Honda GCV160 timing belt

[Ausfahrt]

Last fall, just after changing the oil in my Honda powered lawn mower I experienced a serious timing belt issue that I documented on an existing thread here:

bitog


I probably should have started a new thread then so I will attempt to make amends by starting one now that finishes the story.

The timing belt on the mower engine came off of the cam sprocket but did not break. When my property manager took it to our local small engine shop this past winter, they told him (us) that the cases would need to be split and that the cost would be $300+.

This mower only cost $280 so that was out of the question. I did some research and ordered a new and improved valve cover with a built in cam belt retainer. It seems as though I am not the only one who has experienced this problem.

Here is a pic of both valve covers.....

And here pic is one of the old valve cover.....

And another of the new valve cover featuring the new belt retainer.

This also involved making sure that the cam & crank were in time. This turned out to be a lot easier than the internet would lead you to believe. Basically, all you need to do is move the flywheel to where the magnets meet the magneto. You can see the magnet in the flywheel just to the right of the spark plug lead where it goes to the magneto here.

Then all you need to do is line up the marks on the cam sprocket to the head. It's hard to see the marks here but it really isn't difficult.

So far it runs better than ever and I think and hope that this is a permanent solution but only time will tell.

 

[JTK]

Thanks for the follow up on that! I remember your thread because in all the years I've been following Honda GCs, this was the first and only T-belt related issue I'd seen on them.

FWIW, I've got a 1999 model year GC that still runs like new, but I rarely use it anymore. It saw a lot of use for years though.

That ~$300 repair quote is laughable. Pretty sure you can buy replacement GCs for less than that.

 

[crazyoildude]

All the lawn equipment i have owned were all Briggs and stratton and i never had an engine related problem my snow blower is a 1966 heavy duty allis charmers and it still runs great.. I have many mowers all B&S engines with no issues. Although my housekeeper now does my lawns and she seems to break the wheels off of everything the engines run great!
Everything lawn related runs on strait 30

 

[jeepman3071]

I've seen that problem a few times on the GC engines. That $300 quote is crazy. With the new cover it shouldn't be a problem again.

 

[Ausfahrt]

Originally Posted By: JTK
Thanks for the follow up on that! I remember your thread because in all the years I've been following Honda GCs, this was the first and only T-belt related issue I'd seen on them.

FWIW, I've got a 1999 model year GC that still runs like new, but I rarely use it anymore. It saw a lot of use for years though.

That ~$300 repair quote is laughable. Pretty sure you can buy replacement GCs for less than that.


Yeah, I think that $300 was their "we don't want to do it" price.

 

[ironman_gq]

I still don't understand what was wrong with the old pushrod setup that rarely if ever had problems. Timing belts are for small car engines, not undermaintained OPE.

 

[jeepman3071]

Originally Posted By: ironman_gq
I still don't understand what was wrong with the old pushrod setup that rarely if ever had problems. Timing belts are for small car engines, not undermaintained OPE.


I agree, but to be fair I've had to do a lot of valve adjustments on other OHV engines such as Briggs and Stratton inteks and the newer Kohler engines. Many of the engines wouldn't even start the valves were so far out of adjustment. I've seen many OHC Hondas with tons of hours and no issues. The few that I have seen have had a similar problem to the OP. I've never even replaced a timing belt on one of these.

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: bigdreama
When my property manager took it to our local small engine shop this past winter, they told him (us) that the cases would need to be split and that the cost would be $300+.


Did you end up having to split the case halves like the shop said ?

 

[Ausfahrt]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: bigdreama
When my property manager took it to our local small engine shop this past winter, they told him (us) that the cases would need to be split and that the cost would be $300+.


Did you end up having to split the case halves like the shop said ?


No, since the timing belt didn't break I was able to just slip it back onto the cam sprocket. After I received the new valve cover, I had the engine up and running in twenty minutes!

 

[ironman_gq]

Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Originally Posted By: ironman_gq
I still don't understand what was wrong with the old pushrod setup that rarely if ever had problems. Timing belts are for small car engines, not undermaintained OPE.


I agree, but to be fair I've had to do a lot of valve adjustments on other OHV engines such as Briggs and Stratton inteks and the newer Kohler engines. Many of the engines wouldn't even start the valves were so far out of adjustment. I've seen many OHC Hondas with tons of hours and no issues. The few that I have seen have had a similar problem to the OP. I've never even replaced a timing belt on one of these.


But the Honda GX engines rarely fall out of adjustment, why they went to the belt on these I can't figure out. I've got a fleet of GX motors, some with 4-5000 hours and other than wearing rings out and leaky seals they work great. Most of the OHV engines that have had valve clearance issues was due to valve seat recession and they got tight, only found one that loosened up and that was because the lock nut backed off. None were Honda's though. Some were Briggs, some were Chinese clones, a couple Tecumsehs in there as well.

 

[ARB1977]

I didn't know the 160 had a timing belt. I bought my Troy bilt with the 160 back in 07. Runs like a top.

 

[Lubener]

Timing belt on a small engine sitting in the oil? Sounds like junk to me. I'll stick with my B&S.

 

[Colt45ws]

Originally Posted By: ironman_gq
Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Originally Posted By: ironman_gq
I still don't understand what was wrong with the old pushrod setup that rarely if ever had problems. Timing belts are for small car engines, not undermaintained OPE.


I agree, but to be fair I've had to do a lot of valve adjustments on other OHV engines such as Briggs and Stratton inteks and the newer Kohler engines. Many of the engines wouldn't even start the valves were so far out of adjustment. I've seen many OHC Hondas with tons of hours and no issues. The few that I have seen have had a similar problem to the OP. I've never even replaced a timing belt on one of these.


But the Honda GX engines rarely fall out of adjustment, why they went to the belt on these I can't figure out. I've got a fleet of GX motors, some with 4-5000 hours and other than wearing rings out and leaky seals they work great. Most of the OHV engines that have had valve clearance issues was due to valve seat recession and they got tight, only found one that loosened up and that was because the lock nut backed off. None were Honda's though. Some were Briggs, some were Chinese clones, a couple Tecumsehs in there as well.


We had a 8HP Briggs fall so far out of adjustment you couldn't even hardly pull the cord. I happened to be taking small engines in HS and I bought it to school to find the rockers had practically fallen off. It had only been run once at that point.

 

[Audioquest]

Originally Posted By: Lubener
Timing belt on a small engine sitting in the oil? Sounds like junk to me. I'll stick with my B&S.


You do that.

 

[artbuc]

Originally Posted By: Lubener
Timing belt on a small engine sitting in the oil? Sounds like junk to me. I'll stick with my B&S.


Yeah, Honda OPE engines are well known to be unreliable junk.

 

[JTK]

My 17yr/old GCV160 has had some oil changes, a few air filters and 1 spark plug change in 17yrs. Starts with 1-2 light pulls. Such a piece of junk.

 

[punisher]

Fairly sure Honda did their homework on the GC\GCV\GSV series engines. GCVs have been around for 18 years with no major changes. An OHC/timing belt engine is also used on some Honda EU series inverter generators.

Those nice cast GSV series cast aluminum valve covers can be used in place of the stamped GCV covers, ditto on the recoil start.

 

[Hokiefyd]

I just did a GC160/GCV160 hybrid project. I'll post about it here, soon. Anyway, the GC has the valve cover with the belt retainer while neither of my GCVs do. I figured that was because the GC belt sits vertically. I bet it will keep the belt on, though.

To those who can't believe the engine has a timing belt, you'd just love the simplicity of this engine. The belt is designed to be wet, and it's indeed the mechanism by which the valve and camshaft area gets lubricated. The belt doesn't physically sit in the oil, but it does get directly lubricated by the governor sprocket and governor ring on the crankshaft, and it carries that oil to the top of the cylinder.

The timing belt system removes a ton of metal from the system (but Briggs has already moved to resin cam gears in many cases anyway). It reduces noise, it reduces weight, and it reduces drag. There's a super simple and compact cam at the top of the cylinder with just one cam lobe that operates both the intake and exhaust rocker arms. There are about 10 basic moving parts in the whole engine.

My remaining one GCV is 13 years old, and this GC/GCV hybrid I just made (using the GC's original timing belt) is 14/13 years old.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Some cars now have oiled timing belts.

 

[JTK]

Originally Posted By: Miller88
Some cars now have oiled timing belts.


Hate to go too far OT, but which?