No more coal fired power for us.

[userfriendly]

You all know what the problem is.
Human population.

Every politician says the same thing; Jobs, grow the economy while at the same time eliminate unemployment, poverty and pollution.

Case in point; The mayor of Vancouver and premier of BC both talk of the infrastructure being in place for a 50% increase in population.

What is the mission statement of your country and target population 100 years from now?
Do you want more people or less?

Does it fit with emission and GHG targets that buy your votes?

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Originally Posted By: used_0il
You all know what the problem is.
Human population.

Every politician says the same thing; Jobs, grow the economy while at the same time eliminate unemployment, poverty and pollution.

Case in point; The mayor of Vancouver and premier of BC both talk of the infrastructure being in place for a 50% increase in population.

What is the mission statement of your country and target population 100 years from now?
Do you want more people or less?

Does it fit with emission and GHG targets that buy your votes?


Talk about Pandora's Box

 

[Silk]

Today - the State owned company that opperates the mines has gone bust, but still running...today the power station severed it's contract with Solid Energy, it has enough coal in store to keep it running to the 2018 shutdown. The open cast mine on the west side of the river (of course we call that the West Mine) supplies the power station, the underground East Mine supplies the iron sand steel works. Yesterday the miners still had jobs, now it's not looking so good.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Donald

Recent articles have concluded that coal is not being killed off by the gov. or environmentalists but simply by the marketplace.


This market place ???

http://www.marketforces.org.au/#

 

[BRZED]

Originally Posted By: BMWTurboDzl
Talk about Pandora's Box


And yet, besides death, Pandora's box also contained hope.

 

[Thermo1223]

AFAIK Coal plants while a lot still being dirty can't be brought up to capacity quickly for peak demand.

A recent article mentioned GE Turbines that could be brought up to capacity in something as little as 15 mins. Not to mention a lot of new technology far small combined cycle power systems for buildings.

A buddy works on the switchgear for one in NYC, 10 rooftop units. Small bas turbines producing electricity and heat which could be used in the winter obviously but they were looking into absorption chillers for the summer.

The grid seems to me in it is becoming a bit decentralized. Which in past events doesn't seem like such a bad thing. A small town can run itself locally if the bigger grid bites that dust.

So yes I would like a Mr. Fusion in my basement.

 

[edwardh1]

Peru seems to have cars with "propane" maybe NG tanks in the trunk of taxis

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Thermo1223
AFAIK Coal plants while a lot still being dirty can't be brought up to capacity quickly for peak demand.


Yah reckon ?

30% to 100% in between a half hour and an hour is pretty flexible. Especially when you are talking 400-500MW of movement.

And that's not governor response which is like 5% of capacity available in a couple of seconds, and maintainable for 5 minutes or so.

What offers MORE flexibility than that ?

Wind and solar don't even see the load profile let alone respond.

Hydro can do it, but you need sites (NZ is blessed, really, but I'd bet the NIMBYs would have something to say if the projects were all this year).

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Thermo1223
AFAIK Coal plants while a lot still being dirty can't be brought up to capacity quickly for peak demand.


Yah reckon ?

30% to 100% in between a half hour and an hour is pretty flexible. Especially when you are talking 400-500MW of movement.

And that's not governor response which is like 5% of capacity available in a couple of seconds, and maintainable for 5 minutes or so.

What offers MORE flexibility than that ?

Wind and solar don't even see the load profile let alone respond.

Hydro can do it, but you need sites (NZ is blessed, really, but I'd bet the NIMBYs would have something to say if the projects were all this year).


IIRC the nukes can too, but they are best off run at full capacity.

 

[Al]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL

IIRC the nukes can too, but they are best off run at full capacity.

True statement

 

[splinter]

Plenty of energy generated riding that sweet bike.

 

[Thermo1223]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Thermo1223
AFAIK Coal plants while a lot still being dirty can't be brought up to capacity quickly for peak demand.


Yah reckon ?

30% to 100% in between a half hour and an hour is pretty flexible. Especially when you are talking 400-500MW of movement.

And that's not governor response which is like 5% of capacity available in a couple of seconds, and maintainable for 5 minutes or so.

What offers MORE flexibility than that ?

Wind and solar don't even see the load profile let alone respond.

Hydro can do it, but you need sites (NZ is blessed, really, but I'd bet the NIMBYs would have something to say if the projects were all this year).


Well an hour in the US would mean peak demand could be double or be over. I guess 30mins isn't fast enough.

I am not a firm believer in wind or solar. I nice addition to supplement your own homestead but not a viable grid option until we start building plants all over the Sahara desert.

Nukes are the really the best and considering the danger involved no problems were because of mechanical failure or bad design. Some were exacerbated by it but it was the not the direct cause. Human error was always the most contributing factor.

I feel a lot safer living next to a Nuke plant than a Dow Petrochemical one....

 

[Silk]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Hydro can do it, but you need sites (NZ is blessed, really, but I'd bet the NIMBYs would have something to say if the projects were all this year).


Yes, most of our power is hydro, and we have some places where you don't have to burn fuel to make steam, so there are some geothermal sites too. Yeah, doing those projects now could cause a stir, but most of them are in the South Island, and I don't think many people live there. They have realised the west coast is windy, so a few wind power sites going up now.

 

[SeaJay]

In the very distant future if renewable technology can not keep up with the growing world's population needs and there is no other available fuel, coal will make a big comeback.

 

[Al]

Originally Posted By: SeaJay
In the very distant future if renewable technology can not keep up with the growing world's population needs and there is no other available fuel, coal will make a big comeback.

No..many of the already poor huddled masses will do without. The environment can not sustain an expansion of the coal energy, but it can't sustain oil sands and shale either...IMHO..