6V53 Detroit + Allison TX-100-1 with regard to mil-spec oil.......

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Right now I am working on a M548A1 cargo carrier. It is equiped with a 6V53 Detroit diesel mated to an Allison TX-100-1 three speed automatic. I have accuired the manual/lubrication order for this vehicle, but it is a little confusing for someone who has never been in the military. I need a little help in figuring out which fluids the drive train calls for:

Lubricants : Expected temp.(Above 32F)

Engine - OE/HDO (MIL-L-2104C) : HDO-30

Tranny - OE/HDO (MIL-L-2104C) : OE/HDO-10

T/C - OE/HDO (MIL-L-2104C) : OE/HDO-30

F/D - OE/HDO (MIL-L-2104D) : OE/HDO-15/40

I am guessing that these oils represent an SAE 10, SAE 30, and a 15W-40. Am I correct in this? Any information on this or where to find this kind of stuff would help me out a great deal.....Thanx
 
Looks like you have your hands on a real old lube order. Your guess on which numbers are viscosities is right.

There is nothing in the older M113 vehicles drivetrains that is overly fussy about lubricants as long as you stick with HDEO oils for diesels. Don't use car grade gas engine oils in the engine. Modern HDEO commercial lubes for diesels will work very well.

Mil-l2104C has been superceeded several times and is now up to at least MIL-PRF-2104H as of July 2004.

The 2104 oils are heavy duty engine oils that also are suitable for use in transmissions. If you find a modern 15W-40 oil that meets some 2104 spec plus Allison C4, it will meet any requirements of MIL-L-2104C plus be a better oil. YOu don;t ven need to sweat seeing a 2104 spec on the container if it's a brand name HDEO like Mobil Delvac Super 1300 or the Shell or Chevron equivilants.

The DDC 6V53 is currently specced for 15W-40 in newer Army equipment, so you can us it instead of 30 and eliminate on oil from your supply.

You should be able to do the same for the torque converter and the final drives already call for 15W-40.

The Allison AT is a militarized version of a civilian commercial AT, if you can't easily find a current 2104 10 weight, use whatever is commercially recommended for the transmission.
 
Thank you very mutch XS650. You saved me a lot of worrying. I didn't just want to take a guess and put the wrong oil in and end up destroying a perfectly good piece of equipment. I appreciate the info.
 
Chris,

Those old 2 stroke Detroits have to have single grade oil,I think above 60F SAE 40 is recommended by Detroit. They will not survive on 15W40....too much clearance in them. I saw numerous 6V53's sieze >500 hrs on 15W40 in hot climates.

That 6V53 has a sound all it's own but is not known to take abuse and neglect as well as the 71 and 92 series engines. We had a lot of problems with liner o rings leaking coolant into the airbox. Set the governor below 2200 and it will run a long time. Don't sweat 10 psi oil pressure at idle....it's normal.

2104 is mil language for heavy duty engine oil, 2105 is a gear oil(I.E. 90w), 83282 is grease (GAA is the product but you would be better served with commercial automotive grease).

Not sure about the transmission/final drive in 113's(never been around them) but we use SAE10 in Allison Transmissions in the 923 series 5 tons.

I worked with 6V53's a lot so if you have questions let me know.....

Ike
 
Ike, DDC and the military have both been saying to use MIL-PRF-2104 15W-40 in M113 FOV 6V-53s for a couple of decades now.

The military applications don't see the continuous duty near full loads that commercial applications do. That said, a high quality straight 40 would be a better as long as the temps are hig enough fo decent starting. I don't know what he has in mind for his M-548, but doubt it is going to see a lot of high load continuous duty.

The final drive gears are some large, high quality spur gears that were designed from scratch to use heavy duty engine oil.

The trans won't upshift at anything more then very light throttle with the governor at 2200 rpm if it will upshift at all I don't remember what rpm the torque converter locks up at, it might not lock up at that low an rpm. TC stall speed is 2,000 rpm.

The M113 6V-53 engine is governed at 2800 rpm full load 2950 no load. Real sceery numbers for somone used to commercial applications, but they do pretty well in military applications.

There are over 100,000 M113 family of vehicles vehicles running around and their reliability with 15W-40 and a 2800 rpm governed speed is pretty good.

Chris, you didn't mention the steering differential or wheel the hubs. IIRC, the differential speced the same oil as the transfer case, but check that.

The wheel hubs are either oil filled, which is the best system if they are maintained, or grease filled if the have been retrofitted. Engine oil works well in the hubs.

If you are tempted to test it's amphibious capabilites, don't unless you get some expert help. CG location and a bunch of other things are very important for that, as well as testing it for leaks before you go in the water
 
XS650,

Sounds like you have been around a few 113's!

I repaired a few 113 6V's at Doha,Kuwait several years ago as well as the HEMMTT. Made a few Army friends at a direct support maintenance facility and I gave them a hand. They had dead (siezed) 6V53N Detroits all over and were having a hard time getting replacement engines. I forgot those little 53's were governed that high-they really "squall" at that speed....

I understand the 6V53 is being phased out and the Series 50/60 4 stroke is the new powerplant.

Correct on the 2104 recommendation in the equipment technical manual. DOD wide the only HDEO procuerable is 15W40 anymore. I'd say more of a logistical decision to stock one lube for everything....

What's odd is all the 2 stroke Detroit powered equipment TO/TM's (I have seen to date) say 15/40, and the engine -24 recommends straight weight oil-so there is a contradiction in the Tech data. Was a little suprised at my first base seeing no straighr weight as I was trained on DD's as a civilian.

In Las Vegas we were getting 500 hours out of 6V53 powered test stands and when I left there in 95 we had 100 ton air conditioners 6V92TA powered eating 1-2 gal of 15/40 every 10 hours with less than 1000 hrs on the clock-glad I left before I had to pull one. Clark DDA in St Louis was adamant about 40W when these cooling units were purchased.....but as you know the military has a mind of its own.


I was Air Force for 10 yrs... Mostly repaired heavy equipment/aircraft ground support equipment. Got lucky and landed a full time AGR slot after that with the GA ANG and work in power generation/air control these days...a very deployable career field today...

One thing's for certain, the EPA is going to rid the DOD of their 2 stroke DD's....


Ike

[ August 12, 2004, 09:27 PM: Message edited by: Ike ]
 
I concur the use of 40W. Straight, good ol 40W. NO, absolutely, not, no way 15W-40 for a 2 cycle detroit.. Period... The 2 cycle Detroit will live a fairly long life is 40W CD rated oil is used.
Mobil, for one, makes a straight 40W Detroit Oil called just that, Detroit 40W.
I have many inches of scar tissue on my butt from folks using 15W-40 instead of straight 40W.
Please, don't use the 15W-40 unless you want to see parts of the inside of your engine on the outside of your engine...
George Morrison, STLE CLS
AV Lubricants Inc.
 
The lube order I got conveniently had a page about the differential missing. After I read it a few times, I figured out (guessed) that it uses the same oil as the transfer case. The wheel hubs are grease filled. This 548 is only getting used in the dessert. We dont use it that often, but when we do, it is 100+ degrees outside. The idiots who drive it like to keep the pedal on the floor in low gear. Why, I dont know. There is no water to test out it's amphibious capabilities so I'm not worried about that. In fact this is the first year where we have had more than 6 inches of rain in quite a long time. I have not had a chance to work on this thing since I first posted this because I had to have some surgery done, but when I do, it gives me piece of mind to know that I'll be better armed with knowledge. Thanx for all of the info.
 
API CF-2 oil in a Detroit 2-stroke, usually SAE 40. Be sure it's CF-2. Chevron Delo 100 is one good oil for those engines, not Delo 400.


Ken
 
quote:

Originally posted by ChrisG:
The lube order I got conveniently had a page about the differential missing. After I read it a few times, I figured out (guessed) that it uses the same oil as the transfer case. The wheel hubs are grease filled. This 548 is only getting used in the dessert. We dont use it that often, but when we do, it is 100+ degrees outside. The idiots who drive it like to keep the pedal on the floor in low gear.

100F+ is no problem if the cooling system is in decent condition. The cooling systems on those were designed for working hard against a big drawbar load at low speeds in 120F+ weather.

Your nimrods running around against the governor in low lock is another kettle of fish. Those engines are governed at a high speed for a DDC engine. If you can't train them, you might want to get the governor cut back a few hundred RPM, contrary to what I recommended before.

I don't remember the details about shift points, but you might try getting the governor cut back to about 2400 rpm and see if it still shifts OK, even if you have to take your foot off the throttle for an upshift. IIRC, the governor adjustment is fairly easy, you could probably do it yourself. Hopefully your nimrods can't undo it themselves.
 
I have 3 questions for you guys. First, how do you get that line off that blocks the transmission filter. The filter would be fairly easy to remove except that 2" line/hose is in the way. I cannot get a wrench in there to loosen the hose. Second, How/where do I adjust the governor for the engine? I was testing it out and the govenor does not even appear to be hooked up at all!! Third, how can I adjust the shift points on this transmission? Keep in mind, I am not familiar with this piece of equipment and I have no manuals at all for it, so I am going at it blindly. This is actually the first 6V53 piece of equipment I have worked on. Thanx
 
I haven't worked on the 548, but I think I have a copy of the current LO in PDF format I can email you if you would like it.
 
Sure, send it to me. The one I have is from 1982. Maybe a more current one would help.
 
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