3800 series II, how likely to need LIM gasket

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CBR.worm

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We just bought a very clean '04 LeSable w/ 80k miles on it from an estate sale for a relative. I have read about upper manifold and lower manifold gaskets as well as EGR issues for as long as I have been a member on BITOG. I've tried searching but can't seem to find out how likely this is.

Should I do it now as PM or is it likely to be years before it has issues. The car has been sitting in a condo garage (on the ocean unfortunately), being driven about 200 miles at a time a few times a year for the last 6 years when relatives would visit and drive it to Miami. Prior to that it was driven daily. It has decent maintenance records, but nothing on paper regarding coolant flushes, brake fluid flushes, ATF changes, spark plugs, etc. oil and brake fluid look clean. Haven't dug in much more than that. The grandfather said it was maintained meticulously despite the low annual mileage, but...

So anyway, should I plan to do it, or just wait. My plan is to get the car ready for a few years of easy use and not touch it again, possibly ever.
 
I would do it now as preventative maintenance. Our 2005 Impala had gasket failure before 60,000. I ordered the gaskets and updated intake manifold from a popular 3800 performance parts company.
 
Over the years, I've owned three GM series II vehicles. Two out of three needed the gasket repair. Both repair vehicles started to show noticeable antifreeze loss before doing the repair. Luckily I found the time and ability to do my own repairs.

I believe you have a '04 LeSabre and if mine, I'd go through it task by task with the above mentioned maintenance and keep it. I would not do the gasket repair until I started seeing the loss of antifreeze. It might not be convenient when it needs to be repaired but right now, I'd do drain and fills with dex cool to specs.

Although it doen't have much book resale value, they are good vehicles with excellent mpgs for a full size vehicle. The type of vehicle if maintained lasts a long time especially in an area where it is located. It appears this size is good for the bumper car world there too. Good Luck. Happy 4th. Celebrate the USA.
 
If you have the extra money or mechanical ability I would do it. I bought a 2000 Lesabre in 09 with 65000 miles on it and the upper plastic intake had cracked and was leaking coolant externally right after bringing it home. After reading up on the lowers leaking to I had them done in 2012 even though I wasn't losing any coolant. Mechanic said it was a good idea since the gaskets looked pretty bad but hadn't failed. It's a shame GM discontinued this engine after getting it right with the series 3.
 
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Originally Posted By: Doog
I look at it this way, once you fix the gaskets you have a bullet proof engine.


Exactly, those motors will take a pounding and run forever.
 
Hmmm. That's kind of what I figured. Is there any way to tell externally if the repairs have been done? Other repairs have been made.

The fluids all look fresh - including the orange coolant, the alternator is clearly a new factory alternator, but I can see oil weeping from both valve cover gaskets. It's not dripping anywhere.

My inclination would be to do all of it, but I don't really want to. The catch is that once I deliver this car to Grandma, I don't want to ever touch it again - that is part of the deal. I want to divorce myself from maintaining her car.

I suspect the car sat a lot more than than I expected. There is rust (now polished rust) on the idler pulleys where the flat side of the belt runs. The belts are new, tires look new but have 2005 DOT code.

Appaarently, prior to '09 the car was driven from minnesota to Jupiter Island and back seasonally. After '09 the car basically sat in a garage, being used a few times a year.

It runs perfectly, transmission shifts well (fluid is nice and pink). Oil pressure is good.

I would say that they had dealer maintenance done - but there is no history in CarFax or AutoCheck.

The car is very nice by the way. It has every option including the two tone interior w/ dual A/C, heated seats, Auto windows, a bunch of buttons on the steering wheel, etc. The interior is perfect, the exterior paint is all perfect, the headlights are clear, but under the hood and under the car there is a good amount of surface rust from being near the ocean.
 
is there any way to tell by looking at the engine if the gaskets have been replaced?

i would replace them if they have never been done. never know when it going to go bad. would suck if they went bad while on a long trip
 
I would assume the gaskets have not been replaced and get it done. Then with Bitog maintenance you should be able to get 250k out of it.
 
At 80K its a certainty sooner than later. Do it now and be done with it.
Swap the upper plenum for an aftermarket one with a new reduced diameter EGR chimney and use the GM aluminum frame gaskets. The since 08 or so gaskets have been bulletproof.

Swap the coolant elbows to the LIM with the new aftermarket aluminum ones. Switch over to GO5 or John Deere Coolguard II and it will live forever.
 
Do it sooner rather then later

Aluminum coolant elbows, FelPro high line gasket set, revised UIM, flush the Dexcool mess out, and refill with fresh Dexcool.

I'm going through the same thing with a '02 Bonneville.
 
Please a look at these two pictures on my 3800 Series II in 04 Lesabre:
1) http://i.imgur.com/UT0o7ku.jpg (right front of engine)
2) http://i.imgur.com/2GgwLJL.jpg (left side of engine)

In the first picture, I am pointing to a lower intake gasket. Mine is metal(aluminum), because I changed it. What color is yours(you may have to wipe gunk off of it to see)? If it's metal, it's 100% been changed, I wouldn't bother touching it.

In the second pic, The pointer is on an end seal(that gets changed with the lower intake gasket). What color is yours? (not actually sure what color the stock one is supposed to be but I'd figure I ask anyways)

I ask because I figure I'd try some verification with you, but I'm guessing they probably didn't change them, but it would take a rather proactive mechanic to choose the metal gaskets over the oem plastic gaskets too...

Do you feel you want to change these yourself, have the ability etc? I could message you a list of every proper part you need to do it right as well as provide direction, if you want to change the gaskets yourself. I could send you some guides people have posted on how to do it as well.

Also, I don't know how much time you want to spend on it either, but changing the dexcool coolant for a different type of coolant might be rather time consuming, as you should rinse the system quite thoroughly of the dex before putting a different one in. It wouldn't be bad to just drain and fill the dex for fresh dex instead...(not taking a shot at Trav's comment, just trying to be realistic)
 
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Back in 2009 I bought a used 2004 Supercharged Monte Carlo with the 3800 Series II in it. It had 87,000 miles on it and the intake gasket was already leaking. I had it repaired with the updated gasket and never any more problems in the almost four years I owned it.
 
Originally Posted By: GerGa
Please a look at these two pictures on my 3800 Series II in 04 Lesabre:
1) http://i.imgur.com/UT0o7ku.jpg (right front of engine)
2) http://i.imgur.com/2GgwLJL.jpg (left side of engine)

In the first picture, I am pointing to a lower intake gasket. Mine is metal(aluminum), because I changed it. What color is yours(you may have to wipe gunk off of it to see)? If it's metal, it's 100% been changed, I wouldn't bother touching it.

In the second pic, The pointer is on an end seal(that gets changed with the lower intake gasket). What color is yours? (not actually sure what color the stock one is supposed to be but I'd figure I ask anyways)

I ask because I figure I'd try some verification with you, but I'm guessing they probably didn't change them, but it would take a rather proactive mechanic to choose the metal gaskets over the oem plastic gaskets too...

Do you feel you want to change these yourself, have the ability etc? I could message you a list of every proper part you need to do it right as well as provide direction, if you want to change the gaskets yourself. I could send you some guides people have posted on how to do it as well.

Also, I don't know how much time you want to spend on it either, but changing the dexcool coolant for a different type of coolant might be rather time consuming, as you should rinse the system quite thoroughly of the dex before putting a different one in. It wouldn't be bad to just drain and fill the dex for fresh dex instead...(not taking a shot at Trav's comment, just trying to be realistic)


I can see the gasket on the right hand side, it is black plastic. I can't see any color on the left hand side. I looked at the date code on the intake manifold itself and saw that is was made in '04, so the manifold itself is OE. I would say it has never been touched.

I suspect the right thing to do is just change them and then not have to worry about it. I don't know if I would do it myself or let a 'pro' do it. I have an indy I trust to do the stuff I don't want to, but I usually do almost everything myself. Maybe I'll get a price from him and see if it is worth it to be able to drop it off vs. doing it myself.

What leans me towards my guy is that I don't have the ability to deal with the runoff from gunking the motor or from flushing the cooling system. Anything I do has to be done inside my garage to prevent the HOA from penalizing me. I could potentially take it to a self serve carwash and use some purple or green stuff to clean the grime, but if I get something wet and the car won't start, I'll be stuck there. And not being super familiar with the car, I'm not sure, aside from the ignition components, what can't get wet.
 
Trav has given you great advice. Switch the plenum and LIM gaskets to the updated parts. Switch the plastic coolant elbows for aluminum , swap in GO5 and its good till the body falls apart.
 
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