14 Mustang GT trackpack.....oil recommendations
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Originally Posted By: Coyote5_0
Originally Posted By: Camprunner
I listened to your video and that tick is just so odd. I don't have it on mine but I listen for it every time I drive I often feel it's a mater of time before it rears its ugly head who knows I guess? I'm with you on sticking with the 5w20 oil under warranty if I had the tick I would do the same. I did not change oil weight on my car until after I added a performance tune to my 5.0 and figured my engine warranty was gone at that point (completely different topic on if warranty is void or not from tune topic for another day) anyway after tune I switched oil weight. But if I had the "BBQ Ignighter tick" I would stick with the 5w20.
It would be more consolation if I weren't so alone in seeking resolution for this. I left the car stock because long ago I modded my old car to high heaven and when the oil pump failed and took out the engine It cost me dearly. I haven't driven or ridden in a car with a tune or mods, and while I agree this thing stock isn't quite quick enough (old car was 390 hp and 2850 pounds, this is 420 hp and 3650 pounds), I am certainly glad I kept the warranty. When my warranty expires, then I may tune the car, do my best to ignore the ticking, and put some redline 5w30 in there.
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: Coyote5_0
Thanks for your input, Camprunner. More empirical evidence is helpful in making the decision. I had seen a post someone with an oil pressure gauge said the oil pressure with 5w30 was all within spec, and again, with no mechanical differences between the track pack engine and the regular GT engine, there's no reason to see it being problematic. The ambient temperatures in California this time of year are also really hot, so everything will be running hotter from that.
If Ford's decision is that this is normal:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSmLIXhX7mg
and they will help no more, I may run 5w30, but for the moment I need my warranty.
I listened to the video and I think the engine sounds great! Maybe my ears just can't detect any strange noises or I just don't know what I'm listening for. One question though,why did that brand new Mustang need a new engine?
The speakers you use make a big difference in whether you can hear the ticking. Try listening to it on your phone, anything with less bass usually makes it stick out more.
This is the old engine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSTMuIfQGKY
Same problem. Started running rougher and rougher. Finally found a dealership that would look into it, they found a bunch of damage/failed specs and replaced the longblock.
I know a lot of these cars get the bbq tick, but this is not normal. I ask every 5.0 owner I see and have never met someone with the problem. You can imagine after 9 months of research and trying to find a dealer to look into it, which dealer tried to blow me off at first, that I felt elated. Then within 300 miles the new engine started making the same noises minus the snapping at idle. When I got the first oil change it came back just like the old engine. Maybe the damage was incidental, I don't know. Maybe running 5w20 oil in 110 degree summers is stressing.
I have seen plenty of people posting their track packs get the problem, and just as many saying that the switch to synthetic oil from the blend causes it, but my experience on the latter suggests no relation. I tried redline 5w20 on the old engine, and the problem occurred much less, and went away maybe 100 miles sooner, but it didn't go away.
The old engine this would stop at around 850-900 miles after the oil change. New engine's still doing it at 1500 miles on the oil, just not enough that I can demonstrate it. The engine has 3000 miles on it. I changed the oil at 1500 as per the advice of the service adviser at my dealership. Popular mechanics recommends changing the oil at something like 20 miles on a new engine; changing the oil isn't bad for your car, so this is baffling.
Is the sound in question that random slapping sound that I can hear? If so,it has no rhythmic steadiness which imo is really strange. What I can hear is a "Tick....tick tick....tick tick tick.....tick.....tick tick. Really sporadic. Only ticking engines I've heard always are in complete rhythm,"tick tick tick tick tick tick tick". That's REALLY strange. What in an engine would cause such a random-non uniform ticking/slapping pattern?
Originally Posted By: Camprunner
I listened to your video and that tick is just so odd. I don't have it on mine but I listen for it every time I drive I often feel it's a mater of time before it rears its ugly head who knows I guess? I'm with you on sticking with the 5w20 oil under warranty if I had the tick I would do the same. I did not change oil weight on my car until after I added a performance tune to my 5.0 and figured my engine warranty was gone at that point (completely different topic on if warranty is void or not from tune topic for another day) anyway after tune I switched oil weight. But if I had the "BBQ Ignighter tick" I would stick with the 5w20.
It would be more consolation if I weren't so alone in seeking resolution for this. I left the car stock because long ago I modded my old car to high heaven and when the oil pump failed and took out the engine It cost me dearly. I haven't driven or ridden in a car with a tune or mods, and while I agree this thing stock isn't quite quick enough (old car was 390 hp and 2850 pounds, this is 420 hp and 3650 pounds), I am certainly glad I kept the warranty. When my warranty expires, then I may tune the car, do my best to ignore the ticking, and put some redline 5w30 in there.
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: Coyote5_0
Thanks for your input, Camprunner. More empirical evidence is helpful in making the decision. I had seen a post someone with an oil pressure gauge said the oil pressure with 5w30 was all within spec, and again, with no mechanical differences between the track pack engine and the regular GT engine, there's no reason to see it being problematic. The ambient temperatures in California this time of year are also really hot, so everything will be running hotter from that.
If Ford's decision is that this is normal:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSmLIXhX7mg
and they will help no more, I may run 5w30, but for the moment I need my warranty.
I listened to the video and I think the engine sounds great! Maybe my ears just can't detect any strange noises or I just don't know what I'm listening for. One question though,why did that brand new Mustang need a new engine?
The speakers you use make a big difference in whether you can hear the ticking. Try listening to it on your phone, anything with less bass usually makes it stick out more.
This is the old engine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSTMuIfQGKY
Same problem. Started running rougher and rougher. Finally found a dealership that would look into it, they found a bunch of damage/failed specs and replaced the longblock.
I know a lot of these cars get the bbq tick, but this is not normal. I ask every 5.0 owner I see and have never met someone with the problem. You can imagine after 9 months of research and trying to find a dealer to look into it, which dealer tried to blow me off at first, that I felt elated. Then within 300 miles the new engine started making the same noises minus the snapping at idle. When I got the first oil change it came back just like the old engine. Maybe the damage was incidental, I don't know. Maybe running 5w20 oil in 110 degree summers is stressing.
I have seen plenty of people posting their track packs get the problem, and just as many saying that the switch to synthetic oil from the blend causes it, but my experience on the latter suggests no relation. I tried redline 5w20 on the old engine, and the problem occurred much less, and went away maybe 100 miles sooner, but it didn't go away.
The old engine this would stop at around 850-900 miles after the oil change. New engine's still doing it at 1500 miles on the oil, just not enough that I can demonstrate it. The engine has 3000 miles on it. I changed the oil at 1500 as per the advice of the service adviser at my dealership. Popular mechanics recommends changing the oil at something like 20 miles on a new engine; changing the oil isn't bad for your car, so this is baffling.
Is the sound in question that random slapping sound that I can hear? If so,it has no rhythmic steadiness which imo is really strange. What I can hear is a "Tick....tick tick....tick tick tick.....tick.....tick tick. Really sporadic. Only ticking engines I've heard always are in complete rhythm,"tick tick tick tick tick tick tick". That's REALLY strange. What in an engine would cause such a random-non uniform ticking/slapping pattern?
Originally Posted By: wtd
Are you sure you got a new engine. It is hard to believe that you would get two in a row.
Knock on wood, my 14 GT with almost 13,000 miles on it and on it's third oil change including the factory fill and no unusual noises.
To keep my warranty intact, I stay with 5W-20 Motorcraft blend and a Motorcraft filter. I hope I never have an issue. I hope you get yours resolved.
Wayne
Well unless the dealership/Ford committed fraud, I think I got a new engine. The part number (ER3Z-6006-A) is not a remanufactured engine, either. When I picked it up it was like a whole new car. It is hard to believe this happened with the new engine, but it does make you wonder if this isn't a design/engineering flaw or consistent manufacturing defects. The two most common arguments are cylinder out of round and bearing tolerances. Either way this seems pretty systemic. I am extremely disappointed that this issue popped up on a brand new motor, too. I made certain to break this engine in according to the manual. I am not the only one to whom this has happened, however.
Are you sure you got a new engine. It is hard to believe that you would get two in a row.
Knock on wood, my 14 GT with almost 13,000 miles on it and on it's third oil change including the factory fill and no unusual noises.
To keep my warranty intact, I stay with 5W-20 Motorcraft blend and a Motorcraft filter. I hope I never have an issue. I hope you get yours resolved.
Wayne
Well unless the dealership/Ford committed fraud, I think I got a new engine. The part number (ER3Z-6006-A) is not a remanufactured engine, either. When I picked it up it was like a whole new car. It is hard to believe this happened with the new engine, but it does make you wonder if this isn't a design/engineering flaw or consistent manufacturing defects. The two most common arguments are cylinder out of round and bearing tolerances. Either way this seems pretty systemic. I am extremely disappointed that this issue popped up on a brand new motor, too. I made certain to break this engine in according to the manual. I am not the only one to whom this has happened, however.
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This is what I followed:
http://imgur.com/2anpihY
Though I did not perform any wide open throttle pulls within the first 200 miles.
http://imgur.com/2anpihY
Though I did not perform any wide open throttle pulls within the first 200 miles.
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Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Is the sound in question that random slapping sound that I can hear? If so,it has no rhythmic steadiness which imo is really strange. What I can hear is a "Tick....tick tick....tick tick tick.....tick.....tick tick. Really sporadic. Only ticking engines I've heard always are in complete rhythm,"tick tick tick tick tick tick tick". That's REALLY strange. What in an engine would cause such a random-non uniform ticking/slapping pattern?
Yeap, that's the sound it makes. Really weird is right. If it's not the engine, then 1 it should not have gone away (however briefly) when the dealer replaced the long block, and 2, it should not matter that you change your oil, yet changing the oil acts as the only catalyst I can discern.
Again, here is the recording I have of the old engine at its worst, 20 miles after changing the oil. And yes I primed the oil filter and primed the oil pressure a bit before starting it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSTMuIfQGKY
Going up the driveway, you can hear the same noise the new engine makes, but the recording device is different from the more recent videos, and it's so rapid fire that it is harder to hear. The snapping noise at idle is not. Not all coyotes with this oil change tick sound the same. The worse sounding ones have the tick at idle.
Is the sound in question that random slapping sound that I can hear? If so,it has no rhythmic steadiness which imo is really strange. What I can hear is a "Tick....tick tick....tick tick tick.....tick.....tick tick. Really sporadic. Only ticking engines I've heard always are in complete rhythm,"tick tick tick tick tick tick tick". That's REALLY strange. What in an engine would cause such a random-non uniform ticking/slapping pattern?
Yeap, that's the sound it makes. Really weird is right. If it's not the engine, then 1 it should not have gone away (however briefly) when the dealer replaced the long block, and 2, it should not matter that you change your oil, yet changing the oil acts as the only catalyst I can discern.
Again, here is the recording I have of the old engine at its worst, 20 miles after changing the oil. And yes I primed the oil filter and primed the oil pressure a bit before starting it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSTMuIfQGKY
Going up the driveway, you can hear the same noise the new engine makes, but the recording device is different from the more recent videos, and it's so rapid fire that it is harder to hear. The snapping noise at idle is not. Not all coyotes with this oil change tick sound the same. The worse sounding ones have the tick at idle.
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Weirdest thing is that the noise has no rhythmic pattern,and is really random. Wonder what could possibly cause an engine to make a noise like that? Does the pattern or rhythm of the noise change with engine rpm?
Originally Posted By: hatt
When they replace the engines do they typically reuse the old timing chain setup?
A replacement longblock comes with new chains installed. All you do is transfer the FEAD, some ancillaries, and intake(usually replaced also) and off you go. The reman ones come with an oil filter and oil already in the sump.
When they replace the engines do they typically reuse the old timing chain setup?
A replacement longblock comes with new chains installed. All you do is transfer the FEAD, some ancillaries, and intake(usually replaced also) and off you go. The reman ones come with an oil filter and oil already in the sump.
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Here's the Castrol Edge 5/50 specs
Compatible with all conventional and synthetic motor oils
Advanced additives neutralize corrosive particles, preventing them from forming power-robbing sludge
Provides stability and endurance under extreme conditions, including heat, load and speed
Exceeds API Service SM, SL, SJ and CF; exceeds ACEA A3/B3; meets engine protection requirements of ILSAC GF-4/GF-3/GF-2; meets catalyst/emission system compatibility requirements of ILSAC GF-4/GF-3/GF-2; meets Ford WSS M2C931-A
Made in the USA
Compatible with all conventional and synthetic motor oils
Advanced additives neutralize corrosive particles, preventing them from forming power-robbing sludge
Provides stability and endurance under extreme conditions, including heat, load and speed
Exceeds API Service SM, SL, SJ and CF; exceeds ACEA A3/B3; meets engine protection requirements of ILSAC GF-4/GF-3/GF-2; meets catalyst/emission system compatibility requirements of ILSAC GF-4/GF-3/GF-2; meets Ford WSS M2C931-A
Made in the USA
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Originally Posted By: hatt
When they replace the engines do they typically reuse the old timing chain setup?
A replacement longblock comes with new chains installed. All you do is transfer the FEAD, some ancillaries, and intake(usually replaced also) and off you go. The reman ones come with an oil filter and oil already in the sump.
What viscosity are they using for break in?
Originally Posted By: hatt
When they replace the engines do they typically reuse the old timing chain setup?
A replacement longblock comes with new chains installed. All you do is transfer the FEAD, some ancillaries, and intake(usually replaced also) and off you go. The reman ones come with an oil filter and oil already in the sump.
What viscosity are they using for break in?
Originally Posted By: 3311
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Originally Posted By: hatt
When they replace the engines do they typically reuse the old timing chain setup?
A replacement longblock comes with new chains installed. All you do is transfer the FEAD, some ancillaries, and intake(usually replaced also) and off you go. The reman ones come with an oil filter and oil already in the sump.
What viscosity are they using for break in?
Whatever the vehicle calls for. If it is a Track Pack engine, it gets 5W50, if not it gets 5W20 blend.
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Originally Posted By: hatt
When they replace the engines do they typically reuse the old timing chain setup?
A replacement longblock comes with new chains installed. All you do is transfer the FEAD, some ancillaries, and intake(usually replaced also) and off you go. The reman ones come with an oil filter and oil already in the sump.
What viscosity are they using for break in?
Whatever the vehicle calls for. If it is a Track Pack engine, it gets 5W50, if not it gets 5W20 blend.
If it's the same engine I would bet the same part# how would the factory know which viscosity? I thought the only difference is the additional cooling capacity which would not be at the block level.
What I'm getting at is if the reman comes form the factory with 5w50 then after the first oil change to xw20 the are starting problems starting?
What I'm getting at is if the reman comes form the factory with 5w50 then after the first oil change to xw20 the are starting problems starting?
Originally Posted By: 3311
If it's the same engine I would bet the same part# how would the factory know which viscosity? I thought the only difference is the additional cooling capacity which would not be at the block level.
What I'm getting at is if the reman comes form the factory with 5w50 then after the first oil change to xw20 the are starting problems starting?
Problem was this is a new engine, not a reman. It's ER3Z-6006-A. It's also not a track pack engine. In fact, I haven't seen any specific part number for the track pack Mustangs anymore. They used to be denoted by a different letter after the BR3Z-6006-( ). The reman is D(or C, don't remember)R3Z-6006-DARM. So the dealer that did the engine replacement filled it with regular 5w20 blend. My car is not a track pack. Though I am interested in putting an oil cooler on it, hot summers and all. Oil is 1700 miles after change, engine is 3300 miles. Tick is finally starting to quiet down. (It'll come back loud as ever when next oil change.)
I expect even redline 5w30 won't stop the noise. I expect it will quiet it down somewhat but that's about it.
If it's the same engine I would bet the same part# how would the factory know which viscosity? I thought the only difference is the additional cooling capacity which would not be at the block level.
What I'm getting at is if the reman comes form the factory with 5w50 then after the first oil change to xw20 the are starting problems starting?
Problem was this is a new engine, not a reman. It's ER3Z-6006-A. It's also not a track pack engine. In fact, I haven't seen any specific part number for the track pack Mustangs anymore. They used to be denoted by a different letter after the BR3Z-6006-( ). The reman is D(or C, don't remember)R3Z-6006-DARM. So the dealer that did the engine replacement filled it with regular 5w20 blend. My car is not a track pack. Though I am interested in putting an oil cooler on it, hot summers and all. Oil is 1700 miles after change, engine is 3300 miles. Tick is finally starting to quiet down. (It'll come back loud as ever when next oil change.)
I expect even redline 5w30 won't stop the noise. I expect it will quiet it down somewhat but that's about it.
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DR3Z-6006-DARM is the service longblock for my VIN. The original number was BR3Z-6006-G when it was a new assembly. The description says for vehicles with "Premium Turbo Brakes" which is how they describe the Track Pack in the cataloging.
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Originally Posted By: Redlinez
And I had originally bought the 5/50 Castrol and was told by THEIR rep it wasn't designed for newer engines, so I returned it. Pretty funny they say it "meets" Ford's spec.
The new bottles no longer say "Specially formulated for classic cars",so maybe they changed the formula and it no longer had the classic car level of zddp and can carry the Ford spec?
And I had originally bought the 5/50 Castrol and was told by THEIR rep it wasn't designed for newer engines, so I returned it. Pretty funny they say it "meets" Ford's spec.
The new bottles no longer say "Specially formulated for classic cars",so maybe they changed the formula and it no longer had the classic car level of zddp and can carry the Ford spec?
Originally Posted By: Redlinez
Ok, so I've read enough to make my eyes pop out. My engine is internally the same as previous 5.0's, it just has a larger capacity 8-8.5 quarts and a heavy duty oil cooler. Ford recoomends 5w-50 Motorcraft synthetic. I also read that they recommend this because they assume the car will see track time. Other folks seem to think the cam phasers are affected by the oil weight and that they were tuned from Ford using 5/50. I tend to think it's recommended just for protection while running extended high rpms at the track generating much higher internal temps and loads.
With that said, I've read something consistently about Motorcraft 5/50 synthetic that I don't like. It shears off within 1000-1500 miles to bascially a 40 weight. Would I be better off running a 10/40 Penzoil synthetic, a 0/40 Mobil1 euro syn, Amsoil 10/40 AMO, Amsoil 5/50, or something else? Mine has seen one track event this year, possibly one more. I daily drive it and have 13k miles on it. I don't beat on the car (I'm 43 and pretty sane), but I ran it hard at the track and will probably make some dragstrip passes this fall. Thanks for any input, first post here, trying to not go as nuclear as all the reading makes one feel.
Welcome to BITOG Redlinez! For your ’14 Mustang GT, we would recommend Quaker State Ultimate Durability Full Synthetic 5W-50 motor oil. Know this wasn’t on your list of possible fills, but to follow Ford’s recommendation, you’d need a motor oil that met the WSS-M2C 931-B specification in a 5W-50 viscosity grade. The Quaker State Ultimate Durability would be a shift from what you’re used to, but it’s actually currently being used in Ford Mustang Shelby GT500s and Super Snakes nationwide. Hope this info helps! – The Quaker State Team
Ok, so I've read enough to make my eyes pop out. My engine is internally the same as previous 5.0's, it just has a larger capacity 8-8.5 quarts and a heavy duty oil cooler. Ford recoomends 5w-50 Motorcraft synthetic. I also read that they recommend this because they assume the car will see track time. Other folks seem to think the cam phasers are affected by the oil weight and that they were tuned from Ford using 5/50. I tend to think it's recommended just for protection while running extended high rpms at the track generating much higher internal temps and loads.
With that said, I've read something consistently about Motorcraft 5/50 synthetic that I don't like. It shears off within 1000-1500 miles to bascially a 40 weight. Would I be better off running a 10/40 Penzoil synthetic, a 0/40 Mobil1 euro syn, Amsoil 10/40 AMO, Amsoil 5/50, or something else? Mine has seen one track event this year, possibly one more. I daily drive it and have 13k miles on it. I don't beat on the car (I'm 43 and pretty sane), but I ran it hard at the track and will probably make some dragstrip passes this fall. Thanks for any input, first post here, trying to not go as nuclear as all the reading makes one feel.
Welcome to BITOG Redlinez! For your ’14 Mustang GT, we would recommend Quaker State Ultimate Durability Full Synthetic 5W-50 motor oil. Know this wasn’t on your list of possible fills, but to follow Ford’s recommendation, you’d need a motor oil that met the WSS-M2C 931-B specification in a 5W-50 viscosity grade. The Quaker State Ultimate Durability would be a shift from what you’re used to, but it’s actually currently being used in Ford Mustang Shelby GT500s and Super Snakes nationwide. Hope this info helps! – The Quaker State Team
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
DR3Z-6006-DARM is the service longblock for my VIN. The original number was BR3Z-6006-G when it was a new assembly. The description says for vehicles with "Premium Turbo Brakes" which is how they describe the Track Pack in the cataloging.
Yea I have seen a range of BR3Z-6006-( ) engines. Just didn't see any new ones on Fordparts.com, which I thought was weird.
DR3Z-6006-DARM is the service longblock for my VIN. The original number was BR3Z-6006-G when it was a new assembly. The description says for vehicles with "Premium Turbo Brakes" which is how they describe the Track Pack in the cataloging.
Yea I have seen a range of BR3Z-6006-( ) engines. Just didn't see any new ones on Fordparts.com, which I thought was weird.
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