4 dragging weak brakes (after parked for a year)

[columnshift]

I have a 2001 Ford Taurus v6 that currently has 4 weak and dragging brakes... but not totally!

It was parked for a year (didn't plan for it to sit that long but put Pri-G in the tank just in case it was), started up again fine, drove it to the nearest gas station and back - and the rear brakes were too hot to touch from barely over a mile at 25-30mph, but not dragging so much it's slowing the car down noticibly that I can tell. (like I sped up to 40mph and released the throttle and just coasted on 'normally' for the most part) Front brakes super weak - rain gave them some rust, I tried speeding up to 40mph a few times and braking hard to clean rust off. It still brakes really soft - pedal seems really stiff.

The brakes aren't seized but there's limited range of motion - like I tried using the rear only brakes via parking brake third pedal to slow it while moving, I could tell they engaged but were super weak. I can tell when they released pulling the lever too. So there's movement in the little pistons just not as much as there needs to be.

The brakes were (I think) not that old at all (less than 15k maybe??) since all four were done if I remember right, then I was forced to park the vehicle for using too much gas. (had a 40mpg econobox and had to drive alot) Trying to get it back up to speed now. I'd rather not totally redo everything if I can help it - wondered if like I could turn rotors or/and drums just to scrape the rust off but not change pads/shoes for instance, or if i'm probably stuck changing pads/shoes as well. (or even calipers possibly depending if it hangs up again)

Cash is tight because of other unexpected expenses all this month as well.

 

[SatinSilver]

Are the wheels hot when you touch them? Not sure if that's what you meant earlier or not. You can get some super cheap brake rotors on rockauto. Made by Centric other some other brand names. At least do the front axle with new pads, grease/rebuild the calipers upfront.

 

[wheelman1991]

I would at least tear the brakes down to see why they are hanging up. The pads and rotors can be reused. If the pads are sticking to the bracket they sit in, you can clean the mounting tabs up with sandpaper or a wire wheel. The rotors can either be left alone and let the pads do the dirty work, or hit with the sandpaper/ wire wheel also, just make sure that you don't put a directional surface on them. Basically give everything like the slide pins for the caliper and the mounting points on the bracket a good cleaning and lube job with silicone paste. If that works, then enjoy a cold beverage of your choice. Otherwise check the calipers and see if they are sticking.

 

[eljefino]

What wheelman said.

 

[BrocLuno]

+2

 

[Nick1994]

As wheelman said, lube up the brake calipers.

Then bleed all the brakes out and see how it does.

After a drive jack it up and spin each wheel and see if it sticks. If it does, could be bad caliper(s), rubber hose(s) or master cylinder.

 

[columnshift]

Originally Posted By: SatinSilver
Are the wheels hot when you touch them? Not sure if that's what you meant earlier or not.


The brake drums were hotter than they should be. The discs were hot too but i'd just used them trying to scrape rust off so I didn't count that. I didn't go more than a couple miles though (with three stoplight stops) and it was too hot to touch - yet not dragging so bad I feel the car noticibly slowing down at city speed. That confused me.

Originally Posted By: wheelman1991
I would at least tear the brakes down to see why they are hanging up. The pads and rotors can be reused. If the pads are sticking to the bracket they sit in, you can clean the mounting tabs up with sandpaper or a wire wheel. The rotors can either be left alone and let the pads do the dirty work, or hit with the sandpaper/ wire wheel also, just make sure that you don't put a directional surface on them. Basically give everything like the slide pins for the caliper and the mounting points on the bracket a good cleaning and lube job with silicone paste. If that works, then enjoy a cold beverage of your choice. Otherwise check the calipers and see if they are sticking.


Yah i'm going to tear into them, I was just wondering how much point there is trying to salvage "barely used but sat for a year" brake parts when I know the best answer is just replace again. I'll try to post some pictures if I get a chance.

The fronts I think i'll try turning (or wire brushing) and relubing. I'm more worried about the rear drums - the last rear drums I tried to work on I still haven't fixed right. (that vehicle is still sitting) I don't even care if they brake perfect I just want them to not be hanging right now. In spring i'll have more money and time to mess with it, just not now.

 

[wheelman1991]

The rear brakes are drum? I was half asleep when I read your post. Ok,that sounds like the adjusters for the shoes are too tight. Either that, or the hold down springs are in the wrong place (you said the last set or drum brakes that you worked on, are still screwy.)

 

[columnshift]

I'm going to get up some pictures soon (more for other peoples benefit than my own - so people looking with similar questions can see how mine compares to theirs and how mine worked out) but thought i'd share so far info.

I had the front rotors turned, and although I haven't seasoned or bedded them in yet theyre already stopping WAY better. Didn't touch the pads - theyre a little pitted but i'm assuming it will wear off, theyre too new to want to replace again if I don't have to. So I jacked up the rear to check things - and they seem to be hanging less than they were before. One side turns relatively freely (goes a few rotations after, just a slight sound of contact) the other is very difficult to turn by hand (on just the rotor, the tire provides enough leverage to turn it as does a bar) - it turns 120 degrees then hangs up bad.

Is this like other drum brakes with a little star adjuster thing you can tighten or loosen things with? Is it supposed to auto-adjust or do I have to back it off in this case and then let it auto adjust later? Which way to I try to turn it on that side? I don't have a repair manual handy (I have a manual - just 250 miles away) so I dont have torque specs or anything if needed to mess with any other brake parts FYI.


Also when I was jacking up both sides, the jack slipped on one side (have to do this on a @$*&# slanted driveway) and squooshed down on the brake hose (i think) that runs alongside in front of the rear wheelwell along the bottom of the passenger compartment. It didn't seem to cut it/it's not leaking, but it slightly cut INTO it a little bit - I will have a picture up hopefully tonight to ask people's judgement call on what to do about it. I'd rather not open the brake system or replace something I don't have to.

 

[columnshift]

Pics still coming (computer doesnt want to see phone suddenly) just sharing update... looking at 'how to' videos still leaving me a bit confused, since I don't have specific knowledge of this car. I'm seeing suggestions on other videos that hammering on the brake drum will damage it (which i'm trying to avoid/not wanting to replace brake drums yet, i'm at 120k or so but had great difficulty with my last attempted brake job on an 87 caravan which is still sitting on blocks waiting to finish

) - and I see talk of the star adjuster wheel to loosen off the drums in another video, but it involved some special tool being put in first which I haven't seen before - last time I did it (on the caravan) to get drums off I just used a screwdriver by itself.

Since I can't afford to screw things up or do a heavy brake job i'm waiting for more input from someone who has worked on this specific car.

If I can just get the right rear brake drum backed off (which is dragging) I think the car will run fine at least until spring when i'll have more time and less stress trying to deal with things.

 

[Amirkhat]

Maybe a little air in the lines, also you may want to check the master cylinder. Start the car let it run for about a min, shut it off and press the brake pedal -count how many times it takes until it no longer depresses. Than google that, I don't know that it means lol. Really though, I think if it continues to stay spongy, than you may have a bad break booster.

 

[columnshift]

Sorry took so long, ended up injuring myself on other things. Finally have some pictures:

Here's the front rotors:

They were just rough enough that making hard stops would NOT clean up the surface. So I had them turned - theyre all shiny and new looking on the surface now - they instantly stop better despite my [censored] pads:

That's both sets of pads. Should their rough spots wear down enough and seat to the new rotor okay do you think, or is reusing the pads a no no?


THIS IS THE SQUISHED BRAKE LINE:

The car shifted sideways on the not-best-option jack I was using, and the jack surface compressed the brake hose up under the car body. It was a couple minutes before I could get it off - the rough spot slightly to the right of center is where it pushed the hardest. Despite the slight slick look in a few places, there's no sign of it leaking that I can tell. Obviously i'll be periodically checking it for any signs of further degradation, but is there a likelihood of internal damage that's a danger, or as long as it didn't leak is it probably okay do you think?


PS: I need to adjust the starwheel holding the brake drums in the rear right away from the drum surface if I want to either pull the drum off for inspection, or even stop it from hanging. I'm not quite sure how to do this through the blind tiny access portal - i've seen videos for 'other cars' but don't know if they all work the same or if there is anything at risk of screwing up blindly shoving a screwdriver in there trying to mess with it.

 

[columnshift]

Here's the rear right passenger drum which was sticking up and not wanting to let go.

Would like another opinion on it, but I think it looks okay if I just back off the starwheel to not stick as much and sand out the rust ring inside the drum making removal hard.

Also here's what I mean by "these rotors rust faster than anything", here's just 24 hours after a light sprinkle:

None of my other cars look rusty on the rotors that fast! My saturn has to sit for weeks and be rained on repeatedly to seem to show anything.

 

[mk378]

Is the inside of the drum free of rust where it touches the shoes?

The parking brake cable could be sticking this will cause rear brakes to drag. Work the parking brake a few times with the drum off and observe that the lever on the shoe goes back to the released position each time.

 

[columnshift]

Just sharing updates (responses not needed yet, if I could set this to not-bump this post I would)... my other rear left corner of the brakes since I didn't have that off until now.

Sorry for the blur. I didn't realize til i'm back in it was blurry but that shows what all four corners look like. I didn't see obvious signs of brake cylinder leakage either.

My rear left brake drum couldn't be turned on the machine. If you can see a slight spiral groove that was caused by the cutting tool as it apparently wobbled in the machine. I only wanted to do so to clean up the rusty ridge to prevent it hanging up in the future (it wasnt hanging up now):

There also seems to be a non flat face on it shown by this comparison with a new drum:

I started a separate topic on this, just including in this one for completeness in case other issues show up worth commenting on.

This is what the rear right/sticky drum looked like after it was pulled:

Which cleaned up nicely when I had it turned:

Now the drum slides on and off without hanging up, and the wheel spins without any real problems. (it still seems to spin a hair slower than the other side, but with a clean machined surface and the starwheel all the way back out there is nothing left to even loosen so I don't know if I can do anything about that)



Further responses aren't needed just yet, this is just the 'blog' to document status and condition of what I was working on for the curious/for comparison. I have to reinspect the fronts and will have another few pictures to share of them before I call this done where i'm testing the theory of refinishing discs/drums without changing the pads/shoes and seeing how it works.