M1 Filter Concern
- Thread starter Big Smoke
- Start date
- Status
Originally Posted By: goodtimes
I believe a leaky bypass valve, maybe like those all made of metal and there is a scratch or something, breaks the vacuum. Because the center tube has drained out in a base down situation. Then there is atmospheric air pressure on the dirty side. The topic here is base down filters and why this one may have drained out. Since the vacuum is broken the oil drains out through the media in a short time by gravity. So the adbv could be perfect and the oil still would drain out of the outer chamber.
It may also matter if filter is clean not full of dirt.
All arm chair engineering but it seems logical.
Also this car has a lot of miles and there has to be some wear on the oil pump, maybe making theses things start to occur more than before.
In order for the oil to leak back down due to a bad oil pump, the ADBV would have to also leak.
The oil inside the engine galleries connected to the center hole of the filter wants to push backwards (due to gravity) and make oil flow towards the center tube, through the media (or leaky bypass valve) and then past the ADBV. So if the bypass valve was leaking it wouldn't really matter because the oil would just go through the media anyway.
I believe a leaky bypass valve, maybe like those all made of metal and there is a scratch or something, breaks the vacuum. Because the center tube has drained out in a base down situation. Then there is atmospheric air pressure on the dirty side. The topic here is base down filters and why this one may have drained out. Since the vacuum is broken the oil drains out through the media in a short time by gravity. So the adbv could be perfect and the oil still would drain out of the outer chamber.
It may also matter if filter is clean not full of dirt.
All arm chair engineering but it seems logical.
Also this car has a lot of miles and there has to be some wear on the oil pump, maybe making theses things start to occur more than before.
In order for the oil to leak back down due to a bad oil pump, the ADBV would have to also leak.
The oil inside the engine galleries connected to the center hole of the filter wants to push backwards (due to gravity) and make oil flow towards the center tube, through the media (or leaky bypass valve) and then past the ADBV. So if the bypass valve was leaking it wouldn't really matter because the oil would just go through the media anyway.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: goodtimes
I believe a leaky bypass valve, maybe like those all made of metal and there is a scratch or something, breaks the vacuum. Because the center tube has drained out in a base down situation. Then there is atmospheric air pressure on the dirty side. The topic here is base down filters and why this one may have drained out. Since the vacuum is broken the oil drains out through the media in a short time by gravity. So the adbv could be perfect and the oil still would drain out of the outer chamber.
It may also matter if filter is clean not full of dirt.
All arm chair engineering but it seems logical.
Also this car has a lot of miles and there has to be some wear on the oil pump, maybe making theses things start to occur more than before.
In order for the oil to leak back down due to a bad oil pump, the ADBV would have to also leak.
The oil inside the engine galleries connected to the center hole of the filter wants to push backwards (due to gravity) and make oil flow towards the center tube, through the media (or leaky bypass valve) and then past the ADBV. So if the bypass valve was leaking it wouldn't really matter because the oil would just go through the media anyway.
Oil pumps wear and produce less flow, and it will take longer to fill a filter chamber in a 300K car compared to a new car. The lobes wear or the sides wear, but they do wear and they are high precision parts. They are precision made for a reason.
In this case the filter is base down, the oil galleries aren't draining into the filter.
It does matter if the bypass valve allows air in or not. Try making a hole in the top of a draining filter, and see almost all of the oil drains out with a perfect sealing adbv. It will drain down to where the media stops.
Originally Posted By: goodtimes
I believe a leaky bypass valve, maybe like those all made of metal and there is a scratch or something, breaks the vacuum. Because the center tube has drained out in a base down situation. Then there is atmospheric air pressure on the dirty side. The topic here is base down filters and why this one may have drained out. Since the vacuum is broken the oil drains out through the media in a short time by gravity. So the adbv could be perfect and the oil still would drain out of the outer chamber.
It may also matter if filter is clean not full of dirt.
All arm chair engineering but it seems logical.
Also this car has a lot of miles and there has to be some wear on the oil pump, maybe making theses things start to occur more than before.
In order for the oil to leak back down due to a bad oil pump, the ADBV would have to also leak.
The oil inside the engine galleries connected to the center hole of the filter wants to push backwards (due to gravity) and make oil flow towards the center tube, through the media (or leaky bypass valve) and then past the ADBV. So if the bypass valve was leaking it wouldn't really matter because the oil would just go through the media anyway.
Oil pumps wear and produce less flow, and it will take longer to fill a filter chamber in a 300K car compared to a new car. The lobes wear or the sides wear, but they do wear and they are high precision parts. They are precision made for a reason.
In this case the filter is base down, the oil galleries aren't draining into the filter.
It does matter if the bypass valve allows air in or not. Try making a hole in the top of a draining filter, and see almost all of the oil drains out with a perfect sealing adbv. It will drain down to where the media stops.
Originally Posted By: goodtimes
Oil pumps wear and produce less flow, and it will take longer to fill a filter chamber in a 300K car compared to a new car. The lobes wear or the sides wear, but they do wear and they are high precision parts. They are precision made for a reason.
Shouldn't really matter if the ADBV is working 100% and the oiling system remains full. The OP was complaining of a long oil light with the M1 filters (which failed the ADBV blow test), but with other filters his oil light would go off much quicker.
Originally Posted By: goodtimes
In this case the filter is base down, the oil galleries aren't draining into the filter.
Depends on the exact location of the filter. In any case, even if the filter is mounted high with the base down (like it is on my '05 Tacoma), if the ADBV is leaking then the filter will drain down. If the bypass valve is leaking, it still won't drain down the filter if the ADBV is working 100%. Only exception to that is if the bypass valve is located in the base of the filter and the filter is also base down, then a leaky bypass valve might allow the filter to drain the same as if a leaky ADBV would.
Originally Posted By: goodtimes
It does matter if the bypass valve allows air in or not. Try making a hole in the top of a draining filter, and see almost all of the oil drains out with a perfect sealing adbv. It will drain down to where the media stops.
Like I said earlier, punching a hole in the can of the filter and allowing atmospheric pressure inside the can is way different than a filter mounted on an engine with no hole punched in the can. It's two totally different scenarios.
The only real way a filter can drain out on the vehicle is if the ADBV is defective.
Oil pumps wear and produce less flow, and it will take longer to fill a filter chamber in a 300K car compared to a new car. The lobes wear or the sides wear, but they do wear and they are high precision parts. They are precision made for a reason.
Shouldn't really matter if the ADBV is working 100% and the oiling system remains full. The OP was complaining of a long oil light with the M1 filters (which failed the ADBV blow test), but with other filters his oil light would go off much quicker.
Originally Posted By: goodtimes
In this case the filter is base down, the oil galleries aren't draining into the filter.
Depends on the exact location of the filter. In any case, even if the filter is mounted high with the base down (like it is on my '05 Tacoma), if the ADBV is leaking then the filter will drain down. If the bypass valve is leaking, it still won't drain down the filter if the ADBV is working 100%. Only exception to that is if the bypass valve is located in the base of the filter and the filter is also base down, then a leaky bypass valve might allow the filter to drain the same as if a leaky ADBV would.
Originally Posted By: goodtimes
It does matter if the bypass valve allows air in or not. Try making a hole in the top of a draining filter, and see almost all of the oil drains out with a perfect sealing adbv. It will drain down to where the media stops.
Like I said earlier, punching a hole in the can of the filter and allowing atmospheric pressure inside the can is way different than a filter mounted on an engine with no hole punched in the can. It's two totally different scenarios.
The only real way a filter can drain out on the vehicle is if the ADBV is defective.
I need a video!! What is going on here!!!!!
It's only a still image from "The Music Man" not a video, but it's what is going on here.
Not the first time. At least when I am wrong, I will say it. I really only want to put up possibilities to the man who asked why his filter drains out, but this is how it usually ends when someone's notion is challenged around here.
^^^ I knew you'd break out sooner or later - LoL.
I'm just telling you how I see it ... so don't take it badly. Sorry, but the changes of a leaky bypass valve causing his problem is pretty much nill. It's the ADBV, and his comment on it failing the blow test pretty much backs that up.
I'm just telling you how I see it ... so don't take it badly. Sorry, but the changes of a leaky bypass valve causing his problem is pretty much nill. It's the ADBV, and his comment on it failing the blow test pretty much backs that up.
most oil pumps these days don't wear so fast after all they are always in oil
Actually the only Fram filter i would use is the ultra..
The old filter is long gone in the garbage and the filters in question are back on the shelf at AA.
Still no oil light with the TG.
Does the ADV not go all the way to the edge on these? Thinking these just aren't good for this particular application.
I plan on retiring this ride at 300k so not too many oil changes left. Guess I'll just stick with a TG or XG from here on out. Planning on a 3.6L Dodge next with a cartridge filter.
Still no oil light with the TG.
Does the ADV not go all the way to the edge on these? Thinking these just aren't good for this particular application.
I plan on retiring this ride at 300k so not too many oil changes left. Guess I'll just stick with a TG or XG from here on out. Planning on a 3.6L Dodge next with a cartridge filter.
Originally Posted By: bchannell
OK, I know we're all ocd about oil related stuff here, but I gotta tell ya, the day I go to WM and start blowing on filters, I'll turn in my BITOG decoder ring and call it a day!
Be a closet filter blower and wait until you get home.
OK, I know we're all ocd about oil related stuff here, but I gotta tell ya, the day I go to WM and start blowing on filters, I'll turn in my BITOG decoder ring and call it a day!
Be a closet filter blower and wait until you get home.
Originally Posted By: bchannell
OK, I know we're all ocd about oil related stuff here, but I gotta tell ya, the day I go to WM and start blowing on filters, I'll turn in my BITOG decoder ring and call it a day!
I don't care who you are, that's funny!!. LOL!
OK, I know we're all ocd about oil related stuff here, but I gotta tell ya, the day I go to WM and start blowing on filters, I'll turn in my BITOG decoder ring and call it a day!
I don't care who you are, that's funny!!. LOL!
Last edited:
+1
- Status
Similar threads
