Originally Posted By: donnyj08
Originally Posted By: ChevyBadger
Originally Posted By: SOHCman
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
I wouldn't want to be shot with it, however I've seen a deer take 5 shots to the chest from .410 slugs over a period of 1/2 hour and get up and run.
Last year my dad took out his .410 pump to deer hunt as he had a stint put in a couple weeks before the season and didn't want to shoot his 12 guage with slugs. an 8 point buck walked up about 15 feet from him. he shot it in the chest. It ran and laid down in some weeds. After about 15 mins he was just sitting there about 20 yards away looking back and forth, hit but not dying very fast. he shot him again. repeat the process a few more times over the next 30 mins, as the deer just didn't seemed phased much.
My dad called me after the third shot to start walking that way, that he would need help soon to dress and drag it. When i arrived the deer jumped up and ran 40-50 yards and stopped right on a hill above the creek. I was carrying my .44 Mag handi-rifle with 225 Gr Hornady FTX. I pulled up quick and put a round right under the left shoulder, the round hit the lungs clipped the heart and came out directly through the shoulder on the other side breaking it. The deer collapsed.
There were 5 slug entries from the 410, and 1 exit. 3 of them the processor found lodged against the shoulder breaking only the skin, another caught by a rib. only 1 .410 shot penetrated through but it missed all vital organs. The .44mag coming out of a rifle on the other hand did some serious damage.
From now on the .410 is used only for squirrel. It is not fit for deer hunting IMO. A .410 will definitely ruin someones day, but it is under powered against a 200+LB 6 foot bad guy especially using buck shot. My home Defense shotgun is a 20ga pump. I throw in a Slug on the 2nd and 4th shots.
If you only have a .410 shotgun use it, but a 20ga is a better option for a home defense gun. Nothing beats a 12ga, however I do understand that a 12 is too much for many women and men to shoo.
Absolutely, Deer are tough critters and will keep on trying to live and get away with every ounce of survival instinct they have.
Humans are an entirely different ...animal (couldn't resist) in my opinion. So it really depends on whether you are arguing .410 use for self defense, or for hunting deer.
Two entirely different criteria, and likely different types of shells unless you are using slugs for self defense, so really the whole thing is apples and oranges.
Regardless, like you I would rather use 12ga in both circumstances.
You can use a .410 for deer? In Wisconsin Im 96% sure thats illegal. 20 ga or bigger and .223 or bigger for rifle. Like I said 96% sure lol
In Indiana, yes. We are a shotgun and select pistol caliber state. I believe the pistol cases have to be shorter than 1.8 inches. The .410 is legal in Indiana. It was allowed as an alternative to youth and beginning hunters. The problem is almost all .410 guns are smooth bore and shooting a rifled slug from an already weak Caliber down a smooth bore is less than optimal. A 1/4 oz .410 slug is about 109gr bullet moving about 1,700fps at the muzzle. Velocity drops off quick out of a smooth bore.
Basically it's like shooting a total lead 9mm +p+ From a carbine. My friends 9mm carbine Chronographs 9BPLE 9mm at ~1,700fps with a 16.5" barrel.
I use a .44 Mag from a rifle as it is as close to the performance of a 30-30 rifle that I can get without paying out serious money for the wildcat .358 Hoosier round
Unfortunately we cannot use "high powered rifles". Which at least for southern Indiana is silly because the terrain is hilly and similar to Kentucky. The central and northern parts are mostly flat. We tried to pass a bill last year to allow rifles .243 and larger to be used, however it failed to pass.
As far as .410 for intruders I think it would do the job out of a long gun, the key point I was trying to make is it is extremely under powered for a shotgun. You might as well buy a 9mm carbine and load it up with Gold Dot +p if you are recoil sensitive.
And most .410's are usually full choked which is less than ideal for a slug. The slug gets squeezed and deformed and is likely to tumble out of the barrel rather than stabilize.
Originally Posted By: ChevyBadger
Originally Posted By: SOHCman
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
I wouldn't want to be shot with it, however I've seen a deer take 5 shots to the chest from .410 slugs over a period of 1/2 hour and get up and run.
Last year my dad took out his .410 pump to deer hunt as he had a stint put in a couple weeks before the season and didn't want to shoot his 12 guage with slugs. an 8 point buck walked up about 15 feet from him. he shot it in the chest. It ran and laid down in some weeds. After about 15 mins he was just sitting there about 20 yards away looking back and forth, hit but not dying very fast. he shot him again. repeat the process a few more times over the next 30 mins, as the deer just didn't seemed phased much.
My dad called me after the third shot to start walking that way, that he would need help soon to dress and drag it. When i arrived the deer jumped up and ran 40-50 yards and stopped right on a hill above the creek. I was carrying my .44 Mag handi-rifle with 225 Gr Hornady FTX. I pulled up quick and put a round right under the left shoulder, the round hit the lungs clipped the heart and came out directly through the shoulder on the other side breaking it. The deer collapsed.
There were 5 slug entries from the 410, and 1 exit. 3 of them the processor found lodged against the shoulder breaking only the skin, another caught by a rib. only 1 .410 shot penetrated through but it missed all vital organs. The .44mag coming out of a rifle on the other hand did some serious damage.
From now on the .410 is used only for squirrel. It is not fit for deer hunting IMO. A .410 will definitely ruin someones day, but it is under powered against a 200+LB 6 foot bad guy especially using buck shot. My home Defense shotgun is a 20ga pump. I throw in a Slug on the 2nd and 4th shots.
If you only have a .410 shotgun use it, but a 20ga is a better option for a home defense gun. Nothing beats a 12ga, however I do understand that a 12 is too much for many women and men to shoo.
Absolutely, Deer are tough critters and will keep on trying to live and get away with every ounce of survival instinct they have.
Humans are an entirely different ...animal (couldn't resist) in my opinion. So it really depends on whether you are arguing .410 use for self defense, or for hunting deer.
Two entirely different criteria, and likely different types of shells unless you are using slugs for self defense, so really the whole thing is apples and oranges.
Regardless, like you I would rather use 12ga in both circumstances.
You can use a .410 for deer? In Wisconsin Im 96% sure thats illegal. 20 ga or bigger and .223 or bigger for rifle. Like I said 96% sure lol
In Indiana, yes. We are a shotgun and select pistol caliber state. I believe the pistol cases have to be shorter than 1.8 inches. The .410 is legal in Indiana. It was allowed as an alternative to youth and beginning hunters. The problem is almost all .410 guns are smooth bore and shooting a rifled slug from an already weak Caliber down a smooth bore is less than optimal. A 1/4 oz .410 slug is about 109gr bullet moving about 1,700fps at the muzzle. Velocity drops off quick out of a smooth bore.
Basically it's like shooting a total lead 9mm +p+ From a carbine. My friends 9mm carbine Chronographs 9BPLE 9mm at ~1,700fps with a 16.5" barrel.
I use a .44 Mag from a rifle as it is as close to the performance of a 30-30 rifle that I can get without paying out serious money for the wildcat .358 Hoosier round
Unfortunately we cannot use "high powered rifles". Which at least for southern Indiana is silly because the terrain is hilly and similar to Kentucky. The central and northern parts are mostly flat. We tried to pass a bill last year to allow rifles .243 and larger to be used, however it failed to pass.
As far as .410 for intruders I think it would do the job out of a long gun, the key point I was trying to make is it is extremely under powered for a shotgun. You might as well buy a 9mm carbine and load it up with Gold Dot +p if you are recoil sensitive.
And most .410's are usually full choked which is less than ideal for a slug. The slug gets squeezed and deformed and is likely to tumble out of the barrel rather than stabilize.
