Malibu Torque Converter Hunting Uphill in 3rd

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I posted a while ago asking about difference in MAF Sensor Brands. I finally got my Delphi MAF and it really tightened up WOT shifts. But a very common problem with these cars is an uphill surge due to the torque converter locking and unlocking. GM issued a TSB on this way back in 2003. Here it is.

The 4T40E/4T45E/4T65E automatic transmission may experience a slip surge condition in second, third and or fourth gears while under load, such as driving up a long hill or mountain. The conditions either separate or working in combination seem to cause the 'Engine Load %' to drop to a value which the PCM commands a lower line pressure (increase in PCS amperage).
'Normal' degradation of MAF over time aggravated by induction of foreign material (fine dust, oil from non-OEM air induction systems; secondly, build up of carbon deposits in combustion chamber/intake valves over time; thirdly, outside ambient temperatures above 95 degrees F(35 degrees C) seem to aggravate the condition. The MAF should be swapped from a known good unit or replaced and the vehicle evaluated.

I replaced my MAF sensor and it was good for about a week then came back. Im tired of exchanging parts over and over again. I know Delphi MAF's are really good. I have also replaced the 1-2 Shift Solenoid, 3-4 Shift Solenoid, PCS, and TCC Solenoid. Absolutely no change at all in the surge. I am almost positive its not mechanical, because this car started doing this when it was pretty much new. It has 245,000 miles now and still does it. A lot of Grand AM/Grand Prix had this problem, as well as the 97-03 Malibus. Everyone else that posted this problem for help said the MAF sensor fixed the problem
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My fuel pressure is good too. Its got to be a sensor issue somewhere. There are no vacuum leaks. If I press the brake pedal, it stops doing it (disengage TCC). Has new plugs and wires, TPS, and CTS. It still drives fine. Its just really annoying and its got to be accelerating TCC wear by locking and unlocking constantly. I probably scared everyone away with this really long post lol. Sorry! And thanks in advance!
 
Seems like GM programming didn't properly handle the hysteresis between "hey I should lock up" and "need to lock down".
 
Coupe of questions. Is this a new or rebuilt MAF? Did you check the MAF wiring connector on this? Is this the 4T65E?
The connectors have been known to cause problems and inexpensive replacement pig tails are available.
 
All brands should have been forced years ago into installing a TCC selector switch.Wether you want it or not.Towing is not good for a TCC yet they still engage...
 
Today I started unplugging a bunch of sensors. I unplug the MAF sensor and, surging is completely gone. Plug it back in and its back. What in the heck is going on here??
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: ChevyGuy3100
Today I started unplugging a bunch of sensors. I unplug the MAF sensor and, surging is completely gone. Plug it back in and its back. What in the heck is going on here??


Could be a bad MAF, its common to get a duff new part it happens all the time or the connector may be iffy.
You can get a new pigtail for the it.
 
I rewired the MAF connector yesterday. Sorry, I forgot to mention it. I should also include that its not misfiring. When its surging, I can floor it and it pulls hard.
 
Originally Posted By: ChevyGuy3100
I am almost positive its not mechanical, because this car started doing this when it was pretty much new. It has 245,000 miles now and still does it.


Goes to show how stout Woven Carbon TCC Friction Material is!
It could be a simple as a Software Update, I have fixed many transmission complaints by installing the latest GM updates.
 
I fixed it in my Grand Prix with the help of computer tuning software. I basically told the car not to lock the converter under a certain MPH and it had been like that for 8 years.
 
Does this have a MAP sensor as GMBoy was talking about? I seem to remember one near the coil pack.
The fact it smoothed out when unplugged seems to point to the MAF but it might be working in conjunction with a MA sensor and unplugging one effects the other.

Turning something off or modifying its parameters in the ECM is certainly one approach but I rather find the root of the problem first.
 
This does have a MAP sensor. In fact, just for the heck of it, I unplugged that too and noticed no difference. Whats weird is the check engine never came on for it being unplugged... Same with 02 sensors. I unplugged both of them and the car ran about the same, but no CEL.
 
If the engine was cold it was in open loop. A lot of codes wont set until its goes into closed loop.
It may need a couple of cycles to trigger some codes also.
 
Originally Posted By: NHGUY
All brands should have been forced years ago into installing a TCC selector switch.Wether you want it or not.Towing is not good for a TCC yet they still engage...


I thought it was good for them--lock up and keep the heat low.

Locking/unlocking while under power, now that is bad, assuming they spend "much" time in slippage.

I wonder if the OP needs to force a downshift instead? Locked/unlocked won't matter (much) if well above stall speed.
 
I think it is downshifting. It goes from 4th, unlocks and goes to 3rd. Then the TC locks and unlocks. If i manually put it in 3, its sitting at 2500 rpm at 55 and its smooth sailing. If its in D and i go up a hill, it goes between 2700 and 2500 rpm. Also when its surging, i can mash down on it more, it goes to 3,000 rpm, then drops back down to 2500 rpm and quits surging. I will get a video of it this evening. Its supposed to be 85 today and its worse the hotter it is.
 
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