New AAA Top Tier study. It's worth it.

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Good read!!

The article said the gas was from south Texas. I wonder if the testing was done by Southwest Research here in San Antonio? They have a huge ISO engine testing facility.
 
I saw one of the blog type articles MSN puts up, but never got back to find the actual article or report. Thanks for posting!

In my area, ARCO is 15-20 cents per gallon cheaper than the Chevron/Mobil/Shell stations. The only problem with going to them is it seems there is always an issue with the pump card reader being unable to read the card, sticking buttons while entering the PIN, slow to authorize or no receipt paper. It's sort of like the Walmart of gas stations I think. But, my cars run fine on it when I do use it.
 
Wow, I had no idea a big name like Sunoco wasn't a Top Tier brand. Disappointing. Time to take my direct-injected Honda elsewhere.

A company like Shamrock is but Sunoco isn't? Strange.
 
Interesting study. Thanks for posting this. The article claimed 19x fewer deposits for top tier gas. The actual report (see page 16) did indicate a much larger difference between Top Tier and nonTT for intake valves; but for the other two areas mentioned (piston top deposits and cylinder head deposits), TT gas was only slightly better for piston top deposits, and actually worse for cylinder head deposits.

I use TT gas myself. This study documents that it is cleaner. Overall, if you were to throw in all three areas together and average them out, you would surely have fewer deposits with TT gas. But claims like nonTT gas causes "19 times more engine deposits" that are not seriously qualified, probably shouldn't be made.

Another interesting point was that among the three TT fuels tested, each one was cleanest in one of those three areas. None was consistently cleaner than the other two. To be expected, I suppose...

Let me ask: are intake valves the only area of concern, for clean gas? Is it the most troublesome part of the engine to clean? Perhaps there was a reason why that part was the focus of the article's concern.
 
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Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
Wow, I had no idea a big name like Sunoco wasn't a Top Tier brand. Disappointing. Time to take my new-ish direct-injected Honda elsewhere.


It doesn't mean Sunoco is necessarily any lower quality than the listed Top Tier brands, but of course there is no way to know. I don't know what the cost for certification is, but I've heard its quite high. They may simply have chosen not to get the certification. With this becoming more and more emphasized, I think at some point, almost every available name brand will be forced to get certification or risk losing business. As of right now, I doubt that even 10% of the population even knows what Top Tier is and maybe 1/3 of that care. Most people still buy on price and location and will for some time.

Why would Top Tier make a difference regarding direct injection, if you're referring to carbon build-up on valves? My 05 Civic made it to 300k miles on 90% Sunoco gas with no fuel or engine system problems. I have very few places to buy Top Tier in my area. I'm lucky if I can just get a name brand, like Sunoco, instead of some unbranded convenience store stuff which is 90% of the market around here unfortunately.
 
I use Sunoco a lot in my truck (with a tank of Shell every other month or so), wifes car usually gets Exxon or Valero, but sometimes Sunoco. Neither of these vehicles are DI, and I use a fuel cleaner every oil change.
When the Sunoco opened about a year ago, it was usually $0.07-0.10 cheaper a gallon, now it is usually right around the same price within $0.01.
There is a Kroger with a gas station and a Wal-Mart with a gas station opening near me in a few months, but neither of those are top tier either, but maybe that will force Valero/Exxon stations to drop their price some.
 
Originally Posted By: dlayman
Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
Wow, I had no idea a big name like Sunoco wasn't a Top Tier brand. Disappointing. Time to take my new-ish direct-injected Honda elsewhere.


It doesn't mean Sunoco is necessarily any lower quality than the listed Top Tier brands, but of course there is no way to know. I don't know what the cost for certification is, but I've heard its quite high. They may simply have chosen not to get the certification. With this becoming more and more emphasized, I think at some point, almost every available name brand will be forced to get certification or risk losing business. As of right now, I doubt that even 10% of the population even knows what Top Tier is and maybe 1/3 of that care. Most people still buy on price and location and will for some time.

Why would Top Tier make a difference regarding direct injection, if you're referring to carbon build-up on valves? My 05 Civic made it to 300k miles on 90% Sunoco gas with no fuel or engine system problems. I have very few places to buy Top Tier in my area. I'm lucky if I can just get a name brand, like Sunoco, instead of some unbranded convenience store stuff which is 90% of the market around here unfortunately.


Good point. That is another problem with this study. It identifies the TT gasolines, but does not identify the Non-TT fuels used. Sunoco has a good reputation and I used it regularly when I lived in an area where there were stations. I never had a problem with it.

The no-name brand convenience store gas is probably ok to use once in a while. I am not an ARCO fanboy by any means, but the reason I identified them is because they are the same cost as the no-name places in my area. If I am going to go to a "big brand" place I have to drive a bit further. So, given similar costs, this study makes my decision for me when deciding ARCO vs. Fastrip vs. Bob's Gas.
 
In this area, Quik Trip, Shell, BP and now Citgo same price or less than the non TT cert stations. No down side, makes it an easy choice.

Thanks for posting.
 
Originally Posted By: paulri
TT gas was only slightly better for piston top deposits, and actually worse for cylinder head deposits.



I found that odd as well; I've been running Valero Top Tier for a few thousand miles, 87 octane, and it has reduced the hot weather ping in my car slightly. It also gets documented 1 mpg mileage increase compared to Kroger gasoline I usually buy.
 
Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
Wow, I had no idea a big name like Sunoco wasn't a Top Tier brand. Disappointing. Time to take my direct-injected Honda elsewhere.

A company like Shamrock is but Sunoco isn't? Strange.


Valero (the parent of the old Shamrock brand which is being phased out for the Valero name) is a far larger company than Sunoco, so why be surprised? At one time (maybe still) Valero was the single largest volume gasoline producer in the US.

And again, just because Sunoco (or any other company) chooses not to pay the extortio^H^H^H^H^H licensing fee to be permitted to use the top tier logo, it doesn't mean its inferior in any way whatsoever.
 
See mention of premium fuel for test. Wonder what percent of drivers use that? I don't at all. Also, chemicals in these add packs are in some cases what comes in a bottle. I don't buy Chevron - but do buy Techron for 6/$20 at Costco since it works well in boat motors (in OEM bottles) and small engines + twice a year in vehicles just for a change in chemistry (reading from SME) ...
 
As said by not saying what gas they used that was a "problem" and the company that licenses "Top Tier" paying for this, I have to call bull on it.

"The Michigan-based Center for Quality Assurance runs the program and charges gas stations a fee to use the Top Tier seal of approval. Two executives of the group declined to disclose the fee."

So pay up or we'll tell people your gas without our sticker "may" do bad things to you.
 
Turkey Hill stations in the NE used to be Top Tier until the chain was bought out by Kroger. They dropped the Top Tier designation almost immediately after the acquisition. One of the TH staff at headquarters near where I lived told me that the "new powers that be" felt that the cost was not worth it and that drivers could care less. So be it.
 
Thanks to the OP for posting this especially the link to the report.

All this time, I thought I was cleaning my combustion chamber and piston tops and I wasn't!

I was about to raise the question: what does this mean about the combustion chamber cleaning claims made by the high dosage one tank PEA cleaners?

But then I remembered ChrisFix's underwhelming results when he tested several of them.

I have to say, this changes my perception of the claims these products have been making. Relative to non top tier, top tier and one tank products are cleaning intake valves but don't seem to be doing what they appear to be claiming for the combustion chamber.
 
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