If thin oil is so good...

[mannys9130]

Originally Posted By: Pontual
Originally Posted By: mannys9130
Originally Posted By: Pontual
Thin oils is very good! It volatises, leaks out the seals and specially burn in past the rings, past the valve seals... They disapear way more than thick! Need reiterated refilling! Are expensive and helps to destroy engines. Chinese business, as we call. Great for the producers and sellers!


Lol, lots of misinformation for a "senior poster" don't you think?

Will you educate me on oils, noob?


Sorry Pontual, I don't have the weeks and weeks it would take to educate you properly with correct information and get you to stop spouting lies.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Besides, just wait until xW-16, xW-12, or xW-8 hit the market--these conversations will be obsolete and we will hear how thick xW-20 is in comparison.


The 0W16s that we've seen are a very very different beast to the (Particularly Japanese OEM) 0W20s. They have quite low viscosity indices, and their behaviour is closer to Newtonian.

I've said it before, I would run Ravenol 0W16 in a Prius (should I ever die of boredome) well before running TGMO...

Will be interesting to see if anyone backspecs an engine that was originally specced for 5W30...that's really where the debate began.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
I wouldn't go that far...it's the advent of the 20s that has the thermal safety nannies built into engine management systems.

My G37 has it and it calls for 5w-30.

Merk: It's simple. There are no CJ-4 0w-20 oils; all CJ-4 stuff has an HTHS of 3.5 or greater. Note that there are B1 0w-20s. Are there any B1 0w-20 applications, though? By the way, when can I expect you to arrive for your weekend visit with a sump full of SAE 40? Will you be arriving tonight, so we can leave it outside overnight when it approaches -30 C? Then, we can have our limitations discussion.

By the way, if you think HDEO is so great, you're always free to use it in a gasser like I do, right?

 

[Jetronic]

Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Hi,
racin4ds - The HTHS viscosity is very important in HSH Diesel engines. Lower viscosity lubricants are being developed to provide viable HTHS viscosity that can endure extended OCIs - some of these are already on the market - I'm using Delvac 1 LE 5W-30 which is really one of these

I doubt if we'll see a 0W-20 HDEO in the short time but we may see a 5W-20 HDEO. Some 5W-20 viscosity prototype HDEOs with a HTHS viscosity of around 3.5 have been developed and tested but this process is a long process. OEMs and the Oil Companies must consider their market place and with HSH Diesel engines at least the basic lubricant must be able to survive in a mixed Fleets - old, new, petrol, diesel - and be able to be used in all!!

The research and testing has been on-going for some time now and of course the Japanese are heavily involved in this factor too


I'd buy that oil for my car!

 

[Shannow]

Gets back to the fact that J300, and the "grading" system that it contains is becoming next to useless.

HTHS matters, KV100 and the J300 gradings associated with it to a much lesser extent, and things like (say) a 5W40 with a 3.5 HTHS will waste more energy than a 5W20 with the same HTHS.

I'd use a 2.9HTHS 20W20 in my Caprice if I could find an SL 20W20.

I'd similarly use a 5W20, 3.5HTHS in my Nissan.

 

[Garak]

I'd probably try the latter, but the closest thing would be Red Line, which isn't exactly cost effective. As for the former, a 20w-20, give me some time and let's see if I can come up with a picture from one of my local suppliers.

 

[Jetronic]

I don't think a 20w-20 is viable is Saskatchewan..

 

[Pontual]

Originally Posted By: mannys9130
Originally Posted By: Pontual
Originally Posted By: mannys9130
Originally Posted By: Pontual
Thin oils is very good! It volatises, leaks out the seals and specially burn in past the rings, past the valve seals... They disapear way more than thick! Need reiterated refilling! Are expensive and helps to destroy engines. Chinese business, as we call. Great for the producers and sellers!


Lol, lots of misinformation for a "senior poster" don't you think?

Will you educate me on oils, noob?




Sorry Pontual, I don't have the weeks and weeks it would take to educate you properly with correct information and get you to stop spouting lies.


You are calling me a lier? What lies? Some people count with luck, I dont!

 

[CarbonSteel]

Originally Posted By: TFB1
I can see those xW-nothing oils being more of a problem in earlier vehicles (most all current) than the so called out of spec oils that have the lawyers swarming over Dollar General Stores... Of course they are mostly about oiling their pockets...

Originally Posted By: Shannow
The 0W16s that we've seen are a very very different beast to the (Particularly Japanese OEM) 0W20s. They have quite low viscosity indices, and their behaviour is closer to Newtonian.
I agree with both of you, but you see my point. These days the discussions center around how thin xW-20 is versus how thick xW-30/40 is. Once those new viscosities hit the market, the topic will shift to those and how the thick group will want to use xW-20/30 in the engines specified to use xW-16/12/8 because those oils are "like water".

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Jetronic
I don't think a 20w-20 is viable is Saskatchewan..

No, but I might be able to find one on the shelf. It wouldn't be the first or only non-viable oil to make its way onto Saskatchewan shelves, although some retailers and oil companies do try to do things correctly.

 

[Jetronic]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: Jetronic
I don't think a 20w-20 is viable is Saskatchewan..

No, but I might be able to find one on the shelf. It wouldn't be the first or only non-viable oil to make its way onto Saskatchewan shelves, although some retailers and oil companies do try to do things correctly.


I suppose it could work for a 6 month oci?

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi,
When I joined BITOG I was roundly and repeatedly criticised for mentioning HTHS viscosity, and ACEA was European - and what would they know??

For serious and expensive engine families and especially HHS Diesel engines this has always been a prime criteria

New lubricant viscosities for HHS Diesel engines will be driven by HTHS viscosities above 3cSt for the foreseeble future IMO and probably in the first wave the cut off point will be 3.5cSt

Shannow is correct in pointing out the fuel efficiency of certain viscosity groups and their HTHS viscosities. In the end the OEMs will move to ensure their Technologies and their Customers are supported via their Approvals processes - if not probably a little conservatively

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Jetronic
I suppose it could work for a 6 month oci?

Probably. Oddly enough, in the days of monogrades, it was among the first grades available here actually tested for cold cranking, at least at some temperature. So, it would be a much more suitable choice than an SAE 30 or something like that, for our winters. But, back in the day, I suppose, if you had no way to warm your engine and there was a cold snap, you stayed at home, or used the horses, or your feet. Next time I'm at that parts store, I'll check. If they have a 20w-20, I may have to pick up a bottle as a keepsake!

Doug: I definitely have to credit you for making me pay attention to HTHS. I cannot forget to mention Caterham in that regard, too, since he trumpeted the value of that spec, too. My father instinctively knew that a 10w-30 HDEO would be thicker than a 10w-30 PCMO back in the 1980s, although he had no clue about actually quantifying it with HTHS.

Now that you've helped to educate BITOG about the matter, do you think you could start working on parts personnel next, and the public at large?

 

[MolaKule]

Originally Posted By: cptbarkey
Originally Posted By: racin4ds
Not stirring the pot and not some troll, I just can't see the reason behind all the thin oils for nothing other than CAFE/Fuel economy. 5W30 is the absolute thinnest I will run and is in most of my vehicles.

I know diesels are different animals but they work hard, they need excellent protection and they last 2X most gasoline engines. Sure there are other factors here to consider but they don't use thin oil either!!! yes I know some of the newer, light duty stuff specs a 30w but still you don't see no 0W20!!!


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