Philosophy Behind Extended Euro OCIs

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I have an interesting question about extended OCIs in European cars. I know the type of oil is different, however...

Are they using longer OCIs because they are taking in account the average lifespan of the engine?

For example BMW knows the car will be most likely scrapped between 200k to 300k miles. You are not taking that Bimmer to 500k miles and beyond.

Therefore the OCIs can be lengthened to allow some wear but still make it acceptable for the average service life of a car.

The same reason we have "lifetime" transmission fluids. Yes, there will be more wear, but if the car is going to be scrapped at 300k, the transmission can make it to 300k without a service, we can make that service optional.

Would love to hear BITOGer thoughts.
 
Last I looked, they tend to own their cars for shorter periods of time, drive less miles and pay more for every aspect of car ownership. Thus, the desire to run as long as possible.
 
Large sumps, stricter oil specs, and, to an extent, the requirements for low-sulfur fuel in Europe. Put a 7-quart sump on the cars in my sig, and I'd run them 15k on M1 0w40 until they rusted out.
 
The presumption that the oil sumps are bigger is wrong.

The vast majority hold from 3L to 6L, with the 6L being the diesels engines that produce more soot and need that much to be able to keep going for at least 20K Km under normal driving conditions in between the oil changes.


As for savings...what savings? An oil change + filter is peanuts money here compared to all the taxes you have to pay and the scary price of gas.
 
No one's taking anything besides a semi truck to "500k and beyond". That's pretty much a fantasy. I did have a 340k mile Blazer, but it wasn't on the first engine!
 
Originally Posted By: camrydriver111
For example BMW knows the car will be most likely scrapped between 200k to 300k miles. You are not taking that Bimmer to 500k miles and beyond.


What car are you thinking will go 500k "and beyond" without an engine rebuild? I can tell you none of my vehicles will.
 
Originally Posted By: Andy636
THERE ARE NO LARGER SUMPS FFS !!!


Maybe not all the [censored] economy cars you drive in Romania due to tax reasons, but here in the US we get the big powerful engines almost exclusively. The average Japanese/Korean/USA vehicle will have a 4ish quart sump, whereas the typical European car sold here in the US has, on average, at least a 6 quart sump. My two cars take 6.5 and 8.5 quarts respectively.

I have done a THREE GALLON oil change on a GASOLINE European car.
 
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Originally Posted By: Andy636
THERE ARE NO LARGER SUMPS FFS !!!


??

Many European cars here have 6+ quart sumps as well as oil coolers.

Also, your 3-6 liter sump size translates to basically 3-6 quarts. A 6 quart sump is large IMO.
 
Colt in my sig, 3,25L sump, 20000Km factory OCI (~12500 miles)... crazy for a turbo engine?
Old manual (from 2005) says replace oil after 10000Km and filter every other change, new (2010 manual) just says OCI is 20000Km.
 
My 1994 530i takes 8 quarts. My buddie's m235i takes 7 quarts. It may not be universal, but at least some of the German luxury cars do have quite large sumps.
 
I've always been under the impression that Europe encourages longer OCI for environmental reasons. Due to experience of European history, combined with population density, Europe tends to be ahead of North America in environmental controls and regulations. Getting the most possible out of motor oil is one small example.
 
Originally Posted By: BHopkins
I've always been under the impression that Europe encourages longer OCI for environmental reasons. Due to experience of European history, combined with population density, Europe tends to be ahead of North America in environmental controls and regulations. Getting the most possible out of motor oil is one small example.


They also don't have a quick change oil place at every other street corner like the US does. My Mercedes takes an 8.5 quart oil change and the standard spec is 10k oil changes, used to be 13k.
 
I suspect that cost along with the acceptable durability you cite are the main drivers.
Here, I can get M1 0W-40, which covers most Euro cert bases, for 45.98 for two jugs, less a $5.00 store coupon then less a $24.00 MIR, so more frequent OCIs are no economic issue.
The same oil in the EU would run around $80.00/jug, so even at regular retail with no MIR, the oil is less than a third as costly here than in Europe.
This alone is a powerful incentive to extend drains, just as the very high taxes levied on fuel in Europe bringing very high pump prices are an incentive to find better fuel economy wherever possible, including stinky diesel engines, so common in European cars and so rare in cars here.
As any economist would tell you, if you want less of something, make it more expensive and if you want more of something make it cheaper.
The tax system can be rigged either way.
 
Environment and cost would be the motivation for doing this.

What about my point about the average lifespan of the engine/car?

No need to baby the engine if it's going to be scrapped in 200k to 300k.

Or do you think they found the maximum OCI while simultaneously providing the optimum engine protection.

I know there is always give and take. However, we know that miles vs. wear is not a linear curve. At some point wear rises exponentially.

Do you think they dump the oil at that point where wear rises exponentially, or go a little bit past it because it's acceptable when you consider the lifespan of the car.
 
Reasons :
1 - Oil is more expensive here
2 - Ultra low suplhur fuels
3 - More stringent ACEA oil specifications that allow minimal ring sticking, the oils must be very shear stable, usually the base stocks tend to be higher quality etc...for example you almost certainly won't find a 100% Dino 10w40 oil that meets ACEA specs, usually they are all Synthetic blends at least.

Not everybody in Europe drives a BMW, Audi or Benz, like me in Southern Europe we drive smaller economy cars with small sumps that get good fuel economy, Central and Northrn European countries are richer so more people drive large sedans like the ones made by BMW Audi or MB.
Like my Puegeot 106 with a 1.1 Liter engine that sips fuel , it's a 1999 model and it gets 47 MPG
 
Not sure about Europe as a whole but certainly in the UK the market is very much dominated by fleet cars, hire cars and company cars rather than private purchases. A typical fleet car including prestige German ones will be run for a year or two doing a relatively high annual mileage before being sold on to the trade and a ultimately a private owner. The fleet owners don't want to pay for a service if they can get away with it and certainly not more often than an annual service.
 
A few years ago I was told by Total (the oil company) that the thing that really drives up OCI's in Europe is business new car lease deals.

The market for cars 'for business' has always been high in Europe as they were once seen as a more tax efficient alternative to cash in hand. Business cars are usually leased. If you have an OCI of 18,000 miles, then it minimises the amount of servicing you need to do during the lease period. Car servicing in Europe is relatively expensive, so if you can reduce the overall amount of scheduled servicing needed, the you can minimise the all important lease rate.

When I asked what happens if an engine dies because of poor lubrication, I was told that FF oil quality is set very high to minimise the chance of this happening BUT the OEMs accept that some failures will happen and that overall, it's cheaper to replace a few engines under warranty, that to forego the critical competitive benefits of low lease rates.

Of course, this begs the question, how 'appropriate' is an 18,000 mile OCI after the lease period has expired, the car has been resold into the private sector and the warranty has lapsed! Draw your own conclusions...
 
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