Dog Bite

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: Srt20
Well I will chime in.

I agree with both sides. Yes it's the breed, yes it's the owners.
Pit bulls can be trained to be trusted. Absolutely! The problem is, so many dog owners THINK they know what they are doing and have a "trained" dog. And obviously they don't on both. They think the dog should be their equal. A trained dog is NOT an equal to a human, he is at the bottom of the totem pole. Ok, maybe higher than the cat or the pet bird.

It's obviously well known that pits Bulls are quick to attack. And having a "WELL TRAINED" pit bull usually requires more training the most breeds.

Training starts from the day they are born, until the day they die. Period. To many people think friggin dogs should have equal rights as humans.

I agree 100% with the posters that don't trust any dog. How is someone supposed to know how well trained a dog is?
Though I trust my dog 100% with anybody including my children. Though I didn't always. Trust takes time AND training.

My dog is a family pet, and sometimes he gets to go hunting. He is not trained to be tough, or a watch dog. He also knows his role in the pecking order. He is a happy dog in his role.



Indeed. Pitbulls need a lot of exercise. I mean a lot at least an hour of vigorous exercise a day and all dogs should be put in their place at all times. Dogs are dogs not children.

 

[Stregone]

Originally Posted By: AlienBug
Originally Posted By: barkingspider
There are more dog bites from Labrador retrievers than pit bulls. Just a FYI. Its not the dog breed, its the owner. Its not the tool, its the fool. Its not the arrow, its the indian. Its not the gun, its the idiot behind it.


And how many labrador fatalities?

All of those numbers are so low it is meaningless if one is even 10 times another. According to that chart, in 19 years 482 people have been killed by dogs. To put that in perspective an average of 49 people are killed by lightning every year in the US. Do the math and you will find you are right about twice as likely to killed by lightning than any breed of dog.

 

[Panzerman]

I have had Rottweiler's and Dobermans my whole life. I have a Rotty now that is almost 15 years old. I have taken bones out of their mouths while they were eating. I would not own a animal I could not trust. Just today their was a article in the paper about a Labrador that attacked a kid and when I say kid, he was approx. 10 or 11. The owner said the dog was justified because the kid was not invited into the house. It did a lot of damage to the kids face. I can tell you, if any of my dogs ever attacked a child, I would put it down on the spot. The problem with big vicious breeds of dogs is that they don't treat them as dangerous as they are and they don't discipline them when they are puppies. I have never beaten any my dogs, but I have yelled at them and I trained them when they were puppies. I have never had one out 5 challenge me. Its a good thing because it would have lost its life. The dog has to know that.

 

[Srt20]

Originally Posted By: dave1251
Originally Posted By: Srt20
Well I will chime in.

I agree with both sides. Yes it's the breed, yes it's the owners.
Pit bulls can be trained to be trusted. Absolutely! The problem is, so many dog owners THINK they know what they are doing and have a "trained" dog. And obviously they don't on both. They think the dog should be their equal. A trained dog is NOT an equal to a human, he is at the bottom of the totem pole. Ok, maybe higher than the cat or the pet bird.

It's obviously well known that pits Bulls are quick to attack. And having a "WELL TRAINED" pit bull usually requires more training the most breeds.

Training starts from the day they are born, until the day they die. Period. To many people think friggin dogs should have equal rights as humans.

I agree 100% with the posters that don't trust any dog. How is someone supposed to know how well trained a dog is?
Though I trust my dog 100% with anybody including my children. Though I didn't always. Trust takes time AND training.

My dog is a family pet, and sometimes he gets to go hunting. He is not trained to be tough, or a watch dog. He also knows his role in the pecking order. He is a happy dog in his role.



Indeed. Pitbulls need a lot of exercise. I mean a lot at least an hour of vigorous exercise a day and all dogs should be put in their place at all times. Dogs are dogs not children.


I think ALL dogs should be exercised vigorously everyday, in accordance to their physical level. A lab should be run harder than a Great Dane for example.

I own a Labrador retriever BTW.

Best piece of advice I ever got about dogs was this, "A tired dog is a well behaved dog." And it's absolutely the truth.

 

[CKN]

Originally Posted By: cdeason
" NEVER, EVER trust a dog, ANY dog, ESPECIALLY the pit bull breed,
they have been bred over the ages to fight, and their physical
strength, jaw, and biting method can do serious damage or cause DEATH, not only that these dogs seem to be good natured for years and then just snap one day for no apparent reason whatsoever.

It's time to ban these and a few other breeds from being owned."

I have owned 3 bully breeds in my adult life( english bull terrier, boxer/pit bull mix and an american bulldog). I have never had an issue. It's the owner not the dog.


I disagree. As others have stated, My wife's sister is a responsible dog owner. She had a pitbull- did everything right. One day the dog snaps and bites the head off of another dog. No explanation. The dog was destroyed. Pitbulls snap (not all-but some) for no apparent reason.

 

[CT8]

Originally Posted By: Srt20
Originally Posted By: dave1251
Originally Posted By: Srt20
Well I will chime in.

I agree with both sides. Yes it's the breed, yes it's the owners.
Pit bulls can be trained to be trusted. Absolutely! The problem is, so many dog owners THINK they know what they are doing and have a "trained" dog. And obviously they don't on both. They think the dog should be their equal. A trained dog is NOT an equal to a human, he is at the bottom of the totem pole. Ok, maybe higher than the cat or the pet bird.

It's obviously well known that pits Bulls are quick to attack. And having a "WELL TRAINED" pit bull usually requires more training the most breeds.

Training starts from the day they are born, until the day they die. Period. To many people think friggin dogs should have equal rights as humans.

I agree 100% with the posters that don't trust any dog. How is someone supposed to know how well trained a dog is?
Though I trust my dog 100% with anybody including my children. Though I didn't always. Trust takes time AND training.

My dog is a family pet, and sometimes he gets to go hunting. He is not trained to be tough, or a watch dog. He also knows his role in the pecking order. He is a happy dog in his role.



Indeed. Pitbulls need a lot of exercise. I mean a lot at least an hour of vigorous exercise a day and all dogs should be put in their place at all times. Dogs are dogs not children.


I think ALL dogs should be exercised vigorously everyday, in accordance to their physical level. A lab should be run harder than a Great Dane for example.

I own a Labrador retriever BTW.

Best piece of advice I ever got about dogs was this, "A tired dog is a well behaved dog." And it's absolutely the truth.
horses and teenagers are the same.

 

[GiveMeAVowel]

Originally Posted By: CKN

My wife's sister is a responsible dog owner. She had a pitbull- did everything right. One day the dog (pit bull) snaps and bites the head off of another dog. No explanation. The dog was destroyed. Pitbulls snap (not all-but some) for no apparent reason.


Exactly, it is a genetic factor of this breed, there is NO denying it.

Lets speak about dogs in general, I don't care how much you trust
YOUR dog, you CANNOT 100% guarantee that it won't react at sometime in an unpredictable manner and seriously injure or kill someone, or perhaps another animal. After all did the dog tell you in English that it can be trusted not to injure a person or cause destruction?
Sheesh. I Can't Say It Enough....
DOG OWNERS "CONTROL YOUR ANIMALS AT ALL TIMES!"

I love the OBNOXIOUS dolt neighbors who always say (while their aggressive dog is making warning barks and charging at me from their yard), "Oh, don't worry, (fido) doesn't bite." It if tries it will be killed.

 

[Srt20]

Originally Posted By: GiveMeAVowel
Originally Posted By: CKN

My wife's sister is a responsible dog owner. She had a pitbull- did everything right. One day the dog (pit bull) snaps and bites the head off of another dog. No explanation. The dog was destroyed. Pitbulls snap (not all-but some) for no apparent reason.


Exactly, it is a genetic factor of this breed, there is NO denying it.

Lets speak about dogs in general, I don't care how much you trust
YOUR dog, you CANNOT 100% guarantee that it won't react at sometime in an unpredictable manner and seriously injure or kill someone, or perhaps another animal. After all did the dog tell you in English that it can be trusted not to injure a person or cause destruction?
Sheesh. I Can't Say It Enough....
DOG OWNERS "CONTROL YOUR ANIMALS AT ALL TIMES!"

I love the OBNOXIOUS dolt neighbors who always say (while their aggressive dog is making warning barks and charging at me from their yard), "Oh, don't worry, (fido) doesn't bite." It if tries it will be killed.



I must say, I do enjoy reading your posts.

 

[Shannow]

Agreed that some behaviours and physical traits that are bred in can't be talked out by an owner saying "my dog isn't like all the others in his breed"...see it all the time around here, people want "fighting dogs", then proclaim that theirs is really a lamb dressed up.

I got mauled by a German Sheppard as a kid, simply for playing football with my brother on a public playfield...owners grabbed the dog an bolted.

Dad's mate woke up to his doberman trying to remove his windpipe.

My HuskyxSamoyed, lovely dog, outlived her marbles, and became potentially dangerous...she would knock the kids over, then stand over them...she got valium for a few weeks, then the green needle...it's stuff that happens.

http://www.mygc.com.au/news/young-girl-loses-hand-as-a-result-of-horrifying-dog-attack/

 

[Stregone]

Originally Posted By: CKN
Originally Posted By: cdeason
" NEVER, EVER trust a dog, ANY dog, ESPECIALLY the pit bull breed,
they have been bred over the ages to fight, and their physical
strength, jaw, and biting method can do serious damage or cause DEATH, not only that these dogs seem to be good natured for years and then just snap one day for no apparent reason whatsoever.

It's time to ban these and a few other breeds from being owned."

I have owned 3 bully breeds in my adult life( english bull terrier, boxer/pit bull mix and an american bulldog). I have never had an issue. It's the owner not the dog.


I disagree. As others have stated, My wife's sister is a responsible dog owner. She had a pitbull- did everything right. One day the dog snaps and bites the head off of another dog. No explanation. The dog was destroyed. Pitbulls snap (not all-but some) for no apparent reason.


Its called prey drive and it isn't specific to pitbulls. The right movements and/or sounds tickle part of the brain just so and it is completely involuntary.

She let the dog get into a situation where it killed another dog, so by definition she didn't do 'everything right' and was not a responsible dog owner.

 

[dishdude]

Originally Posted By: GiveMeAVowel

Exactly, it is a genetic factor of this breed, there is NO denying it.

Lets speak about dogs in general, I don't care how much you trust
YOUR dog, you CANNOT 100% guarantee that it won't react at sometime in an unpredictable manner and seriously injure or kill someone, or perhaps another animal. After all did the dog tell you in English that it can be trusted not to injure a person or cause destruction?
Sheesh. I Can't Say It Enough....
DOG OWNERS "CONTROL YOUR ANIMALS AT ALL TIMES!"

I love the OBNOXIOUS dolt neighbors who always say (while their aggressive dog is making warning barks and charging at me from their yard), "Oh, don't worry, (fido) doesn't bite." It if tries it will be killed.



You really gotta meet this guy for a beer sometime, I'm sure you two would really hit it off.

Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
The breed should be made illegal to own except in areas that are sparsely populated agricultural zoned areas.

At least that way the number of potential victims of these very strong, unpredictably aggressive animals can create is pretty small in number.

THE MAIN PROBLEM ARE THE OWNERS. That are arrogant in thinking that "my dog would never hurt anyone" and refuse to be diligent owners that take all needed precautions so that NO INJURIES WILL EVER HAPPEN.

I love watching these belligerent owners on Judge Judy denying THEIR responsibility the entire time, and then having JJ ruling for the plaintiff in the max amount of 5000$ for damages.

Usually she adds the comment about the owners being thick and that they should keep this hearing on video so that when one of their own family members are seriously injured by their dogs they can't say they weren't warned.

 

[GiveMeAVowel]

Nice to see that logic isn't completely dead yet.

 

[AZjeff]

Originally Posted By: Stregone

Its called prey drive and it isn't specific to pitbulls. The right movements and/or sounds tickle part of the brain just so and it is completely involuntary.

She let the dog get into a situation where it killed another dog, so by definition she didn't do 'everything right' and was not a responsible dog owner.


How, exactly, is any dog owner to know every movement/sound that will set off the "prey drive"?? Answer: they can't. So a dog has never gone off before but now it does because it's brain has been tickled just so.

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: AZjeff
I'd like to ask pit bull owners and defenders, with all respect, what is it about owning a dog that has the capacity to seriously injure or kill a person? With the history and statistics of this breed, (and to a lesser degree Rotties), what is the attraction? Protection? Image? Superiority? What's wrong with Beagles or Labs or Corgis or Greyhounds or Blue Ticks? Looking for honest answers. Why a pit bull?


That's a great question. I can't speak for all pitbull owners, so I'll answer for myself, and give you the long answer:

I grew up afraid of dogs-was bitten by a German Shepard as a kid and didn't get over it for some time... In my 20's, a giant dog (Newfoundland mix) started following me. He was the size of a small horse. After I realize he wasn't going to kill me, I ended up walking him home. I ended up getting used to having a dog around after that, and I've had dogs ever since.

My first dog that was mine (owner ended up finally claiming the Newfie) was a mid-sized dog, breed known to be friendly. He was a great dog, but later in his too short life, he became increasingly aggressive towards strangers. I managed this until he passed in a responsible way, and I have to tell you it was stressful. He brought us a lot of joy--and a lot of stress.

Afterwards, I wanted a dog that met certain requirements: short hair, big enough to run 12 miles, a healthy breed, one that doesn't bark much and mostly--one reliable around humans. I did a couple of those online "what breed for you" things, and "pit bull terrier" came up a few different times. My thoughts were "what?? I want a dog that's NOT going to kill someone!". I figured it was a conspiracy to get rid of a bunch of pitbulls or something...

So, I did some research. A lot of research. Not just reading, but talking to folks in shelters who dealt with lots of dogs. Funny enough, most owned pitbulls?

Here's ultimately why I chose one:
-fits the physical requirements of what I wanted. Even at 11 years old, he can still finish a 20 mile mountain bike ride. A little slower than the old days, but he can still do it.

-he's high engery...but only when I want him to be... This is what separates the breed from many others. He'll be as active as you want him to me, but no more. No shoving a toy in my lap, no pestering me. I do walk him a few miles every day, but if 2 days go by and I can't get him out for some reason, no problems. 12 miles hike? sure! It's a weird ability to adapt to the owner's activity level that few breeds seem to have, and it's pretty typical of the breed.

-he's incredibly reliable around humans. He doesn't have much of a guardian instinct, and he's not reactive to people. He's not unfriendly, but he's not overly friendly either, jumping on people when they come to the house. Really, he just ignores everyone. He's more outgoing as he's gotten older, but again he's not real reactive to human activity.

-I didn't care if wasn't great around other dogs. I didn't plan on having multiple dogs. As it turned out, he's incredibly dog social, so I ended up with other dogs in the house and making dog friends to keep him entertained--but that's not typical of the breed. Then again, this does come down to the dog.

As far as the other breeds, Beagles are awesome--but a bit loud! I didn't want a sight hound and I live in the city, not on acreage. Not a great environment for Tick Hound!

To your question about the dog intimidating folks, I just have to laugh. I think most of the "intimidating dogs" are mixed with some other dog, because a pitbull terrier isn't a terribly intimidating looking animal. They aren't that big (around 40 lbs normally) and unless their ears are cropped they don't all that fierce. I can count one one hand the number of times folks have been scared of my dog--and these were folks simply afraid of dogs (and I get that, as that used to be me!). Most people have no idea of his breed until I tell them--and a few will tell me "no, he can't be a pitbull".. Most folks just aren't actually familiar with the breed. My ridgeback, OTOH, will cause folks to occasionally cross the street, likely because she's the size of a small deer...

I'm a big fan of most dogs, but ultimately my own pitbull has been the most awesome dog I've ever owned.

 

[jigen]

I agree with the above post. Our pit is 3 years old now and is the best dog we ever owned. Loyal, loving, amazing with children and small animals... She will rough house and play as long as you have it in you, but as soon as children or another animal comes into the mix our dog quits it and becomes very loving and protective.

I completely understand and agree how every owner should not take their dog for granted, regardless of the breed. Something can always trigger a dog to snap.

But after owning two beagles and a basset hound, our pit bull never has given us a single worry with another animal or a person. The hounds on the other hand gave us a couple scares during their lives.

I've also met pits with temperament issues and can be scary to be around. But I can say this about many breeds. Training is crucial but also so much has to do with just lucking out and getting a good dog.

 

[Al]

Originally Posted By: Panzerman
I have had Rottweiler's and Dobermans my whole life. I have a Rotty now that is almost 15 years old. I have taken bones out of their mouths while they were eating. I would not own a animal I could not trust.

Our neighbor had a doberman many years ago. The most gentle dog I have ever seen. We had small kids at the time and the dog was great with them.

 

[AZjeff]

Thanks to the 2 previous posters for your reasoned, thoughtful replies. Your pit bull stories are undoubtedly similar to countless thousands of others that we'll never hear a word about. Unfortunately, it seems some small number of these perfect pets has some type of trigger experience happen and a tragedy of varying levels of injury or even death occurs. I'll bet the owner's trust and feelings about their dog is identical to yours. So what to do?

My mother has a mini-dachshund that she has completely ruined, it's extremely over protective and has bitten people including me. Hateful dog. Thing is, at it's worst it can inflict a few puncture wounds.

We currently have 2 dogs, 1 50 lb rescue dog of unknown but hound-ish origin who would only bite if cornered after a full retreat, and an Australian Cattle Dog who is the best dog I've ever had. Runs, mountain bikes with me, loyal companion, crazy smart. Problem is he's dog aggressive so I have to be careful with him at all times in public. His brother was raised very similarly and is not at all. Both would defend their owners. Knowing the breed and how he is I'm vigilant when I have him out.

 

[opus1]

I've been bitten twice by dogs that "never bit anyone before" and I did nothing to provoke either one. Unless breathing counts.

All dogs are suspect to me until they prove otherwise.

 

[Brad_C]

Originally Posted By: opus1
All dogs are suspect to me until they prove otherwise.


And that's the thing. We've got a retriever and a labrador. We've had the goldie since a pup and the lab was a rescue at 2 years. Both of them are heading towards 6. Both are as placid and gentle as you could imagine, and we've had goldies before that were absolutely the same.

They've never shown the slightest inclination towards aggressiveness and I can take bones from them or food out of their bowls (after some training of course). I will *not* ever leave them unattended with my (or anyone elses) child.

The gentlest dog in the world can snap for no apparent reason (unfortunately pit bulls seem more prone to this, but that's what makes the news). Vigilance is the only answer, and the owners need as much training (if not more) than the dogs. Dumb owners beget dumb dogs, and dumb dogs do dumb things. Some are just more prone than others - owners and dogs!

 

[expat]

The dog in question was three years old,As I have said, the owner was not your stereotypical Pitbull ownwer. He worked agreat deal withthe dog, I had no issues visiting when the dod was around, I just regardedhisdog as part of the scenery, always rhere when he was around.

They also have a cat, and the dog would also play with kids.

Like I said, NO issues.

But I haveto say my thoughts on the breed (and dogs like them) have changed. A fluke chance in a thousand thing happened.
Whith another breed, it would have been abad day, perhaps a scar, NOT A LIFE CHANGING EVENT.

I like dogs, we have a dog, a rescue Terrier, that is less than perfect at times, he cannot be trusted around Cats. Never had an issue, but we are aware of what could happen, and accept that risk.
But to me, now, the RISK of what I have seen what theses dogs to be capable of is unacceptable.