7mm-08 or .30-06?

Status
Not open for further replies.
In case you guys were wondering, I did find them on gunbroker.

.30-06

7mm-08

I also saw this little Savage earlier today. Also another Savage Axis. I don't know much about Savage guns and I've heard that the Ruger American is a better gun. Boy, I love this stuff!
crazy2.gif
 
Originally Posted By: SEMI_287
In case you guys were wondering, I did find them on gunbroker.

.30-06

7mm-08

I also saw this little Savage earlier today. Also another Savage Axis. I don't know much about Savage guns and I've heard that the Ruger American is a better gun. Boy, I love this stuff!
crazy2.gif



Now you have my blood boiling for a Winchester Model 70 300 Win Mag after looking around that website. My buddy has one, and it is an absolute beast even with a muzzle brake.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: BigD1

Now you have my blood boiling for a Winchester Model 70 300 Win Mag after looking around that website. My buddy has one, and it is an absolute beast even with a muzzle brake.
My ears hurt just reading this post. Magnums are so yesterday.
cool.gif
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: BigD1
Now you have my blood boiling for a Winchester Model 70 300 Win Mag after looking around that website. My buddy has one, and it is an absolute beast even with a muzzle brake.


I'm currently shooting 3, .300 Win. Mag. rifles. Performance and great accuracy never goes out of style. Neither does being able to shoot a range of bullet weights from 110 grains to over 220 grains. The .300 is one of the best long range cartridges in existence. It was winning 1,000 yard matches before a lot of people on this board were even born. There is a very good reason for that.
 
Originally Posted By: SEMI_287
Well, if I went the .308 way I'd need a scope. I don't have any optics on my rifles. Can anyone recommend one that won't break the bank?


Definitely check out Vortex optics. They make them in all price ranges but their lower end ones are a great bargain. I've had leupold MKII- MKIII's on all my rifles and recently picked up a Vortex crossfire II for a budget 223 and was extremely surprised at the quality. Very clear and bright, I was playing with it when I opened up the box and was easily identifying vehicles and boats over a mile away at the beach across the lake.
 
The avg shooter shoots paper targets and little deer at 100 yards or less. They do not engage enemy, or anything else, at distance. Even the long range target shooters realize they can do the same thing with a regular 6.5 as they can do with a 300 mag. So yeah, mags are played out.
 
Originally Posted By: hatt
The avg shooter shoots paper targets and little deer at 100 yards or less. They do not engage enemy, or anything else, at distance. Even the long range target shooters realize they can do the same thing with a regular 6.5 as they can do with a 300 mag. So yeah, mags are played out.


The 6.5 has too limited of a market, because it's too limited of a cartridge. The .300 Win. Mag. has been killing big game at long range, and winning long range competitions since before you were born, and still is. It's chambered in any type, style, or action of rifle you could possibly want or imagine. And it will be for a long time to come. Long after all of these short mags., and other come and go wonder cartridges have disappeared from dealers shelves. Look at sales figures if you need your thinking readjusted. I was reading how belted Magnums were, "going out of style" 20 years ago because of all the short, fat, beltless wonder Mags. that came on the market. Half of them are now obsolete, while the sales of the .300 Winchester and Weatherby Magnums just keep rolling along.

The 6.5 has no heavyweight bullets available. All it's good for is punching paper. It's basically worthless for any type of long range, big game hunting.
 
Originally Posted By: billt460
The 6.5 has no heavyweight bullets available. All it's good for is punching paper. It's basically worthless for any type of long range, big game hunting.
Meh, define big game. Are you talking about moose, bear, etc. or elk, mule, and whitetail deer? The same thing was said about the .270 for many years and Jack O’Connor more or less proved all of them wrong. Not every hunting situation requires the biggest and baddest magnum cartridge on the planet--what is required is shot placement and accuracy. With the exception of the largest game (such as moose and some of the bears) a 6.5mm would do the job on most everything else. I daresay that most shots for any hunting trip (with the exception of varmint hunting) are taken at 300 yards and less. There are plenty of 6.5mm rounds that can kill at that range.

Now, that is not to say that magnums do not have their place, but I quit using long action cartridges years ago and have still managed to successfully hunt everything except a moose and a bear (no desire to hunt either one) in North America with all short action rifles and I am talking about classic cartridges--most of them based on a .308 parent case. Obviously, to each his or her own and thus the reason why there are zillions of cartridges and rifles to match, but (for me) I have yet to find that I needed a magnum--what I needed was to have great shot placement.
 
I respectfully disagree regarding the Ruger American vs. Savage. I own both. I have an American in .30-06 and it is a capable enough hunting rifle but it cannot hold a candle in accuracy to any of my Savage bolt action rifles, even my two Savage Axis' (sub $300 rifles). I hand load and can get all of my Savages to shoot sub 1/2 MOA groups. I am still trying to find a load that will consistently shoot 1 MOA in the Ruger.

This is a 3 shot group @100 yds. from my Savage .308.
And from my Savage .243. and that dead center shot was a 3rd shot flyer caused by the sporter barrel heating up. The .308 is a bull barrel.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
Meh, define big game.


Big game.... Period. Elephant have been killed with 9 MM handguns. People shoot deer with .223's. That doesn't mean they're the wisest choice for the job. Look, one can argue if they "need" a Magnum or not. They've been doing it for over a century. It's no different than saying someone doesn't "need" a 205 MPH ZO-6 Corvette, because it won't get you to work any faster, and only burn more gas.

Such arguments are based on nonsense, nothing more. If they contained any substance they wouldn't be selling Corvette's and .300 Magnums because no one would be buying them. If someone chooses not to shoot a .300, or any other Magnum rifle, in favor of something else, that is fine. But to make statements that cartridges like the .300 Win. Mag. are "played out", is idiotic, and nothing more. As I said look at the sales figures. Enough people agree to prove such a statement is nothing more than pure foolishness.
 
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
Meh, define big game.
Big game.... Period. Elephant have been killed with 9 MM handguns. People shoot deer with .223's. That doesn't mean they're the wisest choice for the job. Look, one can argue if they "need" a Magnum or not. They've been doing it for over a century. It's no different than saying someone doesn't "need" a 205 MPH ZO-6 Corvette, because it won't get you to work any faster, and only burn more gas.

Such arguments are based on nonsense, nothing more. If they contained any substance they wouldn't be selling Corvette's and .300 Magnums because no one would be buying them. If someone chooses not to shoot a .300, or any other Magnum rifle, in favor of something else, that is fine. But to make statements that cartridges like the .300 Win. Mag. are "played out", is idiotic, and nothing more. As I said look at the sales figures. Enough people agree to prove such a statement is nothing more than pure foolishness.
I never said that magnums were "played out", but I will say they are overused. Sales figures simply prove that people want a bigger gun--not that a smaller cartridge is every bit as capable. In North America, I would challenge anyone to prove that a magnum is needed for anything other than a bear (and only because it is a dangerous animal).
 
Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
I never said that magnums were "played out", but I will say they are overused. I would challenge anyone to prove that a magnum is needed.........


That's just as foolish. Think about it. That's the same as saying Corvette's are "overused" because people could get to work in a Prius just as quickly, and because of that, they don't "need" them. People drive what they want, the same as they shoot what they want. How many people own $60K 4 WD SUV's that never tow, see snow, or leave the pavement? Same deal. They don't "need" them. Does that also make them "overused", because they could be driving a Prius as well?

The problem with all of these type of arguments is they always try to bridge the gap between "need", and what people prefer, or simply want. Anti gunners do much the same with guns in general. It fails every time.

Now, if you want to say there are people who cannot shoot a Magnum effectively, that is most likely true. Just as there are people who cannot drive a ZO-6 Vette or a 1 liter sport bike to it's full potential. But if they want to own them, so be it. And they do because sales figures prove it across the board.

The fact of the matter is the .300 Winchester Magnum has been selling, and selling well, since it's introduction in 1963. There is zero indication that is going to change any time soon. That is because people feel compelled to purchase them for whatever reason they choose. Usually because of it's superior ballistic performance. Which is the same reason Kris Kyle used it. He had the choice to use any number of .308 caliber rifle he wanted. All have been proven to kill humans very effectively in combat at long range. But he chose the .300 Winchester Magnum because it performed so much better for the task. Civilians choose it for much the same reason. Pretty simple really.
 
You haven't addressed the issue. What benefits do big mags offer to the avg person which hunts deer at close range? Or the target shooter shooting at 1-200 yards? What Kyle, or an elephant hunter, chose has no relation to the question.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: hatt
You haven't addressed the issue. What benefits do big mags offer to the avg person which hunts deer at close range? Or the target shooter shooting at 1-200 yards? What Kyle, or an elephant hunter, chose has no relation to the question.


Magnums are purchased for their ballistic capability at long range. That IS the "issue", and the reason people buy them. If in the process someone uses them for an all around rifle, so be it. There is no reason not to.
 
Still didn't answer. What benefits do big mags offer to the avg person which ONLY hunts deer at close range?
 
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
I never said that magnums were "played out", but I will say they are overused. I would challenge anyone to prove that a magnum is needed.........
That's just as foolish. Think about it. That's the same as saying Corvette's are "overused" because people could get to work in a Prius just as quickly, and because of that, they don't "need" them. People drive what they want, the same as they shoot what they want. How many people own $60K 4 WD SUV's that never tow, see snow, or leave the pavement? Same deal. They don't "need" them. Does that also make them "overused", because they could be driving a Prius as well?

The problem with all of these type of arguments is they always try to bridge the gap between "need", and what people prefer, or simply want. Anti gunners do much the same with guns in general. It fails every time.

Now, if you want to say there are people who cannot shoot a Magnum effectively, that is most likely true. Just as there are people who cannot drive a ZO-6 Vette or a 1 liter sport bike to it's full potential. But if they want to own them, so be it. And they do because sales figures prove it across the board.

The fact of the matter is the .300 Winchester Magnum has been selling, and selling well, since it's introduction in 1963. There is zero indication that is going to change any time soon. That is because people feel compelled to purchase them for whatever reason they choose. Usually because of it's superior ballistic performance. Which is the same reason Kris Kyle used it. He had the choice to use any number of .308 caliber rifle he wanted. All have been proven to kill humans very effectively in combat at long range. But he chose the .300 Winchester Magnum because it performed so much better for the task. Civilians choose it for much the same reason. Pretty simple really.
Not foolish. If I use your analogy we should all be shooting Weatherby .30-378s or .460s because if a 300WM is good, these have to be better, right? If memory serves the .30-378 was developed by Roy Weatherby in conjunction with the military to see if a .30 caliber projectile could be fired at over 5000fps--this would be the ultimate sniper rifle, yet the mainstream caliber of choice for years has been the .308. Of course, people can buy and use whatever caliber they choose and yes, I am certain the .300WM is a great seller, just as the 7MM and all of the short magnums are.

But to be clear, I am not saying the .300WM is not a great cartridge and I am not naysaying those who want to hunt with it, but I stand by my statement that in North America and with the exception of a bear, there is nothing that can be hunted with a magnum that cannot be just as effectively done with a non-magnum cartridge. At less than 500 yards, this is absolutely true and I would question just how many shots are taken at more than 500 yards versus those at 100-300 yards. Does anyone know this statistic?
 
Quote:
At less than 500 yards, this is absolutely true and I would question just how many shots are taken at more than 500 yards versus those at 100-300 yards. Does anyone know this statistic?
I know in the East almost all shots are taken inside 200 yards, and most of those inside 100. Obviously out West in the wide open it's probably a little longer. Few people have any business attempting a shot at over 500 yards on game no matter what they're carrying.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

billt460
New Contender Barrel
Replies
3
Views
923
billt460
billt460
Is The ".30 Super Carry" Yet Another Flop?
2
Replies
23
Views
8K
mr_boring
ammolab
NM Milsurps FUN Christmas shoot Dec 23rd Albuquerque
Replies
10
Views
595
ammolab
Astro14
Range Report - Springfield Echelon
Replies
14
Views
1K
burbguy82
billt460
AR-15 vs. Mini 14 Cost
2 3
Replies
53
Views
5K
burbguy82
Back
Top