Valvoline Synthetic is a good fluid and available at most parts stores and Walmart.
Reason to use DOT 3 brake fluid instead of DOT 4?
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I was just saying I heard DOT 4 was more hygroscopic. In any case, the difference is indeed minimal, but I might as well get something with a slightly higher BP.
BTW Heavy-Duty DOT 3 Ford Brake Fluid is supposed to be just as good or better than most DOT 4 brake fluids on the shelf. "Good stuff" is what most Mustang owners refer to it as.
BTW Heavy-Duty DOT 3 Ford Brake Fluid is supposed to be just as good or better than most DOT 4 brake fluids on the shelf. "Good stuff" is what most Mustang owners refer to it as.
You might find that that Ford DOT3 brake fluid has a very high dry boiling point but does not qualify as DOT4 due to a low wet boiling point. It would be good for competition where the system is flushed often but not so good for a car where the brake fluid is never changed.quote:
Originally posted by metroplex:
.....
BTW Heavy-Duty DOT 3 Ford Brake Fluid is supposed to be just as good or better than most DOT 4 brake fluids on the shelf. "Good stuff" is what most Mustang owners refer to it as.
Ken
It's one of the most hygroscropic of the bunch. I do an annual flush using Valvoline or ATE, I'd do a twice a year flush with Ford fluid.
Saw motorweek this morning. Pat Goss was describing fluid specifications, and he mentioned that GM has put out a technical bulletin that if DOT-4 is used where DOT-3 is recommended, warranty coverage could be voided. He mentioned that DOT-4 has a higher boiling point.
I would assume that DOT-3 has some better hygroscopic and maybe even lubricating qualities that make it a better long-term fluid.
I would assume that DOT-3 has some better hygroscopic and maybe even lubricating qualities that make it a better long-term fluid.
how would any dealer know if you had dot3 or dot4 in your vehicle in order to use that as a reason to not honor your warranty????
Originally posted by S2000driver:
[QB] FYI-
Here's more info about the Honda fluid, if you care.
Why must I use Genuine Honda DOT 3 brake fluid?
Genuine Honda DOT 3 brake fluid is formulated to minimize water absorption under all conditions.
When tested in a mass spectrometer, Honda Brake Fluid had dramatically less dissolved copper material than the leading competitors, clear proof of superior corrosion protection.
Copper?Does Honda use copper or brass brake components? I have seen old master cylinders that were sleeved in brass, but I assumed they were retrofits. Sure a big surprise when you run a hone through them.
For a quality brake bleeder that is price about right, check out the Motive Products "Power Bleeder." The product is well made and works so well that its almost silly. It actually makes the job almost fun. I like the Ate Super Blue too. I alternate it with the Ate amber (same fluid, just not blue) so I know when I've done a complete flush.
www.motiveproducts.com
www.motiveproducts.com
Unlike what I (and others) had thought, there seems to be an industry-wide movement BACK to DOT3. I'll have to look at the language in my '03 Nissan's manual ... but it is obvious that they want the owner to use only a DOT3 fluid.
I used to use Castrol LMA (DOT4) and then switched to Valvoline Synpower (DOT4) ... but neither of those companies particularly thrill me these days.
Don't know what to use in the Nissan ... even as a top-off fluid.
I don't like the idea of using a cheapo-brand brake DOT3 fluid ... and I don't want to pad the coffers of the Nissan dealerships by buying an over-priced OEM fluid.
--- Bror Jace
I would however, like to thank mikeinaustin for resurrecting an old thread about brake fluid ... instead of creating a new one!
I used to use Castrol LMA (DOT4) and then switched to Valvoline Synpower (DOT4) ... but neither of those companies particularly thrill me these days.
Don't know what to use in the Nissan ... even as a top-off fluid.
I don't like the idea of using a cheapo-brand brake DOT3 fluid ... and I don't want to pad the coffers of the Nissan dealerships by buying an over-priced OEM fluid.
--- Bror Jace
I would however, like to thank mikeinaustin for resurrecting an old thread about brake fluid ... instead of creating a new one!
The Valvoline Synpower I use is rated DOT 3/4 (I hope).
My Honda car calls for DOT 3, my Honda bike calls for DOT. Both get the Synpower.
The only difference I know of is 4 has higher wet and dry boiling specs and allows a slighty higher viscosity @40C. Specs for stability and effect on rubber are the same.
Edit: I havn't seen corrosion specs.
[ May 02, 2003, 11:23 AM: Message edited by: satterfi ]
My Honda car calls for DOT 3, my Honda bike calls for DOT. Both get the Synpower.
The only difference I know of is 4 has higher wet and dry boiling specs and allows a slighty higher viscosity @40C. Specs for stability and effect on rubber are the same.
Edit: I havn't seen corrosion specs.
[ May 02, 2003, 11:23 AM: Message edited by: satterfi ]
Here is the deal....
DOT 5 the best!! "water will go to the lowest point and cause rust in the calipers". SHOW ME!! "DOT 5 will give you a spongy pedal" SHOW ME!!
"DOT 5 won't work with ABS" SHOW ME!!
Anyone who says that DOT 5 is no good and shouldn't be used has their head in the sand.Prove to me any of these facts,show me the proof that these problems have occured.
I have used DOT 5 fluid for many years,it simply is the best brake fluid made.
Originally used in aircraft because of it's higher boiling point,and the fact it doesn't corrode.
U.S. Postal Service vehicles are all filled with DOT 5,and they do not have brake problems,they just wear out pads and shoes.
Old wives tales on DOT 5 have been circulating for years.But when somebody says it's "no good" I ask them where's the proof.I have yet to have anyone show me this stuff is bad.All I hear is "someone told me".
DOT 5 the best!! "water will go to the lowest point and cause rust in the calipers". SHOW ME!! "DOT 5 will give you a spongy pedal" SHOW ME!!
"DOT 5 won't work with ABS" SHOW ME!!
Anyone who says that DOT 5 is no good and shouldn't be used has their head in the sand.Prove to me any of these facts,show me the proof that these problems have occured.
I have used DOT 5 fluid for many years,it simply is the best brake fluid made.
Originally used in aircraft because of it's higher boiling point,and the fact it doesn't corrode.
U.S. Postal Service vehicles are all filled with DOT 5,and they do not have brake problems,they just wear out pads and shoes.
Old wives tales on DOT 5 have been circulating for years.But when somebody says it's "no good" I ask them where's the proof.I have yet to have anyone show me this stuff is bad.All I hear is "someone told me".
Chris 2421
I accept the challange.
Minimum specifications
The dry BP of Valvoline Synpower is 500ºF. The equal of DOT 5. I don't know the wet BP, but it's a non issue for people like you and me since we maintain our brake systems.
There's a reason manufactures don't use DOT 5. It might be that they are afraid that someone will add DOT 3 to it. Or it might be that the issue of aeration is actually true or the difficulty of getting water out is the problem. I don't know.
I won't be switching to DOT 5 because the Postal Service uses it.
I accept the challange.
Minimum specifications
It looks like DOT 5.1 is the winner.
The dry BP of Valvoline Synpower is 500ºF. The equal of DOT 5. I don't know the wet BP, but it's a non issue for people like you and me since we maintain our brake systems.
There's a reason manufactures don't use DOT 5. It might be that they are afraid that someone will add DOT 3 to it. Or it might be that the issue of aeration is actually true or the difficulty of getting water out is the problem. I don't know.
I won't be switching to DOT 5 because the Postal Service uses it.
CHRIS 2421,
Is the California State Automobile Assn. (AAA) authoritative enough for you?
"Silicone DOT 5 fluid has some other characteristics that you should beware of. Silicone fluid compresses slightly under pressure, which can cause a slightly spongy brake pedal feel. Silicone fluid also attracts air more than polyglycol fluid does, which makes brake bleeding harder. It also tends to vaporize slightly just below its boiling point; and it will aerate from prolonged vibration. All of these factors mean that DOT 5 silicone fluid should never be used in an antilock brake system."
http://www.csaa.com/global/articledetail/0,8055,1004010302%7C2026,00.html
Here's what Raybestos says:
" DOT 5 (silicone) fluid should never be used on a vehicle equipped with an ABS brake system."
http://www.raybestos.com/OnLineTraining/cpt-005.htm
I'm convinced.
Ken
Is the California State Automobile Assn. (AAA) authoritative enough for you?
"Silicone DOT 5 fluid has some other characteristics that you should beware of. Silicone fluid compresses slightly under pressure, which can cause a slightly spongy brake pedal feel. Silicone fluid also attracts air more than polyglycol fluid does, which makes brake bleeding harder. It also tends to vaporize slightly just below its boiling point; and it will aerate from prolonged vibration. All of these factors mean that DOT 5 silicone fluid should never be used in an antilock brake system."
http://www.csaa.com/global/articledetail/0,8055,1004010302%7C2026,00.html
Here's what Raybestos says:
" DOT 5 (silicone) fluid should never be used on a vehicle equipped with an ABS brake system."
http://www.raybestos.com/OnLineTraining/cpt-005.htm
I'm convinced.
Ken
Here's more information from Bel-Ray regarding DOT 5 versus the others.
Seems like DOT 5 isn't so hot.
Bel-Ray on Brake Fluid
Seems like DOT 5 isn't so hot.
Bel-Ray on Brake Fluid
Don't quote articles,SHOW ME THAT IT'S THE BAD STUFF YOU SAY IT IS.Show me the rusted calipers,the spongy pedals,the anti lock system that either failed or doesn't work properly anymore because of DOT 5 brake fluid.I have said this for years and not one person has proven it to me.The state of California certainly isn't an authority,just look at the smog they still have.
As I stated before,I've been using it for years.I'll admit,I was hesitant on it's use until I saw a neighbor using it in his Studebaker.I thought then I'd give it a try.It flat works the best.I use it in my race car,doesn't affect the stopping ability and my line lock solenoid still functions after 20 years.
As I stated before,I've been using it for years.I'll admit,I was hesitant on it's use until I saw a neighbor using it in his Studebaker.I thought then I'd give it a try.It flat works the best.I use it in my race car,doesn't affect the stopping ability and my line lock solenoid still functions after 20 years.
Well, Chris, you're certainly entitled to your opinion. But when considering a safety-related service decision based on 2nd hand anecdotal commentary or documented evidence based on controlled testing, I'll choose the latter.
[ May 05, 2003, 11:46 PM: Message edited by: Ray H ]
[ May 05, 2003, 11:46 PM: Message edited by: Ray H ]
Documents are just that.I still have yet to see any documented evidence that this stuff is bad to use.I've seen reports/documents that "suggest" or state not to use,but have never cited any reason why.If it was bad,why is the miltary using it??And the other 2 links...AAA?? When did they become an authority?? All the links I read have never said it's bad or will give problems.The anti lock statement is bogus,a well known national fleet is using DOT 5 in their Fords with no problems.
[ May 07, 2003, 12:24 AM: Message edited by: Chris 2421 ]
[ May 07, 2003, 12:24 AM: Message edited by: Chris 2421 ]
Originally Posted By: Chris 2421
Don't quote articles,SHOW ME THAT IT'S THE BAD STUFF YOU SAY IT IS.Show me the rusted calipers,the spongy pedals,the anti lock system that either failed or doesn't work properly anymore because of DOT 5 brake fluid.I have said this for years and not one person has proven it to me.The state of California certainly isn't an authority,just look at the smog they still have.
As I stated before,I've been using it for years.I'll admit,I was hesitant on it's use until I saw a neighbor using it in his Studebaker.I thought then I'd give it a try.It flat works the best.I use it in my race car,doesn't affect the stopping ability and my line lock solenoid still functions after 20 years.
Ok smart guy, provide the same proof of DOT 5's superiority which you are demanding of others.
Don't quote articles,SHOW ME THAT IT'S THE BAD STUFF YOU SAY IT IS.Show me the rusted calipers,the spongy pedals,the anti lock system that either failed or doesn't work properly anymore because of DOT 5 brake fluid.I have said this for years and not one person has proven it to me.The state of California certainly isn't an authority,just look at the smog they still have.
As I stated before,I've been using it for years.I'll admit,I was hesitant on it's use until I saw a neighbor using it in his Studebaker.I thought then I'd give it a try.It flat works the best.I use it in my race car,doesn't affect the stopping ability and my line lock solenoid still functions after 20 years.
Ok smart guy, provide the same proof of DOT 5's superiority which you are demanding of others.
Originally Posted By: wgtoys
Originally Posted By: Chris 2421
Don't quote articles,SHOW ME THAT IT'S THE BAD STUFF YOU SAY IT IS.Show me the rusted calipers,the spongy pedals,the anti lock system that either failed or doesn't work properly anymore because of DOT 5 brake fluid.I have said this for years and not one person has proven it to me.The state of California certainly isn't an authority,just look at the smog they still have.
As I stated before,I've been using it for years.I'll admit,I was hesitant on it's use until I saw a neighbor using it in his Studebaker.I thought then I'd give it a try.It flat works the best.I use it in my race car,doesn't affect the stopping ability and my line lock solenoid still functions after 20 years.
Ok smart guy, provide the same proof of DOT 5's superiority which you are demanding of others.
You do realize that post was from 2003 right? Although that guy may have had bad information lol
Originally Posted By: Chris 2421
Don't quote articles,SHOW ME THAT IT'S THE BAD STUFF YOU SAY IT IS.Show me the rusted calipers,the spongy pedals,the anti lock system that either failed or doesn't work properly anymore because of DOT 5 brake fluid.I have said this for years and not one person has proven it to me.The state of California certainly isn't an authority,just look at the smog they still have.
As I stated before,I've been using it for years.I'll admit,I was hesitant on it's use until I saw a neighbor using it in his Studebaker.I thought then I'd give it a try.It flat works the best.I use it in my race car,doesn't affect the stopping ability and my line lock solenoid still functions after 20 years.
Ok smart guy, provide the same proof of DOT 5's superiority which you are demanding of others.
You do realize that post was from 2003 right? Although that guy may have had bad information lol
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