Check out the head off my extreme oil burner Honda

[Gasbuggy]

I lost a piece of valve after having a speed contest with a 4.3L S10. A little over 100,000 miles prior I replaced the head gasket, at that time it was hot tanked, milled, and I cleaned and lapped the valves. This head is showing about 250 quarts of consumed oil, mostly on one cylinder. Despite the oil burning this car runs great and still gets fuel economy over EPA numbers. There are two deep scores on the bad cylinder. Around 240,000 miles a perfectly good NGK plug dropped a piece of electrode into the cylinder while I was driving. Sadly, that turned a car that burned no oil into one that consumed a quart ever 1000 miles and turned oil black in short time.

All that carbon was probably like a charcoal briquette. Sorry, I don't have a good picture of the scores or the piston tops. Piston tops look pretty good. The scores you can stick your nail into, though I remember them being deeper when I first saw them 100,000 ago.

 

[mjoekingz28]

Nice pictures

 

[Olas]

If you think that's bad, look at the first gen. DI motors!

 

[KingCake]

Originally Posted By: Olas
If you think that's bad, look at the first gen. DI motors!


haha seriously they look like that after 20K miles

 

[Donald]

So what is next for this engine or is it history?

 

[berniedd]

Originally Posted By: KingCake
Originally Posted By: Olas
If you think that's bad, look at the first gen. DI motors!


haha seriously they look like that after 20K miles


Someone pls educate me why DI engines do this and foul the engine oil early.

 

[OneEyeJack]

Maybe DI engines should switch to 2-stroke oil (lol).

 

[KingCake]

Originally Posted By: berniedd
Originally Posted By: KingCake
Originally Posted By: Olas
If you think that's bad, look at the first gen. DI motors!


haha seriously they look like that after 20K miles


Someone pls educate me why DI engines do this and foul the engine oil early.


Injectors inject gas directly into chambers -- so *AFTER* the intake valves. Normally, gas is injected in the intake runners *BEFORE* the intake valves. So the gas, and the detergents it contains, bathe the valves preventing buildup.

 

[sw99]

Who won?

 

[Gasbuggy]

Originally Posted By: Donald
So what is next for this engine or is it history?


I put a spare head on it, for sentimental reasons mainly. I like having it for a winter car/beater.

 

[Gasbuggy]

Originally Posted By: sw99
Who won?


I creeped away after 70 mph. The S10 was carrying some extra weight though. A couple miles later I was cruising along and I felt a cylinder go and heard tink tink tink as the little piece of valve bounced around. It ran pretty well on 3 cylinders.

 

[KGMtech]

Originally Posted By: Olas
If you think that's bad, look at the first gen. DI motors!


I'm not understanding this statement. The OP photos of the Honda show big deposits from oil burning on the valve face, but you make a comparison to Gen 1 DI engines?

Unless I am wrong, certain DI engines collect deposits on the back face and stem of the intake valves....but not on the actual valve face? am I incorrect?

 

[Astro14]

Originally Posted By: Gasbuggy
Originally Posted By: sw99
Who won?


I creeped away after 70 mph. The S10 was carrying some extra weight though. A couple miles later I was cruising along and I felt a cylinder go and heard tink tink tink as the little piece of valve bounced around. It ran pretty well on 3 cylinders.


This wasn't against a guy in Bayonne, NJ who was taking video on his cellphone at the time while racing, was it?

Just wondering...

 

[Gasbuggy]

Originally Posted By: Astro14
Originally Posted By: Gasbuggy
Originally Posted By: sw99
Who won?


I creeped away after 70 mph. The S10 was carrying some extra weight though. A couple miles later I was cruising along and I felt a cylinder go and heard tink tink tink as the little piece of valve bounced around. It ran pretty well on 3 cylinders.


This wasn't against a guy in Bayonne, NJ who was taking video on his cellphone at the time while racing, was it?

Just wondering...


No, PA, and I knew the driver.

 

[dishdude]

Originally Posted By: Gasbuggy

I creeped away after 70 mph. The S10 was carrying some extra weight though. A couple miles later I was cruising along and I felt a cylinder go and heard tink tink tink as the little piece of valve bounced around. It ran pretty well on 3 cylinders.


I picture an old man with a walker passing on the sidewalk.

 

[andyd]

It may have the a speed run that put the kibosh on that #3 exhaust valve, But the valve lash tightens on this engine due to valve seat recession. Switch to Supertech 20w50 dino and rock on. I replaced the #4 exhaust valves on my DIL's '99 CRV

 

[nicrfe1370]

Great pics, thanks for sharing! The crud on the combustion chamber side of the valves in the second pic is incredible! That had to have made your effective compression ratio a bit higher, plus added lots of hot spots. What brand and AKI gas did you use? Did you notice preignition/detonation?

 

[Gasbuggy]

Originally Posted By: nicrfe1370
Great pics, thanks for sharing! The crud on the combustion chamber side of the valves in the second pic is incredible! That had to have made your effective compression ratio a bit higher, plus added lots of hot spots. What brand and AKI gas did you use? Did you notice preignition/detonation?


I saved those two valves as a keepsake.

I usually run Shell or Sunoco 87. Never have I had a single ping in the 12 years I've owned this car, I've been driving it since I was in high school. The old head was milled .010 when I did the head gasket job a while back.

The head that I replaced it with created an even higher compression situation. I milled the replacement junkyard head myself with 100 grit sandpaper sheets adhered to a large thick flat piece of glass. An old retired banking executive I'm friends with is a motorhead, he suggesting that method rather than have to disassemble, pay a shop, wait, reassemble. What an arm workout that was, but it did work. I went at it until the entire mating surface showed fresh aluminum.

When I compared it to my old head I realized I took off quite a bit more material than I wanted to. I estimate I took off about .030. This milled head threw off my cam timing and I had to advance 1 tooth on the cam sprocket and advance the distributor all the way to get it to run right throughout the whole power band. It picked up a little power.

 

[Gasbuggy]

Originally Posted By: andyd
It may have the a speed run that put the kibosh on that #3 exhaust valve, But the valve lash tightens on this engine due to valve seat recession. Switch to Supertech 20w50 dino and rock on. I replaced the #4 exhaust valves on my DIL's '99 CRV


I kept up with valve adjustments, they were perfect when the head was rebuilt at 278,000. I did it again around 350,000. I can't run 20w50, the thicker the oil the faster it burns. (tried it before)

 

[Olas]

Originally Posted By: KGMtech
Originally Posted By: Olas
If you think that's bad, look at the first gen. DI motors!


I'm not understanding this statement. The OP photos of the Honda show big deposits from oil burning on the valve face, but you make a comparison to Gen 1 DI engines?

Unless I am wrong, certain DI engines collect deposits on the back face and stem of the intake valves....but not on the actual valve face? am I incorrect?


You're correct re the location of the buildup, I was trying to be humorous in suggesting that DI motors have much more volume of deposit, albeit in a different location.