Mobil 1 and Mobil 1 EP Compared
- Thread starter Stinky Peterson
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On behalf of the board, thanks Stinky! Thats weird; the EP oils are thinner than the regular M1
Are the new EP oils energy conserving (carry the starburst) in 5w/10w-30s?
Thanks Stinky, appreciate it. The viscosity of M1 always varies from 10.5 to 11.2 generally. The 5w-30 does appear to be thicker.
Looks like P is avg'ing around 900ppm, Zinc about 1,000ppm. Boron levels are much higher. Other than that, not too much different then GF-3 Mobil 1 as the other guys have said. If it performs well, I guess it will be worth the $5.36 qt they are charging. I'm looking forward to Pennzoil's Platinum Oils for a good comparison.
Looks like P is avg'ing around 900ppm, Zinc about 1,000ppm. Boron levels are much higher. Other than that, not too much different then GF-3 Mobil 1 as the other guys have said. If it performs well, I guess it will be worth the $5.36 qt they are charging. I'm looking forward to Pennzoil's Platinum Oils for a good comparison.
The regular Mobil 1's say Energy Conserving in the API symbol, the EP's do not.
I should mention that I bought these are Walmart yesterday (not that it matters).
I ran the viscosity 4 times to confirm the results because I thought they seemed high but have no explaination for the results.
I should mention that I bought these are Walmart yesterday (not that it matters).
I ran the viscosity 4 times to confirm the results because I thought they seemed high but have no explaination for the results.
Thanks Stinky. Could you explain for the neophytes what these values represent:
JHZR2
Staff member
I have to wonderhow much lab error there is in the standard M1 viscosity. It seems a bit thick, unless it was necessary due to lower additives...
JMH
JMH
PQ is ferrous debris which is mainly iron and or nickle. You can read more about it here
The advantage of PQ is it measures iron without regard to particle size, oil clarity, presence of water, etc. These things all affect the other instruments so we often cannot perform the other tests. As I have said before particles much bigger than 5 microns are invisible to the ICP that measures wear elements. With the PQ we can find things like chunks of gears, washers, bolts, and all sorts of things people put in the bottle. By comparing the PQ to the Iron reading we can tell about the size of the particles. If Iron is about the same or higher than PQ then we have small particles. If PQ is higher than Iron we are dealing with large particles. When we see high PQ we generally do a microscope exam to see what's there. This is especially helpful for engines because we cannot run particles counts without special time-consuming preparation.
PVi (Particle Volume Index) is a calculated value based on the cube of the particle size and the sum of the counts of all 8 channels. What it does is use one number to describe all 8 channels of the particle counter and provide an easy way to spot a change in particle distribution. There can be a lot of small particles and the number does not change but if there are some big ones it jump dramatically. More bigger particles means trouble so that's what we want to look for and ISO codes don't work well for unfiltered compartment. I came up with the formula after seeing something similar being done by another lab. I can give you the formula if you want.
The advantage of PQ is it measures iron without regard to particle size, oil clarity, presence of water, etc. These things all affect the other instruments so we often cannot perform the other tests. As I have said before particles much bigger than 5 microns are invisible to the ICP that measures wear elements. With the PQ we can find things like chunks of gears, washers, bolts, and all sorts of things people put in the bottle. By comparing the PQ to the Iron reading we can tell about the size of the particles. If Iron is about the same or higher than PQ then we have small particles. If PQ is higher than Iron we are dealing with large particles. When we see high PQ we generally do a microscope exam to see what's there. This is especially helpful for engines because we cannot run particles counts without special time-consuming preparation.
PVi (Particle Volume Index) is a calculated value based on the cube of the particle size and the sum of the counts of all 8 channels. What it does is use one number to describe all 8 channels of the particle counter and provide an easy way to spot a change in particle distribution. There can be a lot of small particles and the number does not change but if there are some big ones it jump dramatically. More bigger particles means trouble so that's what we want to look for and ISO codes don't work well for unfiltered compartment. I came up with the formula after seeing something similar being done by another lab. I can give you the formula if you want.
MolaKule
Staff member
ONe thing is for sure, EXM is counting on their Calcium and Boron to keep the acids in check for extended drains.
Stinky, is the vis you show the 100C vis? the 5-30 spec has been 10.0
The 20% value is for spectrograph. The repeatablity of viscosity is MUCH higher. Search it's here somewhere. May be on the 3MP oil study page too.
Oh, yes I think that is normal too. Probably more like different lots rather than literally bottle to bottle.
Jason is right, there should be very little variance between instruments. Viscosity is the easiest test to duplicate and from lab to lab it shouldn't vary by more then a couple of tenths of a cSt.
Yes it is at 100C, the range for SAE 30 is 9.3 to 12.4 cSt at 100C.
MolaKule
Staff member
INHO the LL oils, the 4X4 oils, Easy Starting oils, the EP oils, the SUV oils, etc are ALL marketing gimmicks to get more market share. Valvoline's Maxlife started the trend and now each company is trying to find a new niche to gain more market share. In a recent article in STLE's Lubrication Engineering magazine stated a great question: "What will be the new niche Market?"
I have a new niche market I would like to fill with my new oil:
Cold morning Startup-High Moisture Quick Drive Away-Cold Temp/High TEMP-High Horsepower V6/L4-Lead Foot-Old Lady-Soccer Mom-Redneck/White Collar Driver-4X4-2X4-Hybrid Compatible-Big Block/Small Block Oil in a new viscosity weight of 0W20W30.
Before I pay extra for these gimmick oils I would choose either Redline, Schaeffer's, or Chevron Supreme.
Ca higher too - perhaps contributing to a higher TBN at start. The higher zinc is probably what is keeping it from GF-4 specs.
Edit: Sorry MolaKule - I see you already covered the Ca in prior post.
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