Schaeffer's 132 Moly E.P. Oil Treatment

[Lonk]

Hello all,
I am new here. I wanted to know if Schaeffer's 132 Moly E.P. Oil Treatment will really help with rings? i do not want to rebuild the engine.
let me give you some background. i bought a 1987 monte carlo ss, all orginal with 27k orginal miles on it. the car now has 31k on it. I have had to replace the carburetor, radiator, distributor, cap, rotor, plug wires, and plugs. the car sat in a showroom its whole life.
When i first bought the car the oil pressure was showing about 18 on my dash. My good friend who is a gearhead told me to drive it for 20 minutes a day for a month with regular oil in it and then change to royal purple HPS 5w30 to clean it out. I did that and my oil pressure went up to 40 on the dash gauge. Then about a week ago it started smoking when i put my foot in it. My friend says its the rings and that we should rebuild it. My machine shop suggested i try Schaeffer's 132 Moly E.P. Oil Treatment. Will this really work or is it a waste of money? Can I use Schaeffer's 132 Moly E.P. Oil Treatment with royal purple hps?

I use the royal purple oil filter as well.

thank you
Lonk

 

[SuperDave456]

Please define "it started smoking when I put my foot in it".

Also, what's so special about this engine? What mods have been made?

Is it blue smoke? Like that from oil?
How much is it burning?

Or is it white smoke? A head gasket?

I used Schaeffer's 132 Moly E.P. Oil Treatment, it's primarily used to extend oil intervals and it is a thickener. Not the best of things to put in your car in winter.
If I remember correctly it has what Schaeffer's calls Micron Moly, which is soluble and doesn't come back on a UOA, but it also has Boron and Antimony EP additives that do a great job.
It's good stuff.
But it won't work a miracle.

 

[lubricatosaurus]

I don't see Schaeffer 132 as freeing stuck rings.

From a previous discussion, molakule recommended:
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Hi John,

Both fluids are excellent but are used for different purposes.

I too would try an ARX regime first.

You can use ARX with mineral oils so the cleaning regime would be more cost effective than using synthetic oils exclusively.

132 has low levels of AW additives with more antimony than moly and zddp, but has an excellent friction modifier and a very clean oil thickener.


When he said "both fluids" he meant Auto-RX also known as ARX, and Scheaffer 132.

 

[lubricatosaurus]

Originally Posted By: SuperDave456

If I remember correctly it has what Schaeffer's calls Micron Moly, which is soluble and doesn't come back on a UOA, but it also has Boron and Antimony EP additives that do a great job.

Schaeffer's 132 Moly EP actually contains very little moly, only a small fraction of what most motor oils have (meaning concentration ppm of course).
See the top of http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...amp;type=thread

Scheaffer has organic additives that don't show up on a UOA though, lots unknown there.
Its not a cleaner though.

 

[Toaster_Jer]

Years ago I had a friend that used an oil brand called Arco Graffite I think back in the 80s and 90's. Anyway it would cause his rings to stick. He would then use Amsoil 10w40 back then and it would safely unstick his rings. He did this several times, I asked him why not stick with Amsoil if it works for ya. But he kept going back and forth, buying 5gal. at a time. MMO will work well for that over time but I think alot of garages use Kreen. Pricey but it works! http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/1940735/1 Hope this all helps.

 

[mannys9130]

Try this test:

Start it up cold and see if it blows a cloud of smoke. Drive it around till it's warm, and then go back home and park it in the street to idle for about 5 minutes. After it's sat and idled for 5 minutes, put it in drive and take off briskly. Does it blow a big cloud of smoke and then stop?


Valve stem seals allow oil to drop down overnight and then the oil burns in a cloud when the engine is cold started. Due to high vacuum at idle, oil is pulled down the valve stems and then burned off when you take off from a red light. The vacuum subsides and the smoke usually decreases once at speed.

Rings leak oil at speed and the engine will blow smoke all the time while driving. There won't be a cloud at cold start, and it won't blow a cloud while pulling away from a light. It will always smoke.

 

[Lonk]

Originally Posted By: mannys9130
Try this test:

Start it up cold and see if it blows a cloud of smoke. Drive it around till it's warm, and then go back home and park it in the street to idle for about 5 minutes. After it's sat and idled for 5 minutes, put it in drive and take off briskly. Does it blow a big cloud of smoke and then stop?


so i tried this test and it blows a white/blueish cloud out when i take off hard then i can not see anything.

there is nothing special about the engine its a stock 305.

In the last week its been about half a quart low on oil. i do not drive it every day so maybe 3 or 4 times i drove it.

 

[SuperDave456]

Sounds like you are the perfect candidate for a High Mileage oil.
Id go with Maxlife and report back in 3000 miles.

 

[demarpaint]

First determine the color of the smoke and how much oil you use/1,000 miles before you do anything like rebuilding an engine. Once you have that information report back.

 

[Pontual]

Stop smoke

 

[Trav]

First things first, take a compression test dry then wet. With so few miles on it it might well have stuck rings.
My suggestion would be to run a can Berrymans Chemtool in the oil at idle only for 20 minutes then shut it off, do not drain the oil yet.

Remove all 8 plugs and pour a couple of ounces of GM top engine cleaner down each plug hole, reinstall the plugs lightly and leave it site a day or even 2.
Remove the plugs, crank the engine a few revolutions with a socket and ratchet on the balancer bolt.
Reinstall the plugs, drain the oil and refill with cheap dino. Fire it up and run it at 2,000 RPM for about 5 minutes then let it idle for 30 min.
Change the oil and filter, run it a few days and check the compression again.

After all that get some Kreen and run 16 oz in the oil and fuel, leave it in the oil for a about 1K and do another oil change with filter.

 

[Indiana79]

We'll if it's the 305 engine I know they were noted for valve seals going. I had an 85 k5 blazer I bought brand new with that problem and my cousin had a Monte Carlo that year he had to replace the valve seals also at a low mileage. This was back in the 80s though. I'm sure time has taken it's toll on yours.

 

[daman]

Valve seals, the car has been sitting for a long time there brittle and hard, put a new set in, problem solved.

 

[Lonk]

Originally Posted By: Trav
First things first, take a compression test dry then wet. With so few miles on it it might well have stuck rings.
My suggestion would be to run a can Berrymans Chemtool in the oil at idle only for 20 minutes then shut it off, do not drain the oil yet.

Remove all 8 plugs and pour a couple of ounces of GM top engine cleaner down each plug hole, reinstall the plugs lightly and leave it site a day or even 2.
Remove the plugs, crank the engine a few revolutions with a socket and ratchet on the balancer bolt.
Reinstall the plugs, drain the oil and refill with cheap dino. Fire it up and run it at 2,000 RPM for about 5 minutes then let it idle for 30 min.
Change the oil and filter, run it a few days and check the compression again.

After all that get some Kreen and run 16 oz in the oil and fuel, leave it in the oil for a about 1K and do another oil change with filter.


OK here is the update. I followed these steps and it worked. the car now has alot more power and drives great. it no longer smokes while driving. it has alittle smoke when i first start it. thanks for all the help. below is the before and after compression. the valve seals are bad and ill replace them in spring.

Being the first time i have ever done this i would like to share some insight.

the biggest mistake i made was not leaving it in long enough the first time. I left it in for about two hours the first time. the second time i left it in for about 30 hours. just follow Trav post to the letter and it will work for you.

many thanks Trav.

compression before treatment.
1. 112
2. 118
3. 76
4. 120
5. 110
6. 116
7. 119
8. 121

compression after 2nd treament

1. 149
2. 142
3. 138
4. 140
5. 145
6. 140
7. 139
8. 141

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Lonk
Originally Posted By: Trav
First things first, take a compression test dry then wet. With so few miles on it it might well have stuck rings.
My suggestion would be to run a can Berrymans Chemtool in the oil at idle only for 20 minutes then shut it off, do not drain the oil yet.

Remove all 8 plugs and pour a couple of ounces of GM top engine cleaner down each plug hole, reinstall the plugs lightly and leave it site a day or even 2.
Remove the plugs, crank the engine a few revolutions with a socket and ratchet on the balancer bolt.
Reinstall the plugs, drain the oil and refill with cheap dino. Fire it up and run it at 2,000 RPM for about 5 minutes then let it idle for 30 min.
Change the oil and filter, run it a few days and check the compression again.

After all that get some Kreen and run 16 oz in the oil and fuel, leave it in the oil for a about 1K and do another oil change with filter.


OK here is the update. I followed these steps and it worked. the car now has alot more power and drives great. it no longer smokes while driving. it has alittle smoke when i first start it. thanks for all the help. below is the before and after compression. the valve seals are bad and ill replace them in spring.

Being the first time i have ever done this i would like to share some insight.

the biggest mistake i made was not leaving it in long enough the first time. I left it in for about two hours the first time. the second time i left it in for about 30 hours. just follow Trav post to the letter and it will work for you.

many thanks Trav.

compression before treatment.
1. 112
2. 118
3. 76
4. 120
5. 110
6. 116
7. 119
8. 121

compression after 2nd treament

1. 149
2. 142
3. 138
4. 140
5. 145
6. 140
7. 139
8. 141



Trav knows!

Those results are very good, especially cylinder #3. In 20K miles I'd repeat his final step.

 

[Lonk]

i can not tell you how happy i am. the last thing i wanted was to rebuild the engine. my best friend has been helping with this. He is a gear head and he was amazed at how well this work. To be honest he thought it was snake oil with some smoke and mirror type stuff. Now that is all he talks about. We both learned alot from this, thanks again.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Lonk
i can not tell you how happy i am. the last thing i wanted was to rebuild the engine. my best friend has been helping with this. He is a gear head and he was amazed at how well this work. To be honest he thought it was snake oil with some smoke and mirror type stuff. Now that is all he talks about. We both learned alot from this, thanks again.



If an engine is having issues, due to sticking rings or are gummed up and not from worn or broken parts, procedures like Trav suggested and others can work. Not all of these products are snake oils, some of them actually work in situations like yours.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: Lonk

many thanks Trav.

compression before treatment.
1. 112
2. 118
3. 76
4. 120
5. 110
6. 116
7. 119
8. 121

compression after 2nd treament

1. 149
2. 142
3. 138
4. 140
5. 145
6. 140
7. 139
8. 141

It would be very rare for an engine with so few miles to have worn out rings, so its just a matter of getting things unstuck and working properly again.
The numbers look good and a huge improvement. Its only going to get better.