil condition. It would also be a good idea to do a TBN and TAN once a year to further help monitor condition. I don't usually recommend these tests but since you have a lot of oil the cost is justified. Don't forget to have your coolant tested too, it's more likely to cause problems than the oil. You should not need a different oil or bypass filters.

If you want more info PM me.

 

[Stinky Peterson]

I checked with our generator guy and he says fir this engine change every 3 years or 500 hours whichever comes first. Take oil and coolant samples every 6 months.

He also mentioned that it costs about $1200-$1500 for each oil change so you should be able to save significantly. Don't be surprised if someone recommends annual changes as it is a profit maker.

 

[oilyriser]

It's also a shame to pay for the disposal of fairly good oil. If you filtered it, maybe someone would take it for free, or even pay a bit for it.

 

[brian fix]

Sounds like a hospital situation,,if you use Cat oil (mobil Delvac),decent oil you may be fine with oil anlysis for up to 3 years,testing once per week,load once a month,,how much load shedding do you do??,,,Schaeffers makes a better lube and for extended service,also check Lubrication Engineers for a great product,,use a good set of filters for the oil and also fuel conditioner in tanks,,Schaeffers,#139 Soyshield,will help out alot with emmisions,,,,,,,,,,,,,BL

 

[Kenny O'Keefe]

Would it be ok to run Schaeffers 9000 5-40 oil in these Cat Engines?
The company that has been doing the maintenance on these engines has been using Shell Rotella T 15-40 Oil.

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi,
Stinky's post of March 30 is on the money IMHO

Shell Rotella T 15w-40? - all of Shell's Rotella oils are at the "top of the shelf" - great products!
Make sure that the "model" of Rotella used is applicable to the motor - it will then have a suitable TBN for the application as Stinky had suggested

Doug

[ October 14, 2005, 03:25 AM: Message edited by: Doug Hillary ]

 

[416Rigby]

Schaeffers 9000 is fine stuff. It will serve you well.