QS Defy is now QS"high mileage"

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I always thought it was an odd choice for a brand name from a 'word perspective'; it connotes a lot of stuff that really has nothing to do with motor oil.
 
Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
I always thought it was an odd choice for a brand name from a 'word perspective'; it connotes a lot of stuff that really has nothing to do with motor oil.


+1
 
Yeah, it's too bad. When Defy first come out, the bottles said it would prevent 98% of future wear, based on sequence IVA.
 
pretty sure -same thing at Meijer(similar to WM in the midwest) I found a couple bottles of Defy behind the new stock)
 
It's an improvement imho...Defy is a stupid name. Let's hope they stick with this now and stop changing names every couple years. They need to take a page from Mobil 1s book. My sister who doesn't know motor oil from olive oil knows what Mobil 1 is .

That being said Defy was great oil...hope they didn't change the formulation
 
Because Shell doesn't yet have enough dexos 1 oils with PP, PU, QSUD, QS dexos1 blend, and Pennzoil dexos 1 blend? They have more 5w-30 dexos1 offerings than some companies have for offerings in their entire lineup of every viscosity, let alone taking into account other dexos1 viscosities.
 
The other part of my point is that there are too many SN/GF-5 high mileage oils already. Some people want a high mileage oil that is thicker within the grade (i.e. an HTHS closer to 3.5) and has anti-wear levels that might exceed SN/GF-5 limitations, and they'd like to do that without having to find a boutique. QS Defy 5w-30 had a bit extra ZDDP and was at a sensible price. Now, the only 5w-30 options here that fit those criteria offhand are things like Royal Purple HPS and Castrol A3/B4 5w-30 at a bit more money.

This was the marketing behind Defy in the first place. Now, Defy is completely interchangeable with every other SN/GF-5 lube in Shell's lineup, when used in a basic SN/GF-5 application. What's the real difference now between Formula Shell and Defy? About 25% in pricing.
 
Originally Posted By: Garak
The other part of my point is that there are too many SN/GF-5 high mileage oils already. Some people want a high mileage oil that is thicker within the grade (i.e. an HTHS closer to 3.5) and has anti-wear levels that might exceed SN/GF-5 limitations, and they'd like to do that without having to find a boutique.


I was just looking at this
https://mobiloil.com/~/media/amer/us/pvl/files/pdfs/mobil-1-oil-product-specs-guide.pdf

The M1 HM oils all have 1100 ppm Zinc (1000 ppm P) and a decent spread of HTHS
M1 5W20 HM, HTHS = 2.7, API SL, ACEA A1/B1
M1 5W30 HM, HTHS = 3.3, API SL, ACEA A1/B1
M1 10W30 HM, HTHS = 3.5, API SL, ACEA A3/B3
M1 10W40 HM, HTHS = 3.9, API SN, ACEA A3/B3

Given that vanilla M1 5W30 has a HTHS of 3.1, and 900 ppm Zinc, the M1 HM oils look quite nice to me.

That M1 10W30 HM has my name written all over it, I wish we got that in Oz.
 
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Yes, they're a bit of an exception. One problem, however, is there a U.S. only product. The second problem is that if they were here, they would be a fully priced synthetic with not much advantage over Royal Purple HPS or RP HM or any other A3/B4 oil on the shelf.

There still are one or two non-ILSAC examples, but to me, the whole thought of high mileage oils has gone way off the rails. I'll pay $20 on sale for a high mileage non-ILSAC oil on special versus say $14 for a conventional ILSAC, all for the extra HTHS and anti-wear.

I'm not prepared to spend $20 for an ILSAC oil that meets no additional specifications beyond the conventional version which is a few dollars cheaper. An ILSAC Defy is simply a Quaker State green bottle with a bigger price tag for no discernible reason. At least Valvoline had the foresight to get a dexos1 label to differentiate their ILSAC MaxLife from VWB, which I would oppose for Defy. As I see it, Valvoline has clearly thrown in the towel on the high mileage products, but has no interest in giving up the high mileage name recognition.

I have two or three jugs of Defy left. Upon them running out, I have a very strong suspicion the F-150 will be getting Delvac Elite 222 0w-30 CJ-4/SM. It won't have an HTHS of 3.1. It won't have an ILSAC phosphorus content. And, its regular price will be cheaper than that of Defy, too. And, its synthetic components are used to actually accomplish something - class leading cold cranking numbers combined with a higher HTHS - not just justify a higher price tag.
 
I hear what you are saying Garak. A thin ILSAC high mileage oil makes no sense to me, even with a few extra seal conditioners thrown in. To me a HM oil is a working man's oil, a guy with an old car and bills to pay and no money to waste. It should be thicker to control burning, high zinc for older engine design, a few extra seal conditioners might help and mostly it should be affordable.

To me a modern HDEO with its higher HTHS & extra zinc is probably a better way to go for most people. Easy and affordable. You should be able to buy seal conditioners as an after-market product, if required, but this has never been my problem.

I like the M1 10W30 HM oil, not because it's a HM oil as such, but because it provides a decent HTHS and a good dose of zinc in a 30 weight package. Those ILSAC 30 Wt oils, just look a little too thin for me. I just like the 10W30 HM as a good quality synthetic that suits my low milage needs.

Unfortunately I looked it up on Oz eBay, and it is way too expensive. Double what I can get Edge 5W30 A3/B4 for. The Castrol Edge is SL, A3/B4 & MB229.5. So I know it has good zinc (about 1000 ppm), good HTHS (about 3.5 - 3.6), a TBN of more than 10, and a NOACK of less than 10. Everything I want.

Most of our HM oils here are like 15W-50 and up. Something with a bit of meat on it's bones.
 
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