Dodging bullets made of hardened horror stories

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I'm new here. Car/truck folks are some of the most brand loyal people I've ever met. I'm interested in the stories behind the loyalty. What sealed the deal to make you bond with xxxxx brand motor oil? I'll share mine.

In the mid nineties we had jumped on the AMSOIL jobber program mostly as a favor to a customer/friend who was climbing the sales ladder. I wasn't loyal to any one brand at that point and bought primarily by price. I did like the one size fits all transmission fluid- now three sizes fit most.Fast forward to 2010 and a good customer's brand new RAV4. An ideal fit was synthetic oil and so it's first service we installed AMSOIL. Toyota oil filters had just returned to a cartridge design much to my disappointment. The car left and just as I was closing up came that call that puts a lump in your throat. The RAV4 had died. It's oil light flashed, then went solid. The customer came off the highway and DROVE the remaining 5 MILES home where she promptly called me to deliver the lump in my throat the size of a grapefruit.I sank in my chair, wrote down the details, and sent a flatbed the 25 miles to tow it in. It seemed to take forever, but I wanted to see what happened. As soon as the RAV4 arrived, I reached down to turn the crank pulley. Oddly enough it turned. Further inspection revealed oil all over the engine compartment and nothing on the stick. The filter housing was still dripping and it was quickly believed to be where all the oil had escaped. Removing it revealed a failed o-ring. Now it was tempting to start the blame game, but I resisted. Instead, we replaced the filter filling the cartridge and crankcase with oil ahead of time. Then pulled the spark plugs and cranked the engine. It turned smoothly enough. Back in went the plugs and we fired it up. More than 5 minutes passed before the lifter noise subsided, but there appeared to be no engine damage. I took the car for a ride and it ran flawlessly. There were some tense words on the phone and I put a twenty year relationship with a customer on the line. That was all 6 years and 75,000 miles ago. RAV4 still running strong and I'm convinced AMSOIL is the reason why.

Your thoughts?
 
Cool story. What made you make a sales pitch your first post?

It's a bit obvious is all.


Originally Posted By: OrchardAuto
I'm new here. Car/truck folks are some of the most brand loyal people I've ever met. I'm interested in the stories behind the loyalty. What sealed the deal to make you bond with xxxxx brand motor oil? I'll share mine.

In the mid nineties we had jumped on the AMSOIL jobber program mostly as a favor to a customer/friend who was climbing the sales ladder. I wasn't loyal to any one brand at that point and bought primarily by price. I did like the one size fits all transmission fluid- now three sizes fit most.Fast forward to 2010 and a good customer's brand new RAV4. An ideal fit was synthetic oil and so it's first service we installed AMSOIL. Toyota oil filters had just returned to a cartridge design much to my disappointment. The car left and just as I was closing up came that call that puts a lump in your throat. The RAV4 had died. It's oil light flashed, then went solid. The customer came off the highway and DROVE the remaining 5 MILES home where she promptly called me to deliver the lump in my throat the size of a grapefruit.I sank in my chair, wrote down the details, and sent a flatbed the 25 miles to tow it in. It seemed to take forever, but I wanted to see what happened. As soon as the RAV4 arrived, I reached down to turn the crank pulley. Oddly enough it turned. Further inspection revealed oil all over the engine compartment and nothing on the stick. The filter housing was still dripping and it was quickly believed to be where all the oil had escaped. Removing it revealed a failed o-ring. Now it was tempting to start the blame game, but I resisted. Instead, we replaced the filter filling the cartridge and crankcase with oil ahead of time. Then pulled the spark plugs and cranked the engine. It turned smoothly enough. Back in went the plugs and we fired it up. More than 5 minutes passed before the lifter noise subsided, but there appeared to be no engine damage. I took the car for a ride and it ran flawlessly. There were some tense words on the phone and I put a twenty year relationship with a customer on the line. That was all 6 years and 75,000 miles ago. RAV4 still running strong and I'm convinced AMSOIL is the reason why.

Your thoughts?
 
I suppose my first thought is this:

As a matter of routine, do you start and check for leaks right after a change?

I usually let the car idle for a few minutes while I listen. Then shut it down, check for leaks, and put on the engine/splash pan and take it off the ramps/jack stands.

I wonder how long it ran before that o-ring failed...I suspect it had failed right away...pinched in the threads, or stretched and snapped. I also wonder how long before oil appeared on that filter housing...
 
Originally Posted By: OrchardAuto
Further inspection revealed oil all over the engine compartment and nothing on the stick.


Isn't the RAV 4 filter located on the bottom of the engine?
 
Originally Posted By: kschachn
What made you make a sales pitch your first post?

It's a bit obvious is all.



I agree about the sales pitch.

As far as the reason why? I've heard numerous horror stories like that over the years, with different brands in the sump, dino and synthetic, and the engines survived. How/why? Residual oil, oil coated parts, and the engine shut down before it was too late, a lucky person. Those are the first things that come to mind.

WELCOME TO BITOG!
 
Since I'm a Toyota fan-boy, I'd assume it was Toyota's super bullet proof engine design that let it survive this incident.

But thanks for the reminder to always change out the o-rings and check for leaks.
 
If you want more thoughts, here they are.

First off, which AMSOIL product did you use in the brand new RAV4? Hopefully it was one that actually carried the specifications required by Toyota so you didn't endanger your good customer's new vehicle warranty.

Second, you say that as soon as the vehicle came back, you "reached down to turn the crank pulley. Oddly enough it turned." You were able to do this with the accessory belts and the spark plugs installed?

Third, you said the cause of the leak was a "failed o-ring". Failed how? Do you mean it was defective when you installed it, or was it installed improperly? If it was defective at installation, the defect was not noticeable when you placed it on the housing?

My last problem is that if I took a brand new vehicle to a shop for an oil change and it all leaked out, there is NO WAY I'm just going to move on and drive another 6 years and 75,000 miles as if nothing happened. Especially when you said that after putting new oil in it was "more than 5 minutes" before the noise subsided. No way, no how I'm leaving. My brand new vehicle is getting a new engine either from you (if you improperly installed the o-ring) or from the filter manufacturer (if the o-ring actually failed). You claim there "appeared to be no engine damage" but how did you determine that? If the engine made noise for five minutes after adding oil then there was damage. No two ways around it.
 
I had a oil pressure sending unit break on an '87 Toyota Van. Oil light never came on (Duh) but it pumped just about all of it out. It ran for about 10 minutes without oil pressure.

After I replaced the sending unit and filled it with oil, I had to grit my teeth for at least 10 minutes until the lifter shut up. Then I drove it another 100k miles before I sold it. Castrol GTX, if memory serves.

There is nothing unusual about an engine surviving oil loss. How long and how hot is the key.

AmSoil may make decent products. I don't appreciate their marketing model. So I buy mostly Mobil 1, which seems to be just as good, and a lot less expensive. YMMV.
 
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OP, what specifically about Amsoil convinces you that it was Amsoil that saved the engine ?

What specifically convinces you that another brand name (synthetic or not) oil would have lead to failure ?

My stupid brother in law drove 100km with a flickering oil light, then in the morning drove it 25km with it on solid, needing two litres to get to the add mark...I can understand if he drove past an Amsoil sign and the miraculous protection rubbed off on his car, but those signs aren't that common down here, and I have to discount that as a reason.
 
Originally Posted By: Leo99
Since I'm a Toyota fan-boy, I'd assume it was Toyota's super bullet proof engine design that let it survive this incident.




Yeah, but the same story unfolded with my neighbor's Nissan Pathfinder a few years ago with the same result, so neither Amsoil nor Toyota get any credit. The real answer is what demarpaint said- residual oil is enough to keep an engine running a lot longer than most people think, particularly if it isn't working very hard.
 
I personally have no loyalty. I buy what ever quality oil is on sale. I prefer Magnatec but have M1, Havoline DS Pro and Magnatec in my garage. I have used MC Synblend, FormulaShell synthetic and T6 in the past with great results.
 
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: Leo99
Since I'm a Toyota fan-boy, I'd assume it was Toyota's super bullet proof engine design that let it survive this incident.




Yeah, but the same story unfolded with my neighbor's Nissan Pathfinder a few years ago with the same result, so neither Amsoil nor Toyota get any credit. The real answer is what demarpaint said- residual oil is enough to keep an engine running a lot longer than most people think, particularly if it isn't working very hard.


Sorry, sometimes my sarcasm doesn't come across properly. What I meant was that we should not attribute cause and effect when we have no control and experimental data. While I am a Toyota fanboy, I try to keep an unbiased perspective. Could be the oil, could be the engine, or much more likely, as you point out, any engine or oil could have done the same thing.
 
i too WAS an amsoil user + supporter back when they only used PAO base oil prolly with ester as well. today they use whatever + tell you nothing hiding behind "priority" i now use Redline + know what i am paying for!!
 
Originally Posted By: Leo99
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: Leo99
Since I'm a Toyota fan-boy, I'd assume it was Toyota's super bullet proof engine design that let it survive this incident.




Yeah, but the same story unfolded with my neighbor's Nissan Pathfinder a few years ago with the same result, so neither Amsoil nor Toyota get any credit. The real answer is what demarpaint said- residual oil is enough to keep an engine running a lot longer than most people think, particularly if it isn't working very hard.


Sorry, sometimes my sarcasm doesn't come across properly. What I meant was that we should not attribute cause and effect when we have no control and experimental data. While I am a Toyota fanboy, I try to keep an unbiased perspective. Could be the oil, could be the engine, or much more likely, as you point out, any engine or oil could have done the same thing.


I actually got your sarcasm, but since *someone* would eventually try to take the point seriously.... :p
 
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Apparently another drive-by post.


Yep. It could have been worse!
 
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