Is EVERYTHING Vdub now direct injected?
Oil choice for turbo engines?
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wemay
Site Donor 2023
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Is EVERYTHING Vdub now direct injected?
I believe the last engine available without D.i. was the 2.0 Crossflow 8v from the Jetta. It has been discontinued from what I've read, in favor of the 1.4 TSi (T-GDi).
Is EVERYTHING Vdub now direct injected?
I believe the last engine available without D.i. was the 2.0 Crossflow 8v from the Jetta. It has been discontinued from what I've read, in favor of the 1.4 TSi (T-GDi).
DI = more power & mpg + less emissions. Hard to design a new(er) engine without it.
I'm using M1 0w40 in my 2016 1.8T Sportwagen.
First change was at 5400 mi. I'll probably go to 11-12k ish for the next one, then get on the 10k interval starting at 20k miles (I want the round number to follow long-term, but wanted to do a shorter 5k-ish first OCI)
I'm also planning on using LC20. It might help with valve deposits and should help with "extended" 10k OCIs.
I hope M1 will have another rebate when I need more oil. Can't be beat when its $12/5qt for VW 502 oil.
I'm using M1 0w40 in my 2016 1.8T Sportwagen.
First change was at 5400 mi. I'll probably go to 11-12k ish for the next one, then get on the 10k interval starting at 20k miles (I want the round number to follow long-term, but wanted to do a shorter 5k-ish first OCI)
I'm also planning on using LC20. It might help with valve deposits and should help with "extended" 10k OCIs.
I hope M1 will have another rebate when I need more oil. Can't be beat when its $12/5qt for VW 502 oil.
In my two VW 2.0 Turbos I am running Castrol 0W40.
The '07 Jetta I change every 10,000kms or yearly whatever comes first. Obviously way out of warranty. Low Kms for the age and It is the FSI motor and are a little hard on oil.
The '16 Tiguan is 15,000kms OCI as per VW.
Other VW 502 spec options that are readily available are M1 0W40, Castrol 0W30 and 5w40 and Valvoline 0W40 and 5w40. Pennzoil also has Euro oils but they are a unicorn around here, never seen them
on any shelves.
The '07 Jetta I change every 10,000kms or yearly whatever comes first. Obviously way out of warranty. Low Kms for the age and It is the FSI motor and are a little hard on oil.
The '16 Tiguan is 15,000kms OCI as per VW.
Other VW 502 spec options that are readily available are M1 0W40, Castrol 0W30 and 5w40 and Valvoline 0W40 and 5w40. Pennzoil also has Euro oils but they are a unicorn around here, never seen them
on any shelves.
Originally Posted By: Phishin
I'm gonna disagree with the M1 0w40 recommendations.
I've read many people here agree, and seen some data, that high calcium only oils are not the best for turbo's.
Using an oil with a balance of calcium and magnesium detergents provides fewer turbo issues (deposits, coking, etc.) than a calcium rich oil like M1 0w40.
I believe TEOST results support this hypothesis as well.
Is there evidence of failing turbos as a result of using m1 0w40?
Being a DI engine, the OP should be more concerned with valve deposits than with turbo deposits, IMO.
I'm gonna disagree with the M1 0w40 recommendations.
I've read many people here agree, and seen some data, that high calcium only oils are not the best for turbo's.
Using an oil with a balance of calcium and magnesium detergents provides fewer turbo issues (deposits, coking, etc.) than a calcium rich oil like M1 0w40.
I believe TEOST results support this hypothesis as well.
Is there evidence of failing turbos as a result of using m1 0w40?
Being a DI engine, the OP should be more concerned with valve deposits than with turbo deposits, IMO.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Phishin
I'm gonna disagree with the M1 0w40 recommendations.
I've read many people here agree, and seen some data, that high calcium only oils are not the best for turbo's.
Using an oil with a balance of calcium and magnesium detergents provides fewer turbo issues (deposits, coking, etc.) than a calcium rich oil like M1 0w40.
I believe TEOST results support this hypothesis as well.
Is there evidence of failing turbos as a result of using m1 0w40?
Being a DI engine, the OP should be more concerned with valve deposits than with turbo deposits, IMO.
The fact that M1 0w40 does not carry the BMW LL-01 cert anymore because of the difficulty in passing te n20 engine test would tell me to beware, if I also had a DI turbo engine like the n20.
And I normally run mobil1 products.
Originally Posted By: Phishin
I'm gonna disagree with the M1 0w40 recommendations.
I've read many people here agree, and seen some data, that high calcium only oils are not the best for turbo's.
Using an oil with a balance of calcium and magnesium detergents provides fewer turbo issues (deposits, coking, etc.) than a calcium rich oil like M1 0w40.
I believe TEOST results support this hypothesis as well.
Is there evidence of failing turbos as a result of using m1 0w40?
Being a DI engine, the OP should be more concerned with valve deposits than with turbo deposits, IMO.
The fact that M1 0w40 does not carry the BMW LL-01 cert anymore because of the difficulty in passing te n20 engine test would tell me to beware, if I also had a DI turbo engine like the n20.
And I normally run mobil1 products.
Originally Posted By: Bryanccfshr
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Phishin
I'm gonna disagree with the M1 0w40 recommendations.
I've read many people here agree, and seen some data, that high calcium only oils are not the best for turbo's.
Using an oil with a balance of calcium and magnesium detergents provides fewer turbo issues (deposits, coking, etc.) than a calcium rich oil like M1 0w40.
I believe TEOST results support this hypothesis as well.
Is there evidence of failing turbos as a result of using m1 0w40?
Being a DI engine, the OP should be more concerned with valve deposits than with turbo deposits, IMO.
The fact that M1 0w40 does not carry the BMW LL-01 cert anymore because of the difficulty in passing te n20 engine test would tell me to beware, if I also had a DI turbo engine like the n20.
And I normally run mobil1 products.
I am no mobil fanboy, but we've beaten this one to death in another thread. We really dont know if it's because it has difficulty passing it or of it's a timing issue resulting from changes to the test protocol.
Also, the OP's engine does not call for the LL-01 spec.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Phishin
I'm gonna disagree with the M1 0w40 recommendations.
I've read many people here agree, and seen some data, that high calcium only oils are not the best for turbo's.
Using an oil with a balance of calcium and magnesium detergents provides fewer turbo issues (deposits, coking, etc.) than a calcium rich oil like M1 0w40.
I believe TEOST results support this hypothesis as well.
Is there evidence of failing turbos as a result of using m1 0w40?
Being a DI engine, the OP should be more concerned with valve deposits than with turbo deposits, IMO.
The fact that M1 0w40 does not carry the BMW LL-01 cert anymore because of the difficulty in passing te n20 engine test would tell me to beware, if I also had a DI turbo engine like the n20.
And I normally run mobil1 products.
I am no mobil fanboy, but we've beaten this one to death in another thread. We really dont know if it's because it has difficulty passing it or of it's a timing issue resulting from changes to the test protocol.
Also, the OP's engine does not call for the LL-01 spec.
The Passat calls for Mobil 1 0w-40, at 10K intervals. Normally I would think this is too long, but I drive 90% highway.
I try to educate myself. Thank you all for the replies.
I try to educate myself. Thank you all for the replies.
Mobil 1 0w40 or Castrol Edge 0w40 at 10.000 miles or one year is no problem, even in a turbo'd engines. This is not the 70s where with turbo engines you had to use Dino 20w50 that would shear like mad and had to be changed constantly
Really depends on the engine, direct injection or not...
You can check my uoa for the 1,5L turbo engine (Colt in my sig) with Petronas Syntium 7000, good results but I suspect the engine is super easy on oil.
You can check my uoa for the 1,5L turbo engine (Colt in my sig) with Petronas Syntium 7000, good results but I suspect the engine is super easy on oil.
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
The Passat calls for Mobil 1 0w-40,
Interesting.
The Passat calls for Mobil 1 0w-40,
Interesting.
4WD
$50 site donor 2024
Just talked lubes with my buddy in a Porsche club - you know what they run along with AMG and a host of other HP cars/trucks
4WD
$50 site donor 2024
+1 ...
Pretty sick video stuff out there on VW's GDI intake valves ...
And my Porsche buddy mentioned - his son has one in a bind now - they want $800 to clean out - lots of money for a student.
(No doubt who will come to rescue)
Pretty sick video stuff out there on VW's GDI intake valves ...
And my Porsche buddy mentioned - his son has one in a bind now - they want $800 to clean out - lots of money for a student.
(No doubt who will come to rescue)
Last edited:
wemay
Site Donor 2023
Our 2013 Hyundai 2.0T calls for only SM/GF-4. We've used Syn/Blnds/and Dino (mostly Dino) SN/GF-5 since 2012 when purchased. It has been flawless.
I would have no issue using what is spec'd by VW/Audi.
I would have no issue using what is spec'd by VW/Audi.
Originally Posted By: Phishin
I'm gonna disagree with the M1 0w40 recommendations.
I've read many people here agree, and seen some data, that high calcium only oils are not the best for turbo's.
Using an oil with a balance of calcium and magnesium detergents provides fewer turbo issues (deposits, coking, etc.) than a calcium rich oil like M1 0w40.
I believe TEOST results support this hypothesis as well.
Ward's says this is a DIT engine, so I would be very concerned about Low Speed Pre-Ignition (LSPI).
LSPI: A KNOCK ON THE NEWEST ENGINES
There is some evidence that a low calcium oil can help avoid LSPI, so I have been using M1 5W30...generally the standard variant, tried ESP in the second to last change and did not like how hot my engine ran with it. Just put plain ol' M1 back in recently and the temps are back to normal.
FWIW...
I'm gonna disagree with the M1 0w40 recommendations.
I've read many people here agree, and seen some data, that high calcium only oils are not the best for turbo's.
Using an oil with a balance of calcium and magnesium detergents provides fewer turbo issues (deposits, coking, etc.) than a calcium rich oil like M1 0w40.
I believe TEOST results support this hypothesis as well.
Ward's says this is a DIT engine, so I would be very concerned about Low Speed Pre-Ignition (LSPI).
LSPI: A KNOCK ON THE NEWEST ENGINES
There is some evidence that a low calcium oil can help avoid LSPI, so I have been using M1 5W30...generally the standard variant, tried ESP in the second to last change and did not like how hot my engine ran with it. Just put plain ol' M1 back in recently and the temps are back to normal.
FWIW...
Last edited:
Just curious, do all DI engine mfgs acknowledge that LSPI is an issue and agree that low calcium helps prevent it?
Of course, they could just be ignorant and sticking their heads in the sand untill called out on it. I am just asking if we'vw seen any reaction from the engine mfgs to these various industry publications.
Of course, they could just be ignorant and sticking their heads in the sand untill called out on it. I am just asking if we'vw seen any reaction from the engine mfgs to these various industry publications.
wemay
Site Donor 2023
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Just curious, do all DI engine mfgs acknowledge that LSPI is an issue and agree that low calcium helps prevent it?
Of course, they could just be ignorant and sticking their heads in the sand untill called out on it. I am just asking if we'vw seen any reaction from the engine mfgs to these various industry publications.
Not sure about the engine mfgs, but SAE, Pennzoil and Chevron seem to believe there's a relationship...
SAE study
http://papers.sae.org/2014-32-0092/
Chevron Ornite
https://www.oronite.com/products/lspi.asp
The Role of the Lubricant in LSPI
"Many factors have been demonstrated to impact LSPI, including: engine designs, fuel composition, and lubricant composition. On the lubricant side, the most noticeable impact has been from the detergent chemistry. Oils with higher concentrations of calcium, which is found in many detergent systems, have been shown to increase the frequency of LSPI."
Pennzoil
Pennzoil's Q & A, the topic came up again and they have answered it this way. Remember, SOPUS oils are rather laden with CaSa...
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3836844/Pennzoil_Answers-Complete_Prot
Q: Could you address operators of GDI-Turbo vehicles regarding the effects of certain additives such as calcium and their impact on LSPI (low speed pre-ignition)? There's much discussion and concern by operators of these vehicles that Pennzoil's additive packages are predisposed to LSPI as compared to other brands.
A: Low speed pre-ignition (LSPI) is more a phenomenon of engine design – and as you mentioned, occurs more frequently in gasoline direct injection (GDI) turbocharged engines. It is really a phenomenon for prototype or experimental engines that are still in the Research & Development phase, and oils with high levels of calcium-based detergents can increase LSPI frequency. HOWEVER, by the time the engine is fully designed and released to the market, it must be compatible with the available motor oils in the marketplace. Thus said, there is no need for concern.
Just curious, do all DI engine mfgs acknowledge that LSPI is an issue and agree that low calcium helps prevent it?
Of course, they could just be ignorant and sticking their heads in the sand untill called out on it. I am just asking if we'vw seen any reaction from the engine mfgs to these various industry publications.
Not sure about the engine mfgs, but SAE, Pennzoil and Chevron seem to believe there's a relationship...
SAE study
http://papers.sae.org/2014-32-0092/
Chevron Ornite
https://www.oronite.com/products/lspi.asp
The Role of the Lubricant in LSPI
"Many factors have been demonstrated to impact LSPI, including: engine designs, fuel composition, and lubricant composition. On the lubricant side, the most noticeable impact has been from the detergent chemistry. Oils with higher concentrations of calcium, which is found in many detergent systems, have been shown to increase the frequency of LSPI."
Pennzoil
Pennzoil's Q & A, the topic came up again and they have answered it this way. Remember, SOPUS oils are rather laden with CaSa...
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3836844/Pennzoil_Answers-Complete_Prot
Q: Could you address operators of GDI-Turbo vehicles regarding the effects of certain additives such as calcium and their impact on LSPI (low speed pre-ignition)? There's much discussion and concern by operators of these vehicles that Pennzoil's additive packages are predisposed to LSPI as compared to other brands.
A: Low speed pre-ignition (LSPI) is more a phenomenon of engine design – and as you mentioned, occurs more frequently in gasoline direct injection (GDI) turbocharged engines. It is really a phenomenon for prototype or experimental engines that are still in the Research & Development phase, and oils with high levels of calcium-based detergents can increase LSPI frequency. HOWEVER, by the time the engine is fully designed and released to the market, it must be compatible with the available motor oils in the marketplace. Thus said, there is no need for concern.
Thanks. Sounds like Pennzoil thinks it's a non issue in production engines.
wemay
Site Donor 2023
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Thanks. Sounds like Pennzoil thinks it's a non issue in production engines.
Yes, they give that impression. But it has been an issue in some production engines. I know the first model year Veloster Turbo suffered from this and have read of other Mfgrs having similar issues (can't remember off hand which ones [Subaru maybe?]). Pennzoil also uses significant CaSa in their formulations...
Thanks. Sounds like Pennzoil thinks it's a non issue in production engines.
Yes, they give that impression. But it has been an issue in some production engines. I know the first model year Veloster Turbo suffered from this and have read of other Mfgrs having similar issues (can't remember off hand which ones [Subaru maybe?]). Pennzoil also uses significant CaSa in their formulations...
So, does that mean steer clear of SOPUS oils or....
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