Basic API/ILSAC/ACEA classification question

[Quartz]

I want to make sure I understand API/ILSAC/ACEA classifications correctly, hopefully I can get a quick yes/no on the following questions:

1) API ratings are in alphabetical order and each letter supersedes the one before it, correct? If an engine requires an oil that meets API SL, then an oil that's SM or SN is ok?

2) ILSAC GF-# is in linear numeric order, correct? If an engine requires ILSAC GF-3, then GF-4 or GF-5 are ok?

3) ACEA is segregated into different categories based on type and they do NOT supersede each other, correct? If an engine requires ACEA A1/B1, then the only other one that's compatible is A5/B5?

4) ACEA and API are mutually exclusive... maybe? From what I understand, because ACEA also has to meet certain standards for diesel, the extra detergents run foul of the API tests so an oil that meets an ACEA spec can't also meet any API spec too, correct?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Chewie]

4) Not necessarily. There may be some oils that meet ACEA but have certain properties that preclude them from API certification, but that is not the rule. As an easy example, Mobil 1 5W-30 EP meets API SN, SM, SL, SJ as well as ACEA A1/B1.

https://mobiloil.com/en/motor-oils/mobil-1/mobil-1-extended-performance

 

[SR5]

1 yes
2 yes
3 they go by years, so A3/B4 from 2012 supersedes A3/B4 from 2008. You should only use the most up to date sequence, but some people cheat a bit.
4 API oils in ILSAC grades (xW-20 & xW-30) have Phos limits which may conflict with the high wear limits (as in good) required by Euro oils (ACEA & OEM like BMW or MB). So a good Euro A3/B4 in 5W-30 may "only" be SL because it is high in Phos & Zinc. There is no limit on non-ILSAC grades, so the same amount of Phos & Zinc in a 0W-40 oil would be classed as SN. Go figure, bit silly if you ask me.

 

[chrisri]

3) one can use A3/B4 specification in both A1/B1 and A5/B5 engines without fear of potential engine damage. Fuel consumption will suffer.
You can't use A1/B1 or A5/B5 in A3/B4 specified engine without risking damage.

Similar goes for C group of oils where C3 can be used in C2 application, but not the other way around.

4)all PCMO with ACEA specification can meet API SN spec, except SAE 30, and lower grades which are restricted by API specifications

 

[Quartz]

Originally Posted By: SR5
3 they go by years, so A3/B4 from 2012 supersedes A3/B4 from 2008. You should only use the most up to date sequence, but some people cheat a bit.

I'm a little confused here. When I look at oils online they just say things like "ACEA A1/A5", how am I supposed to know which year?

Originally Posted By: SR5
API oils in ILSAC grades
Originally Posted By: chrisri
all PCMO with ACEA specification can meet API SN spec, except SAE 30, and lower grades which are restricted by API specifications

OK, so an oil can easily meet any two of API/ILSAC/ACEA... meeting all three is sometimes possible but tough?

Originally Posted By: chrisri
one can use A3/B4 specification in both A1/B1 and A5/B5 engines without fear of potential engine damage. Fuel consumption will suffer.
You can't use A1/B1 or A5/B5 in A3/B4 specified engine without risking damage.

Allright...so.. if my engine says "A1/B1", you're saying that either A3/B4 and A5/B5 are safe to use (but that I should really try to find something that's actually A1/B1)?

 

[SR5]

For ACEA you should only use the most up to date spec (2012) so by default this is the year. Eg "A3/B4" I read as the 2012 spec.

Sometimes a company will say "A3/B4 -08" and they are using the 2008 spec.

For more talk on A1/B1 Vs A5/B5 Vs A3/B4 see this recent thread
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4048837

 

[Quartz]

I understand that I should use the most recent spec, the question is how do I tell if the bottle doesn't list a year on it (and I'm looking online where there's no expiration date to guess from)? Or am I still misunderstanding something?

Thanks for the A#/B# link, I'll have to look into that more.

 

[SR5]

Originally Posted By: Quartz
I understand that I should use the most recent spec, the question is how do I tell if the bottle doesn't list a year on it (and I'm looking online where there's no expiration date to guess from)? Or am I still misunderstanding something?

Thanks for the A#/B# link, I'll have to look into that more.


No they, the manufacturers (Castrol, Mobil, Valvoline, Shell etc) should only use the most up to date spec. They should never use an out of date spec for ACEA, it's not allowed (unless it's a change over period, and right now it's not).

If you see ACEA A1/B1 only on a new bottle of oil from a name brand company, then it should be 2012, but they dont bother to say 2012, because they follow the rules. One of the reasons to use a name brand oil, they have a lot of reputation to lose if they are caught cheating. Some smaller companies may say A1/B1-08, which strictly speaking they shouldn't as only 2012 is allowed, but they get away with it because they are not hiding what they are doing.

PQIA have found some companies claiming specs, like API SN, that they do not meet and have issued warnings about them. But this is closer to fraud and with brands I have never heard of before.

Buy a name brand and trust them to do their job.

 

[Quartz]

OK, thanks.