Florida No-fault insurance confusion.

[zach1900]

We recently moved from a normal ins.state to a no-fault state and I am being offered "uninsured motorist" protection here added to my policy, if your own ins. company is responsible regardless of fault what would it matter if the other driver was insured or not? and furthermore does this erase good driver discount considering fault isn't assigned anywhere ?(the ins. agent says that it's if the other driver is at fault and has no ins., yet we live in a no-fault state) I already know the basics from the natives Floridians here as to why insurance is generally higher here, but you aren't allowed to actually say it, and it ain't old people, but I digress (my insurance is about 3X higher here than a major mid-west city and it has nothing to do with covering actual cars), also if no-fault is to reduce the likelihood of lawsuits why are there lawyers on every corner asking if you've been in a car accident?

 

[Wolf359]

MA is also a no fault state. Basically you just buy the whole thing. Basically no fault just means each insurance company covers their own drivers instead of always suing the other insurance company. Doesn't really affect anything else. You buy uninsured motorist coverage because if they hit you, your policy doesn't really cover you, it only covers you if you cause the accident. So always buy under insured and uninsured coverage. I think it come into play where someone rear ends you and you have extensive medical bills, uninsured and under insured will cover you, but your coverage doesn't cover you enough. It probably doesn't make as much sense if you're just thinking about collision or comprehensive.

 

[zach1900]

So if somebody rear ends me I get the pleasure of paying the deductible to fix my or replace my car?

 

[zrxkawboy]

Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Basically no fault just means each insurance company covers their own drivers instead of always suing the other insurance company... You buy uninsured motorist coverage because if they hit you, your policy doesn't really cover you, it only covers you if you cause the accident.


Don't these two statements contradict each other?

 

[Drew99GT]

No fault only applies to medical bills; property damage liability is still dependent on whether you have collision if you're at fault, or whether you have uninsured motorist if the other party is at fault but doesn't have insurance.

 

[zach1900]

So if some body plowed into me at a stop light , my insurance would pay any medical and the other guy's would pay for my car repair/replacement?

 

[Kawiguy454]

I lived in Miami for 5 years. If you have good credit score by far state farm was best deal. High theft, fraud and lots of uninsured are the main reasons why costs are so high ...oh and the fact that many of the drivers learned to drive on burros somewhere else. ;-)

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: zach1900
So if some body plowed into me at a stop light , my insurance would pay any medical and the other guy's would pay for my car repair/replacement?


Yup. That is why uninsured motorist property damage is essential. In traditional tort states, you can buy 2 forms of uninsured motorist; property damage and personal injury protection. You don't need uninsured personal injury protection in a no fault state.

 

[zach1900]

Awesome, thank's Drew, you I understand! It's just weird that uninsured bodily injury is so high here in a no-fault state.

 

[SeaJay]

Originally Posted By: zach1900
So if some body plowed into me at a stop light , my insurance would pay any medical and the other guy's would pay for my car repair/replacement?


Yes, assuming the other driver was insured (not always the case) and that the negligence of the other driver was not in dispute. Sometimes, the other driver will claim in this situation that you jammed on your brakes at a green light. If there is not witnesses, your own insurance company may just pay the claim for your vehicle, minus the deductible and call it a day. They will tell you to take the other driver to court if you think you can prove his negligence, which you probably will not be able to do.

This does not seem right, of course. But this is the way the world sometimes works when an accident takes place with no witnesses.

 

[zach1900]

If you rear end somebody, you were to close , isn't that pretty much universal conclusion?

 

[zach1900]

I only see an option to add uninsured for medical, not property.

 

[zach1900]

uninsured bodily injury "Applies if it is determined that other driver was at fault and has no or insufficient coverage" at fault in a no fault state?

 

[DeepFriar]

There is more bad news on this "No Fault" issue. And that is it will likely be necessary for you to sue your own insurance company (I'm looking at you State Farm) for your medical expenses if they exceed what they think they should be (somehow that is never as high as what it costs).

My daughter was T-boned at a four way stop by an uninsured driver (she had uninsured coverage) in Clearwater three years ago. She had State Farm coverage as we have had on cars/house, you name it, for over thirty years. She was badly injured with side and shoulder damage that required two surgeries. BTW the side airbag failed to deploy in this HONDA ACCORD.

It took two years of suing State Farm to get them to pay the doctors or hospitals involved. So, in the end, they pay for the medical costs AND the legal costs. Their plan apparently is to make as difficult as possible to collect in hopes you will give up and pay the lion's share yourself. Some coverage, some company, some No Fault. Grrrrrr

 

[Drew99GT]

Good lord no fault insurance is complicated; no wonder Colorado ditched it a decade ago!

Here are a few links I found pertaining to Florida; Colorado has and had (when no fault was the law) separate uninsured motorist coverage for property damage and medical. I guess Florida doesn't???

http://www.howellthornhill.com/uninsured-motorist-coverage.php

http://www.brandon-personal-injury-lawyer.com/PA-auto-insurance-lawyer.htm

This is why no fault insurance states are so expensive; the PIP/no fault part is very small by statute and covers a myriad of things and if you want better coverage with higher limits, you have to buy it.

 

[dlayman]

Originally Posted By: DeepFriar
There is more bad news on this "No Fault" issue. And that is it will likely be necessary for you to sue your own insurance company (I'm looking at you State Farm) for your medical expenses if they exceed what they think they should be (somehow that is never as high as what it costs).

My daughter was T-boned at a four way stop by an uninsured driver (she had uninsured coverage) in Clearwater three years ago. She had State Farm coverage as we have had on cars/house, you name it, for over thirty years. She was badly injured with side and shoulder damage that required two surgeries. BTW the side airbag failed to deploy in this HONDA ACCORD.

It took two years of suing State Farm to get them to pay the doctors or hospitals involved. So, in the end, they pay for the medical costs AND the legal costs. Their plan apparently is to make as difficult as possible to collect in hopes you will give up and pay the lion's share yourself. Some coverage, some company, some No Fault. Grrrrrr



This is hardly unique to State Farm. This is pretty much the policy of any for-profit insurance company. Insurance is the one institution that I know of that is a contract between two parties and one party has all the power to decide every situation in their own favor. And of course their legal pockets are much bigger than yours. But, as you experienced, if you have a solid case, you CAN win. but they count on most people just giving in (and most do).

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: zach1900
Awesome, thank's Drew, you I understand! It's just weird that uninsured bodily injury is so high here in a no-fault state.


Apparently "bodily injury" and "no fault PIP" are separate things in Florida; the no fault part required by law is 10 grand minimum and is like a one time payment to you for everything - injury, loss of wages etc. If you were very badly injured, you'd want uninsured/underinsured bodily injury protection.

The no fault required PIP coverage is stupid and adds cost to additional polices most people by anyway and that cover the things PIP covers!

 

[SeaJay]

Originally Posted By: zach1900
If you rear end somebody, you were to close , isn't that pretty much universal conclusion?


Generally it is the conclusion. However there are limits, such as in the extreme in heavy traffic on the interstate in heavy traffic if you lock the brakes for no reason, the driver from behind hitting you would not be at fault.

When there aren't any witnesses, often times the offending driver will make up a false story to try to get out of being in an at-fault accident. Happens all the time, sometimes successfully in the absence of evidence to the contrary.

 

[ammolab]

Originally Posted By: SeaJay
Originally Posted By: zach1900
If you rear end somebody, you were to close , isn't that pretty much universal conclusion?


Generally it is the conclusion. However there are limits, such as in the extreme in heavy traffic on the interstate in heavy traffic if you lock the brakes for no reason, the driver from behind hitting you would not be at fault.

When there aren't any witnesses, often times the offending driver will make up a false story to try to get out of being in an at-fault accident. Happens all the time, sometimes successfully in the absence of evidence to the contrary.


Reason or no reason...if some one in front of you "locks up the brakes" and you hit them? You were following too close for conditions. I know Texas Feeways look like a NASCAR restart but tailgating is a tradition that causes the vast majority of urban driving.

 

[shiny]

Do not skimp on your insurance. I know this from painful personal experience.

In Arizona the minimum mandatory liability is only 15/30/10. That's $15k for injury for one person, $30k for ALL injuries in an accident, and $10k for property damage. Consequently, while most drivers are insured, they are UNDERinsured. That's why UNDERinsured coverage costs more here than UNinsured coverage, especially for motorcycle policies. The cost of UNDERinsured coverage for motorcyclists is prohibitively expensive unless you're rich.

15k is not enough to get someone in the door of an ER. If you have dropped collision coverage because you drive an older vehicle, 10k might not buy you a decent replacement for your vehicle.

My husband and I carried 100k liability but couldn't afford the uninsured/underinsured coverage for our motorcycle plans. Three months after we dropped it he was hit by an underinsured driver who carried the minimum liability. It was the other driver's fault. A few minutes later he was killed by another underinsured driver carrying minimum liability. After legal fees and splitting the payout with his son as required by law, my compensation for losing my husband and breadwinner was only $14k.

I never rode my bike again after that day. Now I always carry the maximum uninsured/underinsured and liability possible. The first for my protection, the latter in case I hurt someone else. If God forbid I am ever at fault for the death of another, don't want to leave their family destitute by my mistake.