That's unfortunate...or maybe bypass filtration?

[WellOiled]

Originally Posted By: Eddie
Did the opening happen because the pleats were forced opened by hand? Ed

Eddie - the pleats were likely forced open by high differential pressure across the filter element. No fault of the OP.

 

[AntsinmyEyes]

thats not the first time this fram ultra cartridge filter has failed. I only use the Hengst made a/c delcos for 6000 miles in mine. Theyve always looked perfect and not crushed or torn.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3367488/Fram_XG9018_@_~11,600_-_media_#Post3367488

 

[funflyer]

Originally Posted By: Sayjac

I thought and am under the impression that all Ultra boxes including cartridges are sealed, not to be opened and would show if they had been tampered with prior to purchase? Not sure of the point unless you're implying that's the cause of the OP's anecdote.

That aside, iirc your noted examination showed that many of the Fram cartridges were not made to the spec of the oem and had fitment issues.

Yet another example of the Ultra cartridge not being to the same standard as the Ultra spin on. Seen too many Ultra cartridge issues posted here, and with the many other viable quality choices, Ultra cartridges not one 'for me'.



The boxes open easily from the bottom, only the top has the tape.

Also, I was making a point that the media fibers can be damaged just by handling the filter improperly unlike the spin-on filters. We can only assume that the OPs filter was in perfect condition when it was installed but being a cartridge who knows.

 

[SilverC6]

OEM only for this application.

FRAM is just not the choice for many cartridge applications.

I have been using FRAM Ultra cartridge filters (XG9972) in my Camry with good success.

I don't do extended OCI's though.

For the OP's filter, that media has got to be all through that engine.

If I owned it, I'd hold my breath every time I started that car.

 

[linksep]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
A QUART in 10K is "next to no" oil?


What would you consider to be extremely low oil consumption for a 180,000 mile engine on 10K mile OCI?

 

[linksep]

Originally Posted By: Eddie
Did the opening happen because the pleats were forced opened by hand? Ed


The first pic you can clearly see steel mesh backer, that is unmolested as it came out of the filter housing. There is no reason during installation or removal to be rough with (or even really touch) the media.
The second pic I did bend the backer/media against the crimp to really look down in the valley where the damage was visible. I was trying to get a good look without causing any additional or artificial damage.

 

[linksep]

After posting and reading a few responses I went and dug the filter out of the local and state approved filter disposal receptacle... I opened it up by hand and tore several pleats worth of material off then tried to shine a very bright flashlight through it (while pulled flat...no pics, not worth taking pics). I could see some light through some portions of the media, but it appeared more plugged than I would have expected (I did NOT attempt to wick or squeeze most of the oil out of the filter element).

I did open the housing and inspect the new filter with about 130 miles on it and I was able to see a LOT more light through it using the same flashlight, also there were no visible tears or other defects.

I think I'll inspect this filter every 2500 (which is about once a month... I might not be able to check it that often) and either replace at 10K with the oil or try to go two OCI again if it's not blackout dark at 10K or 15K during regular inspection. I really don't want to have to do math and/or take notes when to do an OCI or FCI... OCI at 160K, 170K, 180K is easy enough for me, FCI at same or even number I can handle [when dropping 4 zeros for you OCD AR types] (160K, 180K, 200K).

 

[Motorking]

Originally Posted By: WobblyElvis
That filter should have taken those miles easily. He drove 120 miles a day on the highway. Doesn't get easier than that. In the 70's filters were used for two OCI's up to 15,000 miles all the time. That filter is either made of poop or it was subjected to conditions it was not designed for.


Have to call [censored] here buddy. I am 59, been working as a professional tech since 17 yrs old. Nobody used filters for 15k miles in the 70's, in fact most everyone changed oil and filter at 2-3k intervals, no longer.

 

[Motorking]

Originally Posted By: linksep
After posting and reading a few responses I went and dug the filter out of the local and state approved filter disposal receptacle... I opened it up by hand and tore several pleats worth of material off then tried to shine a very bright flashlight through it (while pulled flat...no pics, not worth taking pics). I could see some light through some portions of the media, but it appeared more plugged than I would have expected (I did NOT attempt to wick or squeeze most of the oil out of the filter element).

I did open the housing and inspect the new filter with about 130 miles on it and I was able to see a LOT more light through it using the same flashlight, also there were no visible tears or other defects.

I think I'll inspect this filter every 2500 (which is about once a month... I might not be able to check it that often) and either replace at 10K with the oil or try to go two OCI again if it's not blackout dark at 10K or 15K during regular inspection. I really don't want to have to do math and/or take notes when to do an OCI or FCI... OCI at 160K, 170K, 180K is easy enough for me, FCI at same or even number I can handle [when dropping 4 zeros for you OCD AR types] (160K, 180K, 200K).


Hello,
We do not recommend using this filter past 15k miles, hence the statement on the box that is suitable for up to 15k oil changes. That said, there are many variables including bypass valve function, general engine and cooling system cleanliness, pcv operation and more. These are the reason there are oil change monitors. Because of the way this filter snaps into the cap, I also would remove it so often, not what it was designed for. If you want us to evaluate the original and let you know what we find, you can mail it to me. Just send me an email at my framgrp address and I will send shipping instructions.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: SilverC6
For the OP's filter, that media has got to be all through that engine.


LoL ... the same could be said for tearing Purolators. You don't think tearing media on Purolators could also 'all go through the engine' but it could on this one?

 

[goodtimes]

Is that offending pleat next to the seam bonded to the end cap? It looks like it isn't. Maybe oil was going around the end too. I don't see how excuses can be made for it, same as the other defective filters. Definitely casts doubt to me on the media and why the need to have iron curtain mesh behind it. Maybe the plastic end caps are the problem. For some reason I thought someone said the Ultra has to have metal end caps due to the media and mesh, but here they are in plastic.

 

[funflyer]

Originally Posted By: Motorking

Hello,
We do not recommend using this filter past 15k miles, hence the statement on the box that is suitable for up to 15k oil changes. That said, there are many variables including bypass valve function, general engine and cooling system cleanliness, pcv operation and more. These are the reason there are oil change monitors. Because of the way this filter snaps into the cap, I also would remove it so often, not what it was designed for. If you want us to evaluate the original and let you know what we find, you can mail it to me. Just send me an email at my framgrp address and I will send shipping instructions.




I have to agree, when all else fails read the directions!

 

[WobblyElvis]

The 15,000 or 3,000 miles it says on the box is just a recommendation. Like when a quick lube shop recommends you return in 3,000 mile. It's marketing. All reputable filter manufactures must meet the OEM specs for longevity so that you can follow your owner's manual or OLM. This applies to even their cheapest filter, such as the fram extra guard.
If the owner's manual calls for 15,000 miles on a filter, a fram extra guard is guaranteed to last that long.

The Fram extra guard box might say 5,000 miles on the side but that's just to get you to buy more or trade up to their more expensive offering.

 

[linksep]

Miles is easily quantifiable, but it's a less than perfect measurement of engine/oil/filter/coolant/other abuse.

You're saying 15K miles at full throttle in first gear is equal to 15K miles in 5th gear at 1/3 throttle? Miles is miles right? (Never mind total engine revolutions or total fuel consumption which would be much better indicators.)

I figure 20K miles with greater than 93% of those miles in top gear at low throttle input is less fuel consumption and less total engine revolutions than stop-and-go city traffic averaging 2nd gear.

In any event I'm not totally busted up about the whole thing, it was filtering (in unintentional "bypass" mode). It could have been a material defect, it could be an engineering defect on the part of GM (undersized cartridge) or Fram (material). In any event it happened, (the first time I went 2 OCI/FCI and the first time I have noticed in 180K miles).

This was my first foray into extended FCI, I learned I can't go totally blind for 20K miles (especially considering that I have a cartridge filter that can be inspected non-destructively).

 

[DoubleWasp]

Love FU cans. Have not gone for the cartridges yet.

 

[WellOiled]

Originally Posted By: linksep
Miles is easily quantifiable, but it's a less than perfect measurement of engine/oil/filter/coolant/other abuse.

You're saying 15K miles at full throttle in first gear is equal to 15K miles in 5th gear at 1/3 throttle? Miles is miles right? (Never mind total engine revolutions or total fuel consumption which would be much better indicators.)

I figure 20K miles with greater than 93% of those miles in top gear at low throttle input is less fuel consumption and less total engine revolutions than stop-and-go city traffic averaging 2nd gear.

In any event I'm not totally busted up about the whole thing, it was filtering (in unintentional "bypass" mode). It could have been a material defect, it could be an engineering defect on the part of GM (undersized cartridge) or Fram (material). In any event it happened, (the first time I went 2 OCI/FCI and the first time I have noticed in 180K miles).

This was my first foray into extended FCI, I learned I can't go totally blind for 20K miles (especially considering that I have a cartridge filter that can be inspected non-destructively).

linksep - There are likely much better papers than this one. There are a couple of good plots on page 14 top right and page 15 top left.

The plots seem to indicate wear is proportional to RPM as well as load. One for compression rings and the other for bearings.

http://www.swri.org/3pubs/ttoday/spring98/PDFs/engine-wear.pdf

 

[SilverC6]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: SilverC6
For the OP's filter, that media has got to be all through that engine.


LoL ... the same could be said for tearing Purolators. You don't think tearing media on Purolators could also 'all go through the engine' but it could on this one?


Nice deflection.

That's not a Purolator in the picture.

It's a failed FRAM Ultra.

Stay on topic.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: SilverC6
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: SilverC6
For the OP's filter, that media has got to be all through that engine.


LoL ... the same could be said for tearing Purolators. You don't think tearing media on Purolators could also 'all go through the engine' but it could on this one?


Nice deflection.

That's not a Purolator in the picture.

It's a failed FRAM Ultra.

Stay on topic.


Zing ... right over your head. You really don't get the comment? Figures ...

 

[crazyoildude]

I may be A little younger than Jay but i agree with him in the 70's 15,000 mile filter changes were Not anything i remember either.

 

[WobblyElvis]

Most American car manufacturers recommended OFCs every second oil change from the early 70's to the 90's. OCIs increased greatly in the 60s, from about 3,000 to 6,000 miles. By the 70's, recommended OCIs of 7,500 miles was common. Severe operation was excessive idling, trailer towing or operating below freezing. Businesses that make money from frequent oil changes would rather have you not know this.

My family has owned 2 gas/service stations way back when and many cars. The two oldest autos I owned were both 1965s and most maintenance, on all the cars my family owned, was performed by a member of my family. Oil filters were almost always run for two OCIs and I'd say the average OCI was about 6,000 miles. This was in the 70's.

We had several 1960's VWs. Big exception, no oil filter and 2-3000 miles OCI.