Here's the deal we run two 1441cc Kawasaki zx14r drag bikes. Currently we run Amsoil 20w 50 with great success. However our dilemma is cost. Each bike takes almost 5 quarts and we change out the oil after about 8-track passes and it gets expensive. Reason the oil is changed out so often because in drag racing you hammer the clutch off the starting line and you end up getting a lot of clutch debris in the oil which can clog up the oil pick up tube. So my question is what oils out there do you feel can handle being shared as an engine and gearbox lubricant not break down but not break the bank either. If I have to spend the money then that's what I have to do to protect the life of the engine but I just wanted to know what other reliable options are out there with better pricing.
High Performance Motorcycle oil...which one?
- Thread starter Neiz15
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For only 8 track passes, and, like you say, the oil is changed due to clutch debris, I say save some $$$ and go with the very good, highly engineered, Mobil1 V-Twin 20w50 suitable for shared transmission/gearbox as Mobil says, and thats mainly because it doesn't use heavy friction modifiers like moly.
This saves $17 per oil change. Walmart's price off the shelf, or shipped on walmart.com. Hard to beat their price usually.
Going with Valvoline 20w50 full syn motorcycle oil would save a total of $27 per oil change, another full synthetic. As long as you're using a full synthetic 20w50 from a reputable company, you're fine.
Or, maybe check Pablo (message him) or another Amsoil rep for a discount(?).
This saves $17 per oil change. Walmart's price off the shelf, or shipped on walmart.com. Hard to beat their price usually.
Going with Valvoline 20w50 full syn motorcycle oil would save a total of $27 per oil change, another full synthetic. As long as you're using a full synthetic 20w50 from a reputable company, you're fine.
Or, maybe check Pablo (message him) or another Amsoil rep for a discount(?).
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Filter it/spin it/settle it and put it back?
If you want something cheaper I'd think a 15/40 HDEO might do the job OK, though you MIGHT get friction modifier effects on the clutch, accounts vary.
Here in Taiwan I might buy Castrol GO! 20W-40, but I dunno if thats available where you are.
If you can pre-heat/warm it up, maybe a straight SAE40?
If you want something cheaper I'd think a 15/40 HDEO might do the job OK, though you MIGHT get friction modifier effects on the clutch, accounts vary.
Here in Taiwan I might buy Castrol GO! 20W-40, but I dunno if thats available where you are.
If you can pre-heat/warm it up, maybe a straight SAE40?
I definitely have to stay with a motorcycle only oil. Believe me even changing brands gives you different clutch feel when coming off the starting line and as you know that's where the race is either lost or won. I am currently signed up as an Amsoil member but again still fairly expensive. I was thinking about going to the mobile 1 v twin but I thought that was close in price to the Amsoil. I will have to check it out.
I was also thinking about the Valvoline 20/50 full synthetic but wasn't sure to trust it or not. You really don't hear much about the Valvoline motorcycle oil anywhere. I sure would like to know more about it and with that kind of price I wouldn't mind the frequent oil changes at all. Just don't want to keep the engine clean and at the same time hurt it by using something that is not holding up in high RPM runs.
I was also thinking about the Valvoline 20/50 full synthetic but wasn't sure to trust it or not. You really don't hear much about the Valvoline motorcycle oil anywhere. I sure would like to know more about it and with that kind of price I wouldn't mind the frequent oil changes at all. Just don't want to keep the engine clean and at the same time hurt it by using something that is not holding up in high RPM runs.
If the Amsoil is working I would stay with it. Not that there might not be other oils that also work well, it just might be an expensive experiment finding out. I second Ducked's earlier suggestion about filtering the clutch contaminated oil. Maybe you could rig up a bench mounted filtration system in your race trailer or shop. You could use a bypass type filter with a low micron rating.
Thanks guys appreciate all the info
Talk to your Amsoil jobber about getting a better price, bulk maybe since you use so much. Offer to put Amsoil stickers on your bikes and trailer. PM bitog member Pablo here, he might cut you a better deal. The Valvoline Vr1 racing synthetic might be an option as well.
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Originally Posted by Langanobob
I second Ducked's earlier suggestion about filtering the clutch contaminated oil. Maybe you could rig up a bench mounted filtration system in your race trailer or shop. You could use a bypass type filter with a low micron rating.
Well, that was one of my suggestions, and perhaps the most appropriate in this rather high-end context, especially as the contaminant is probably fibrous, and fairly light.
There are other possibilities, though.
For example, someday, perhaps quite soon, I'm going to change my oil.
When I do, I'm going to decant the waste oil into 4 fizzy pop bottles, balanced in pairs. Then I'm going to put them in a homemade angled centrifuge head in a verticle axis spin dryer and spin it for half an hour or so, and see what I get on the bottom of the bottles.
I'm quite looking forward to it.
This, I know, is rather sad.
I second Ducked's earlier suggestion about filtering the clutch contaminated oil. Maybe you could rig up a bench mounted filtration system in your race trailer or shop. You could use a bypass type filter with a low micron rating.
Well, that was one of my suggestions, and perhaps the most appropriate in this rather high-end context, especially as the contaminant is probably fibrous, and fairly light.
There are other possibilities, though.
For example, someday, perhaps quite soon, I'm going to change my oil.
When I do, I'm going to decant the waste oil into 4 fizzy pop bottles, balanced in pairs. Then I'm going to put them in a homemade angled centrifuge head in a verticle axis spin dryer and spin it for half an hour or so, and see what I get on the bottom of the bottles.
I'm quite looking forward to it.
This, I know, is rather sad.
Pretty cool experiment though, interested.
Originally Posted by gman2304
Talk to your Amsoil jobber about getting a better price, bulk maybe since you use so much. Offer to put Amsoil stickers on your bikes and trailer.
If going for sponsorship maybe think about the dress code. Guy on the left appears to be wearing suspenders. Not a good look
Talk to your Amsoil jobber about getting a better price, bulk maybe since you use so much. Offer to put Amsoil stickers on your bikes and trailer.
If going for sponsorship maybe think about the dress code. Guy on the left appears to be wearing suspenders. Not a good look
Walmart carries this one (cheaper) and it's suitable for wet clutches.
neiz
if you want to play the game
then you have to play the game!
either get a sponsor
or
start testing what works (almost) as well for a much cheaper price.
if you want to play the game
then you have to play the game!
either get a sponsor
or
start testing what works (almost) as well for a much cheaper price.
Are you trying to win a series Championship, or just have some fun? If every hundredth counts, get a low viscosity oil, and be prepared to tear down and rebuild as necessary. A jockey sized rider with mad skills would be high on the list too, say someone like Ryan Schnitz. Sponsorship or deep pockets, would be a high priority at that level.
If it's just some weekend fun, then I'd keep running the higher viscosity oil (mainly for gear longevity) and accept the slight loss in performance caused by drag from the thicker oil. When I was helping run some LSR TurboBusa's, we ran a 15w50 with great success. As soon as we ran a low viscosity oil at the suggestion of a Yoshimura AMA Superbike principal, we had gear tooth pitting and failure. What he failed to take into account was the fact that we were producing approx. 3 times the HP of a then AMA Superbike, AND that we weren't looking to gain every fraction of a HP.
In our case we had more power than could be put to the ground anyway, so a couple more HP gained through using low-viscosity oil didn't matter, but the resulting gear wear did.
I personally don't care for HDEO oils in bikes, as I've found with the oils I've tried, that the shifting becomes notchy quickly. But in your case of changing the oil every 2 miles, something like Rotella 15w40 might be just what you're looking for.
If it's just some weekend fun, then I'd keep running the higher viscosity oil (mainly for gear longevity) and accept the slight loss in performance caused by drag from the thicker oil. When I was helping run some LSR TurboBusa's, we ran a 15w50 with great success. As soon as we ran a low viscosity oil at the suggestion of a Yoshimura AMA Superbike principal, we had gear tooth pitting and failure. What he failed to take into account was the fact that we were producing approx. 3 times the HP of a then AMA Superbike, AND that we weren't looking to gain every fraction of a HP.
In our case we had more power than could be put to the ground anyway, so a couple more HP gained through using low-viscosity oil didn't matter, but the resulting gear wear did.
I personally don't care for HDEO oils in bikes, as I've found with the oils I've tried, that the shifting becomes notchy quickly. But in your case of changing the oil every 2 miles, something like Rotella 15w40 might be just what you're looking for.
300V 4T Factory Line 15W50
Originally Posted by Bjornviken
300V 4T Factory Line 15W50
That's what I run in two of my three sportbikes. Likely to be in the third as well at some point.
But it's not less expensive than the Amsoil the OP is currently running.
300V 4T Factory Line 15W50
That's what I run in two of my three sportbikes. Likely to be in the third as well at some point.
But it's not less expensive than the Amsoil the OP is currently running.
Originally Posted by Neiz15
I definitely have to stay with a motorcycle only oil. Believe me even changing brands gives you different clutch feel when coming off the starting line and as you know that's where the race is either lost or won. I am currently signed up as an Amsoil member but again still fairly expensive. I was thinking about going to the mobile 1 v twin but I thought that was close in price to the Amsoil. I will have to check it out. I was also thinking about the Valvoline 20/50 full synthetic but wasn't sure to trust it or not. You really don't hear much about the Valvoline motorcycle oil anywhere. I sure would like to know more about it and with that kind of price I wouldn't mind the frequent oil changes at all. Just don't want to keep the engine clean and at the same time hurt it by using something that is not holding up in high RPM runs.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/9-pack-Mobil-1-20W-50-Full-Synthetic-Motorcycle-Oil-1-qt/730898182 in a 9-pack at walmart.com is kinda cheap. I don't know why Walmart cuts the best deals with oil companies, but they typically have the best prices. About $9 per quart in the 9-pack.
Valvoline motorcycle Full synthetic does cut it down to $7.50 per quart. https://www.walmart.com/ip/Valvoline-Motorcycle-Full-Synthetic-20W-50-Motor-Oil-1-Quart/16777819
Given that Valvoline has been around forever ( since 1866), I'd trust them for this stuff. Hard to say if Mobil motorcycle oil is really better. Smart to stay with full synthetic if you can.
Car engine oils won't work because they have friction-modifiers like moly and organic FM's in it. Motorcycle oils have a lot of ZDDP for anti-wear, and ZDDP actually increases friction so its not a problem for wet clutches.
I definitely have to stay with a motorcycle only oil. Believe me even changing brands gives you different clutch feel when coming off the starting line and as you know that's where the race is either lost or won. I am currently signed up as an Amsoil member but again still fairly expensive. I was thinking about going to the mobile 1 v twin but I thought that was close in price to the Amsoil. I will have to check it out. I was also thinking about the Valvoline 20/50 full synthetic but wasn't sure to trust it or not. You really don't hear much about the Valvoline motorcycle oil anywhere. I sure would like to know more about it and with that kind of price I wouldn't mind the frequent oil changes at all. Just don't want to keep the engine clean and at the same time hurt it by using something that is not holding up in high RPM runs.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/9-pack-Mobil-1-20W-50-Full-Synthetic-Motorcycle-Oil-1-qt/730898182 in a 9-pack at walmart.com is kinda cheap. I don't know why Walmart cuts the best deals with oil companies, but they typically have the best prices. About $9 per quart in the 9-pack.
Valvoline motorcycle Full synthetic does cut it down to $7.50 per quart. https://www.walmart.com/ip/Valvoline-Motorcycle-Full-Synthetic-20W-50-Motor-Oil-1-Quart/16777819
Given that Valvoline has been around forever ( since 1866), I'd trust them for this stuff. Hard to say if Mobil motorcycle oil is really better. Smart to stay with full synthetic if you can.
Car engine oils won't work because they have friction-modifiers like moly and organic FM's in it. Motorcycle oils have a lot of ZDDP for anti-wear, and ZDDP actually increases friction so its not a problem for wet clutches.
Originally Posted by Langanobob
Maybe you could rig up a bench mounted filtration system in your race trailer or shop. You could use a bypass type filter with a low micron rating.
Not sure how much they cost, but there are companies who make some for industrial hydraulic systems. If you can get filtration down to 1 or 2 microns, that's pretty cleaned-up oil. .....
http://www.precisionfiltration.com/products/handheld-mobile-filter-system.asp is one example, although check with any company you buy from for the viscosity range of operation (around 180 cSt at room temperature) when filtering.
Maybe you could rig up a bench mounted filtration system in your race trailer or shop. You could use a bypass type filter with a low micron rating.
Not sure how much they cost, but there are companies who make some for industrial hydraulic systems. If you can get filtration down to 1 or 2 microns, that's pretty cleaned-up oil. .....
http://www.precisionfiltration.com/products/handheld-mobile-filter-system.asp is one example, although check with any company you buy from for the viscosity range of operation (around 180 cSt at room temperature) when filtering.
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