Possible Fram Ultra issue

[Trav]

I installed one of these 1K ago in my GM 3800 gen II. This engine is spotless inside and i used the same PU 5w30 like always with no OTC additives.
The next day it developed a tick when cold, this engine has never had a tick since i got it 8 years ago.

Over the course of 1K its getting worse when cold, not instead of a few seconds its going on for a couple of minutes.
I will swap it today for a NAPA Gold (what it always had) and report back. I'm very concerned there may be flow issues with these filters.

 

[Turk]

I will be highly curious if the tick goes away with the NAPA Gold or not.

Thinking about cutting open the FU?

 

[Lubener]

For a filter to be as efficient as the Ultra, some flow ability has to be compromised. I would have Fram check out that filter if the replacement works better.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: Turk
I will be highly curious if the tick goes away with the NAPA Gold or not.

Thinking about cutting open the FU?



I was thinking about cutting it open but Lubener makes a good point about sending it back to Fram.
If the ticking goes away (i will know tomorrow AM because it does it every day now) contacting them may be the best course of action.

Edit: I want to use the Gold because thats all i ever used on this engine for all those years and it never made a tick in all that time. If it stops that puts the noise squarely on the filter.

 

[Turk]

Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: Turk
I will be highly curious if the tick goes away with the NAPA Gold or not.

Thinking about cutting open the FU?



I was thinking about cutting it open but Lubener makes a good point about sending it back to Fram.
If the ticking goes away (i will know tomorrow AM because it does it every day now) contacting them may be the best course of action


10-4, that may be better if they want it, pay for shipping, and get back to you with the results.

 

[demarpaint]

I'd contact Fram, and if they're willing to pay the freight I'd send it back. I anxiously await your findings when you replace the filter with a NAPA filter, and Fram's findings.

 

[Merkava_4]

What that 3800 needs is some high-flow therapy -----> the NAPA Platinum.

 

[Kira]

Posting from Europe has gotten "higher than a cat's back".
Too bad you're not stateside. Mailing it to them wouldn't be expensive at all.
Then, if they'd gotten it and remained silent, we could then assign them a lower rung on our trust ladder. Kira

 

[Trav]

I am in MA i will know tomorrow. I will email them first and post their reply if it clears up.

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
What that 3800 needs is some high-flow therapy -----> the NAPA Platinum.

No, thats the last thing i want to do. The engine has been silent for 8 years with NAPA Gold filters and it has used this oil since it came to market, the only think different is the filter.
It isn't just one lifter its multiples ticking slightly.

 

[Rand]

I dont see how an oil filter could cause extended ticking.

on cold winter startup for a few seconds yes..

In the summer not seeing how it could happen. If you theoretically were restricting flow that much the bypass valve would open.

What mechanism would cause this extended ticking?

Not like you have a subaru spec 24psi bypass on there.

 

[ExMachina]

Originally Posted By: Lubener
For a filter to be as efficient as the Ultra, some flow ability has to be compromised. I would have Fram check out that filter if the replacement works better.


Wrong. Synthetic fiber oil filters like Ultra actually flow better or right at spec. Smaller diameter fibers and better consistency than cellulose paper oil filters.

 

[ExMachina]

Originally Posted By: Rand
I dont see how an oil filter could cause extended ticking.

on cold winter startup for a few seconds yes..

In the summer not seeing how it could happen. If you theoretically were restricting flow that much the bypass valve would open.

What mechanism would cause this extended ticking?

Not like you have a subaru spec 24psi bypass on there.


One mechanism might be aeration foaming of the oil. Not sure how an oil filter could promote that, but its the only guess.

 

[John_Conrad]

i hope you find the problem trav, i love this engine myself and have one with about 325k miles on an olds 88 that is my daily driver and then some.

 

[goodtimes]

Isn't your bypass valve in the engine? Are you using the part number specified by Fram? Using Napa specified part number too? Because if your Gold has a bypass valve and your Fram does not, and your block bypass is malfunctioning it would explain it. It makes no sense though still, as the ticking is getting worse you say. If it was oil filter flow it would stay the same. I would bet the filter, any name brand filter actually, flows more than it needs to on that engine. It may be a failing, or failed, bypass valve.

 

[Doog]

That's why I use the orange can or any other cheapo filter.

 

[dlundblad]

This reminds me of the tick my jeep developed while using Mobil 1 filters. I assume it turned out to be the lifters.

A tick lasting as long as you say has to be mechanical and not filter related, but then again, it sure is ironic is started the next day..

 

[John_Conrad]

the 3800 should have an oil filter bypass valve on the oil filter adapter of which a full flow filter should be used, there is also supposed to be a spring-loaded oil pressure relief valve located in the engine front cover-exactly where I don't know for sure as i have not had issues with mine, but only passing the info along. It's function is supposed to be to limit the oil pressure some how.

hope this helps out

 

[KCJeep]

I would normally suspect a difference in the bypass valves but that doesn't apply here. Interesting.

Crazyoildude didn't put you up to this did he?

 

[tig1]

Several years ago I started using ST filters from WM. Finally a month or so after changing oil I suddenly got the cold start lifter tick that lasted a few seconds(4.2 Ford truck engine). This kept up for a few days. I changed the filter to a MC and no more tick. I have stayed with MC ever since.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad
This reminds me of the tick my jeep developed while using Mobil 1 filters. I assume it turned out to be the lifters.

A tick lasting as long as you say has to be mechanical and not filter related, but then again, it sure is ironic is started the next day..


Most of the ticking is gone within a few seconds but if you listen closely you can hear faint ticking sounds for a few minutes. Most people wouldn't even notice them after the first few seconds but i do.
I know that engine like i know the back of my hand inside and out. The slightest difference in sound, vibration or running is noticed right away.

The sound did start right after putting that filter on, so we will see.