FOIA CIA doc on the U2, A12, and (RS) 71

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http://www.foia.cia.gov/sites/default/files/document_conversions/18/1992-04-01.pdf

Has some interesting commentary.

Project Blue Book, launched when airline pilots and traffic controllers started reporting objects at impossible altitudes.

The overflights were CIA, with Military pilots taken out of the forces and flying the spy flights.

Gary Powers incident.

Mention of the use of metallic additives in the SR71 exhausts to reduce it's signature (precursor to the contrail story ???)

Obviously referencing Area 51 (redacted), but not many other places that it could be when looked at.

Why the tanks really leaked.

Have fun.
 
We were designing the A-12 (later the SR-71) at the time that Gary Powers was shot down because we KNEW the vulnerability of the U-2.

The design specs were outrageous: Mach 3+, 70 - 80,000 foot cruise altitude for 4,000 miles at that speed.

Incredible technology was developed to meet those specs: titanium machining, variable-bypass engines, Astro-navigation using known stars, identified by spectral characteristics, viewed by a computer system through a sapphire portal in the jet. 600F skin temperature, requiring special fuel...that then required a hypergolic ignition source: Triethyl borane. The list is both long and fascinating.

The Blackbird first flew in 1962.

And by 1965, we were flying over Russia, and neither their airplanes, nor their missiles, could touch that bad-[censored] Mach 3+ jet. We flew over their country with impunity. They didn't complain because it made them look weak. But they sure tried to shoot it down.

For a great read, from a designer's perspective, try "Skunk Works" by Ben Rich...and from an operator's perspective, try "Sled Driver" by Brian Shul.
 
Originally Posted By: Astro14
Incredible technology was developed to meet those specs: titanium machining, variable-bypass engines, Astro-navigation using known stars, identified by spectral characteristics, viewed by a computer system through a sapphire portal in the jet. 600F skin temperature, requiring special fuel...that then required a hypergolic ignition source: Triethyl borane. The list is both long and fascinating.

The Blackbird first flew in 1962.


Plus the nascent stealth technology incorporated into the Blackbird.
 
Somebody had a sense of humor naming it "Project Oxcart".

Copied the PDF top my desktop, I'll get around to reading it.

+1 on the "Skunk Works" book, I have it too. A fascinating read.

Thanks
 
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Originally Posted By: Astro14
We were designing the A-12 (later the SR-71) at the time that Gary Powers was shot down because we KNEW the vulnerability of the U-2.

The design specs were outrageous: Mach 3+, 70 - 80,000 foot cruise altitude for 4,000 miles at that speed.

Incredible technology was developed to meet those specs: titanium machining, variable-bypass engines, Astro-navigation using known stars, identified by spectral characteristics, viewed by a computer system through a sapphire portal in the jet. 600F skin temperature, requiring special fuel...that then required a hypergolic ignition source: Triethyl borane. The list is both long and fascinating.

The Blackbird first flew in 1962.

And by 1965, we were flying over Russia, and neither their airplanes, nor their missiles, could touch that bad-[censored] Mach 3+ jet. We flew over their country with impunity. They didn't complain because it made them look weak. But they sure tried to shoot it down.

For a great read, from a designer's perspective, try "Skunk Works" by Ben Rich...and from an operator's perspective, try "Sled Driver" by Brian Shul.


The vulnerabilities or rather the soviet capabilities were severely underestimated when the U2 started flying though. Lesson learned, I suppose...

7 U2 were shot down from what I've found:
1 over Russia,
1 over Cuba,
5 over China

all by an S-75 system.

When did the Blackbird overflights stop? I'm not entirely sure the S-300 was/is unable to shoot down the SR-71. I can find mostly references about flying over Vietnam.

The MIG-25 seems to be fairly fast, and apparently was able to follow the SR-71 but not to shhot it down.

Quote:
The Swedish Air Force observed via radar a Soviet Air Defense MiG-25 at 63,000 ft trailed 2.9 km behind the Lockheed SR-71 Blackbird at 72,000 ft over the Baltic Sea in the 1980s.
 
The MIG-25 required an immediate engine rebuild when it came anywhere close to approaching the SR-71's cruise speed. The actual top speed of the SR-71 will probably never be known, but it was capable of well over Mach 3.2 based on numerous pilot accounts.

If the SR-71 had been able to be shot down, I'm sure somebody would have done it (like with the U-2).

This is a great story about the 'bird from a former pilot:

http://www.vfp62.com/sr-71.html

Definitely worth the read. I love this quote:

Quote:
With spikes and doors as tight as they can get, we are racing against the time it could take a missile to reach our altitude.

It is a race this jet will not let us lose. The Mach eases to 3.5 as we crest 80,000 feet. We are a bullet now - except faster. We hit the turn, and I feel some relief as our nose swings away from a country we have seen quite enough of. Screaming past Tripoli , our phenomenal speed continues to rise, and the screaming Sled pummels the enemy one more time, laying down a parting sonic boom. In seconds, we can see nothing but the expansive blue of the Mediterranean . I realize that I still have my left hand full-forward and we're continuing to rocket along in maximum afterburner.

The TDI now shows us Mach numbers, not only new to our experience but flat out scary. Walt says the DEF panel is now quiet, and I know it is time to reduce our incredible speed. I pull the throttles to the min 'burner range and the jet still doesn't want to slow down. Normally the Mach would be affected immediately, when making such a large throttle movement But for just a few moments old 960 just sat out there at the high Mach, she seemed to love and like the proud Sled she was, only began to slow when we were well out of danger. I loved that jet.
 
The ref to the stellar update of the inertial system of the SR-71 and the whole subject area brings back some info that might be of interest. Those updates were applied to a guidance system called SPN/Geans (Standard Precision Navigator/Gimbaled Electrostatically Suspended Gyroscope). The technology was originaly developed for submarine use by Rockwell. Imagine a hollow, 1.5 inch berylium ball, chemically etched with stripes so an optical pickup could see them, suspended in a near vacuum and spinning at 50,000 RPM as the stable element. Manufactured for aircraft use by Honeywell it was also used in the B-52 and F-117 fleet. The original spec was for a navigator that would only drift bt 0.5 nautical miles per hour but it was much better than that and, with accurate updating ala stellar or radar, even more so. Any power interruption that caused the electrostatic field suspending the ball to stall was called, naturally enough, "dropping the ball". The ball was immediately destroyed necessitating a $50K rebuild! Like the SR-71 it was a thing of beauty. Those who are interested can look up the history on the system as well as the development of the Apollo inertial system at the Charles Stark Draper Lab at MIT. Also see a youtube vid documentary titled "Navigation Computer".

And finally, talking about outrunning fighters and SAM's, or not, the Russians managed to shoot down a few of their own fighters that were chasing Gary Powers before one of the SA-2's got him.
 
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Great post DeepFriar!!

Thanks for the insight into the navigation system, an overlooked technological breakthrough that enabled the mission success of the airplane.
 
Wanted to add some possibly interesting data on this subject for those not old enough to know of the intense controversy following the Powers incident. I went back and reviewed some of the literature on the shoot-down. Some will remember that Gary Powers took a lot heat for not initiating the aircraft self destruct mechanism process (explosive charge apparently located in the cockpit somewhere) prior to bailing out. Powers later stated that all of the CIA pilots had agreed amongst themseves that it was likely their bosses were lying to them about the time delay feature of the charge and the explosion would be immediate on "pushing the button" so as to preclude the capture of the pilot as well (nothing ike being a spy eh?).

I couldn't find credible evidence of more than one Russian fighter being shot down by their own SAMS during the event although there have been many stories over the years that at least two and perhaps more were shot down. When you consider that the fighters were likely in a tail-chase scenario they may have been right in or very near the borsight of the Fansong radar of the SA-2 system. The Russians long relied on slavish (sorry) adherence to GCI (ground controlled intercept) positive control of their aircraft. If the GCI and the SAM guys were not coordinating well (or, more likely, just didn't care) then the fighters struggling for altitude behind Powers may have been at a look angle that put them right in the way.

Speaking as one who has seen the arming pulse of the SA-2 grow up out of the signal "grass" (I was not the one being shot at) you have to feel for Powers or anyone else in a similar circumstance.

Another tidbit, no way to confirm, is that the Chicom shootdowns were all crewed by Taiwanese pilots flying for the CIA.

For those interested in the field in general check out the Association of Old Crows website plus many other ELINT sources.
 
One last input from me on this one. I found a bio of the ROCAF officer who headed the U2 squadron in Taiwan. It is a detailed history of Project Razor which was the bi-national effort for PRC U2 recon. It makes a fascinating read. The efforts and bravery of these folks was amazing and is inspirational. There are details here that, if true (careful legal language..), and any of us had been read in on the program, the info would be classified basically forever. However, this document is open source internet and all so, with that said, have at it and reflect on great people willing to die to help keep their country safe.

http://area51specialprojects.com/u2-pao.html
 
Originally Posted By: Ducked
I just get an appraisal of the Balkans Crisis via the initial link?


Yeah, It's not the original multi hundred page doc that I linked to.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
The MIG-25 required an immediate engine rebuild when it came anywhere close to approaching the SR-71's cruise speed. The actual top speed of the SR-71 will probably never be known, but it was capable of well over Mach 3.2 based on numerous pilot accounts.

If the SR-71 had been able to be shot down, I'm sure somebody would have done it (like with the U-2).

This is a great story about the 'bird from a former pilot:

http://www.vfp62.com/sr-71.html

Definitely worth the read. I love this quote:

Quote:
With spikes and doors as tight as they can get, we are racing against the time it could take a missile to reach our altitude.

It is a race this jet will not let us lose. The Mach eases to 3.5 as we crest 80,000 feet. We are a bullet now - except faster. We hit the turn, and I feel some relief as our nose swings away from a country we have seen quite enough of. Screaming past Tripoli , our phenomenal speed continues to rise, and the screaming Sled pummels the enemy one more time, laying down a parting sonic boom. In seconds, we can see nothing but the expansive blue of the Mediterranean . I realize that I still have my left hand full-forward and we're continuing to rocket along in maximum afterburner.

The TDI now shows us Mach numbers, not only new to our experience but flat out scary. Walt says the DEF panel is now quiet, and I know it is time to reduce our incredible speed. I pull the throttles to the min 'burner range and the jet still doesn't want to slow down. Normally the Mach would be affected immediately, when making such a large throttle movement But for just a few moments old 960 just sat out there at the high Mach, she seemed to love and like the proud Sled she was, only began to slow when we were well out of danger. I loved that jet.


The Russian pilot who defected to Japan in his MiG-25 wrote a very interesting book that I read in my teens. He reported firing missiles at approaching SR-71s many times, only to have the Blackbirds turn around and easily outrun the missiles. They didn't have to actually go faster than the AAMs, of course, just fast enough to keep them from closing in the 50 mile or so range that they had. Belenko and his fellow interceptor pilots were routinely frustrated by SR-71 encounters, but they did prevent those planes from flying over the USSR with total impunity.
A MiG-25 did streak over Israel from Syria to Egypt in the '70s, but it limped home with damaged engines. The SR-71 could cruise at Mach 3+ speeds the MiG-25 could only maintain for seconds...the flyover still resulted in the Israelis developing F-4s with high modified water injection engines that gave them impressive streak speeds and a shot at intercepting the MiG-25s, so the stunt was not repeated.
One of the most interesting things from Belenko's book for me concerned the radar...the designers attempted to beat jamming techniques by making it incredibly powerful. Belenko reported that pilots liked to pulse the radar on briefly if they happened to see a rabbit hopping down the runway in front of them while taxiing so as to watch the poor thing drop dead instantly.
 
Originally Posted By: DeepFriar
One last input from me on this one. I found a bio of the ROCAF officer who headed the U2 squadron in Taiwan. It is a detailed history of Project Razor which was the bi-national effort for PRC U2 recon. It makes a fascinating read. The efforts and bravery of these folks was amazing and is inspirational. There are details here that, if true (careful legal language..), and any of us had been read in on the program, the info would be classified basically forever. However, this document is open source internet and all so, with that said, have at it and reflect on great people willing to die to help keep their country safe.

http://area51specialprojects.com/u2-pao.html


Nice find. I'd heard something about this (dunno where) but hadn't seen any documents.

Re "and reflect on great people willing to die to help keep their country safe." bear in mind that "country" is a slightly unclear construct here.

I note that one of the pilots is said to have defected to the Peoples Republic, but later, when he was flying a civil airliner.

Its the thought that counts, but I bet they'd have preferred a U-2.
 
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I understand your view there Ducked. The ROC could be seen as a "construct". I know the whole strange history of the civil war, the warlords, the Chaings, the KMT, the 228 incident and much other dirty laundry relative to Taiwan. But it doesn't take away from the courage of the people who flew those U2's knowing what horrible fate awaited them if they went down in the PRC. That took guts. But, like I said, I understand your point.
 
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