BMW N54 Engine - best oil at the present?

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Hi bitogers, just picked myself up a BMW 1M. It has the N54 engine in it, and yes it runs rather warm oil temp wise. My car does have a factory oil cooler and oil temp gauge, but the thermostat for the oil cooler opens quite high, and cruising oil temps in ambient temps of 15-30*C are approximately 115*C (239*F). However the oil cooler seems to do a decent job, with oil temps not exceeding 120*C (248*F) when driven spiritedly in the hills. Although 120*C isn't super high for a high power turbo car pushed hard, the normal operating temp to me does seem high. My 2003 Evo 8 (320wkw on E85) cruised at 88*C and my Golf R cruised at ~92*C. I'd hit 115*C in the hills with the evo, and around 110*C in the Golf.

I can do a mod on the oil cooler thermostat to have the oil cooler constantly used, but warm up times and cruise temps are impacted, with cruise temps post mod around 93*C and warm up times increased. This scared some off it, personally I think 93*C is fine for cruise, temps would head over 100*C when pushed for sure.

I've read the following 335i thread where fuel dilution and oil temps were off the chain, exceeding 140*C. Some 335i's did not have an oil cooler from factory and some did, so not sure if the temps reported in the below thread are reflective of a vehicle equipped with one or not.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/981162/13

However that thread ends in 2009 and I was wondering what the current thoughts are on this engine.

I am worried about the condition of my oil and now that the car is in my possession, and given I plan to keep it long-term I want to establish an appropriate OCI and choose the most suitable oil.

Right now, I am thinking of doing 5000 - 10,000 OCI with German Castrol 0W-30 (Belgian made) as it's ~$98 per change (sump volume = 6.5L) then doing a UOA to see how it's going.

Any thoughts on other oils or current data on this engine are welcome!
 
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Australia is going to make it tougher for us mostly in the USA.

Im planning to use Pennzoil Platinum 5w-40 on my next N55 oil change (due because of time, not miles).

IMO the best thing is to look at lowest NOACK, crossed with best cold flow/startup characteristics... Narrower spread of a 0w-30 may help, but not sure what NOACK is on that. You might look at Shell or whatever the vendor of GTL lubes is in your area...
 
I'd trust BMW on the oil cooler and wouldn't try to fix something that's not broken.

They could have easily made that cooler open at lower temperature. There must be a good reason why it was chosen.
 
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Australia is going to make it tougher for us mostly in the USA.

Im planning to use Pennzoil Platinum 5w-40 on my next N55 oil change (due because of time, not miles).

IMO the best thing is to look at lowest NOACK, crossed with best cold flow/startup characteristics... Narrower spread of a 0w-30 may help, but not sure what NOACK is on that. You might look at Shell or whatever the vendor of GTL lubes is in your area...


I can get Shell Helix Ultra 5w-40 but it's Group 3 nothing special. Lowest NOACK SAE 30 I can get is Redline 5w30 but that will cost me $160 per oil change which is getting up there. I can get Amsoil SS 5w30 for $119 / 7 quarts, NOACK 7.5% and seems to review well?

Originally Posted By: cat843
Expect to see Cu in the UOA from the oil cooler.


I think they're Alu? Or maybe internally they're copper, unsure but thanks for the tip.

Originally Posted By: Brybo86
possible to change the thermostat in the cooler circuit?


Yep I can, mentioned that in my post as an option to get oil temps down. I can either delete entirely (I ordered the bypass kit just now) or leave it stock, there's no low temp thermostat option. The delete drops cruise temps to about 200F so I would much prefer that to 240F! I will drive it properly on the weekends and get the temp over 212F so moisture won't accumulate.
 
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I think oil temps below 100C (212F)are more damaging these days than oil temps over 110-115C, given how stable modern oils are. I wouldn't worry at all about those oil temperatures at cruise- the benefits of keeping volatiles baked out of the oil far, FAR outweigh any potential oxidation concerns (which, for today's better oils, aren't really a concern until over 300F.

Leave it alone!
 
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
I think oil temps below 100C (212F)are more damaging these days than oil temps over 110-115C, given how stable modern oils are. I wouldn't worry at all about those oil temperatures at cruise- the benefits of keeping volatiles baked out of the oil far, FAR outweigh any potential oxidation concerns (which, for today's better oils, aren't really a concern until over 300F.

Leave it alone!



From the reading I was doing the N54 is brutally hard on oil, and recommended OCI, even with M1 0W-40 was 1000 miles. Which is ridiculous. The mode of degradation was two fold, high temps and fuel dilution - it's all in the thread I linked in my OP. That's what has freaked me out a bit over this engine. I've never had an engine run at >100*C at cruise, BMW apparently did it for emmissions/efficiency but I care about safety, wear rate much more than a little fuel efficiency loss. My concern is finding an oil this engine wont destroy. How does Amsoil SS 5w-30 compare to M1 0W-40 and GC 0w-30 in your opinion? They're all within a few $ of each other, M1 being the most expensive at $137 per change, Amsoil SS 5w-30 $119, GC 0w-30 $98.

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Castrol 0W40 or M1 0W40. I know you do not need 0 oils, but still HTHS and NOACK of these oils is really good.


According to the BITOG thread I linked in the OP apparently these engines destroy M1 0w-40 and many other decent oils in
Originally Posted By: BMWTurboDzl
BMW dealer (Shell GTL) 5w30? It's competitively priced in the US.


Possibly, they recently changed to Shell from Castrol OEM but not sure how this stacks up wear/lifespan wise.
 
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You do not want to run Amsoil SS 5W30 -- HTHS is 3.1 instead of 3.5 or greater. If you are considering Amsoil, look at their Euro offerings.

While I think the Pennzoil/Shell Euro 5W40, Castrol 0W30 or 0W40, or Mobil 1 0W40 would be fine, you could consider Red Line 5W30, 5W40, or 10W40. Most all of their oils have low NOACK and are durable under high temperatures.

Originally Posted By: oilnub
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
I think oil temps below 100C (212F)are more damaging these days than oil temps over 110-115C, given how stable modern oils are. I wouldn't worry at all about those oil temperatures at cruise- the benefits of keeping volatiles baked out of the oil far, FAR outweigh any potential oxidation concerns (which, for today's better oils, aren't really a concern until over 300F.

Leave it alone!



From the reading I was doing the N54 is brutally hard on oil, and recommended OCI, even with M1 0W-40 was 1000 miles. Which is ridiculous. The mode of degradation was two fold, high temps and fuel dilution - it's all in the thread I linked in my OP. That's what has freaked me out a bit over this engine. I've never had an engine run at >100*C at cruise, BMW apparently did it for emmissions/efficiency but I care about safety, wear rate much more than a little fuel efficiency loss. My concern is finding an oil this engine wont destroy. How does Amsoil SS 5w-30 compare to M1 0W-40 and GC 0w-30 in your opinion? They're all within a few $ of each other, M1 being the most expensive at $137 per change, Amsoil SS 5w-30 $119, GC 0w-30 $98.

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Castrol 0W40 or M1 0W40. I know you do not need 0 oils, but still HTHS and NOACK of these oils is really good.


According to the BITOG thread I linked in the OP apparently these engines destroy M1 0w-40 and many other decent oils in
Originally Posted By: BMWTurboDzl
BMW dealer (Shell GTL) 5w30? It's competitively priced in the US.


Possibly, they recently changed to Shell from Castrol OEM but not sure how this stacks up wear/lifespan wise.
 
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Use BMW 5W-30 or M1 0W-40; either will work fine. Get a UOA at 2,000 and see what is going on.
 
Sounds very much as though you will be changing frequently so, to me, NOACK may not have time to catch up to you in a major way. What about Penrite HPR5 or full race for that matter?
 
Joe Gibbs DT 40 (5W-40). Developed for water cooled Porsche flat 6 motors due to the higher temps that these motors develop and consequently beak down conventional oils. Porsche gurus recommend it.
 
Originally Posted By: oilnub
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
I think oil temps below 100C (212F)are more damaging these days than oil temps over 110-115C, given how stable modern oils are. I wouldn't worry at all about those oil temperatures at cruise- the benefits of keeping volatiles baked out of the oil far, FAR outweigh any potential oxidation concerns (which, for today's better oils, aren't really a concern until over 300F.

Leave it alone!



From the reading I was doing the N54 is brutally hard on oil, and recommended OCI, even with M1 0W-40 was 1000 miles. Which is ridiculous. The mode of degradation was two fold, high temps and fuel dilution - it's all in the thread I linked in my OP. That's what has freaked me out a bit over this engine. I've never had an engine run at >100*C at cruise, BMW apparently did it for emmissions/efficiency but I care about safety, wear rate much more than a little fuel efficiency loss. My concern is finding an oil this engine wont destroy. How does Amsoil SS 5w-30 compare to M1 0W-40 and GC 0w-30 in your opinion?


Honestly, the more you tell me about it the more I emphatically believe you should NOT lower the oil temperature. With fuel dilution being a significant problem, keeping the oil temp high ONLY helps. Oxidation is simply not a problem for oils like M1 below 300F. The wear vs temp curve minimum is between about 210 and 250 F, so the engine is good there, too. I really think BMW runs the oil hot not for efficiency or emissions, but to fight fuel dilution as much as possible.

I don't specifially know anything about the Amsoil SS 10w30, so I can't comment there. M1 is pretty hard to beat in most applications and so is Castrol 0w40 (and the somewhat outdated 0w30 for that matter), but I'm not saying there isn't a better option for a BMW. My only strong opinion here is to let the oil temperaure stay where the factory put it.

As for being concerned, I can tell you that higher oil temps are fairly common these days. My SRT is a comparatively low power-density engine, normally aspirated, and comes in a version with a little less compression and milder cam that makes a great HD pickup engine... and yet it cruises with an oil temperature of 220-225F, going into the 230s with spirited driving, and people who road-course their SRTs report 300F at the end of a session. Temps in the mid 200s are a net good thing. Even moreso on dilution prone DI engines like yours.

Just my $.02
 
Originally Posted By: oilnub


From the reading I was doing the N54 is brutally hard on oil, and recommended OCI, even with M1 0W-40 was 1000 miles. Which is ridiculous. The mode of degradation was two fold, high temps and fuel dilution - it's all in the thread I linked in my OP. That's what has freaked me out a bit over this engine. I've never had an engine run at >100*C at cruise, BMW apparently did it for emmissions/efficiency but I care about safety, wear rate much more than a little fuel efficiency loss. My concern is finding an oil this engine wont destroy. How does Amsoil SS 5w-30 compare to M1 0W-40 and GC 0w-30 in your opinion? They're all within a few $ of each other, M1 being the most expensive at $137 per change, Amsoil SS 5w-30 $119, GC 0w-30 $98.

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Castrol 0W40 or M1 0W40. I know you do not need 0 oils, but still HTHS and NOACK of these oils is really good.


According to the BITOG thread I linked in the OP apparently these engines destroy M1 0w-40 and many other decent oils in
Originally Posted By: BMWTurboDzl
BMW dealer (Shell GTL) 5w30? It's competitively priced in the US.


Possibly, they recently changed to Shell from Castrol OEM but not sure how this stacks up wear/lifespan wise.


My M5 (S62) fuel diluted like crazy, it is pretty common for a high performance engine. It did not however, run "high" oil temps, with temps staying in the low to mid 90's under cruise.

HOWEVER

100C isn't hot for oil. If you have a coolant/oil heat exchanger, the oil is going to run very close to the coolant temperature and that's perfectly normal (and desirable). Also, if an engine is fuel diluting, running the oil hotter to get rid of that fuel is also sensible.

I have not taken a look at the linked thread but I'm curious as to how the oil is "done" in 1000 miles. I ran M1 0w-40 in my S62 at 6,000 mile intervals roughly and other than being full of fuel it held up very well.

BTW, my current rig also has a coolant/oil heat exchanger and these are my cruise temps:

SRT8Temps01.jpg
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: oilnub


From the reading I was doing the N54 is brutally hard on oil, and recommended OCI, even with M1 0W-40 was 1000 miles. Which is ridiculous. The mode of degradation was two fold, high temps and fuel dilution - it's all in the thread I linked in my OP. That's what has freaked me out a bit over this engine. I've never had an engine run at >100*C at cruise, BMW apparently did it for emmissions/efficiency but I care about safety, wear rate much more than a little fuel efficiency loss. My concern is finding an oil this engine wont destroy. How does Amsoil SS 5w-30 compare to M1 0W-40 and GC 0w-30 in your opinion? They're all within a few $ of each other, M1 being the most expensive at $137 per change, Amsoil SS 5w-30 $119, GC 0w-30 $98.

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Castrol 0W40 or M1 0W40. I know you do not need 0 oils, but still HTHS and NOACK of these oils is really good.


According to the BITOG thread I linked in the OP apparently these engines destroy M1 0w-40 and many other decent oils in
Originally Posted By: BMWTurboDzl
BMW dealer (Shell GTL) 5w30? It's competitively priced in the US.


Possibly, they recently changed to Shell from Castrol OEM but not sure how this stacks up wear/lifespan wise.


My M5 (S62) fuel diluted like crazy, it is pretty common for a high performance engine. It did not however, run "high" oil temps, with temps staying in the low to mid 90's under cruise.

HOWEVER

100C isn't hot for oil. If you have a coolant/oil heat exchanger, the oil is going to run very close to the coolant temperature and that's perfectly normal (and desirable). Also, if an engine is fuel diluting, running the oil hotter to get rid of that fuel is also sensible.

I have not taken a look at the linked thread but I'm curious as to how the oil is "done" in 1000 miles. I ran M1 0w-40 in my S62 at 6,000 mile intervals roughly and other than being full of fuel it held up very well.

BTW, my current rig also has a coolant/oil heat exchanger and these are my cruise temps:

SRT8Temps01.jpg



IIRC Dyson said back in '07 or so suggested the ridiculously short interval. Personally I believe the dilution issues with regards to N54 UOA's were either sampling errors, poor break-in, short tripping or a combination thereof.
 
Originally Posted By: BMWTurboDz


IIRC Dyson said back in '07 or so suggested the ridiculously short interval. Personally I believe the dilution issues with regards to N54 UOA's were either sampling errors, poor break-in, short tripping or a combination thereof.


Gotcha. I think there's some seriously unfounded fears based on some very dated information that the OP has looked at. I would have no problem running M1 0w-40 at 10K (Km) intervals in the N54. Probably do a few UOA's to make sure nothing crazy is going on, but it should be fine.
 
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