Is there any evidence that motors with sophisticated timing chain systems (long winding timing chains) cause motor oil to brake down faster during use?
Motors hard on oil
- Thread starter Camprunner
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Put yourself in place of an oil molecule: how would you like to be squished between a chain link and a gear tooth every 5 seconds? I think some sympathy is in order here.
Man, you are awesome !!
Well I have heard that the VQ35 motors are hard on oil. Have a tendency to shear oil very well. I've heard that the timing chain guides are where the weak point is in the motor. Guides break and cause all kinds of trouble. One reason I don't go way long intervals is what I've heard about these motors being hard on oil. But more importantly is the fact that 50% of my driving is stop and go, plus short trips to the numerous grocery stores nearby. Almost always manage to forget something
Well I have heard that the VQ35 motors are hard on oil. Have a tendency to shear oil very well. I've heard that the timing chain guides are where the weak point is in the motor. Guides break and cause all kinds of trouble. One reason I don't go way long intervals is what I've heard about these motors being hard on oil. But more importantly is the fact that 50% of my driving is stop and go, plus short trips to the numerous grocery stores nearby. Almost always manage to forget something
No correlation - plenty of Crown Vics with overhead cams and a really long timing chain - those run forever.
^^^what SVTCobra said^^^
Even the 4V versions with an extra chain at each head...
Even the 4V versions with an extra chain at each head...
Originally Posted By: bbhero
Man, you are awesome !!
Well I have heard that the VQ35 motors are hard on oil. Have a tendency to shear oil very well. I've heard that the timing chain guides are where the weak point is in the motor. Guides break and cause all kinds of trouble. One reason I don't go way long intervals is what I've heard about these motors being hard on oil. But more importantly is the fact that 50% of my driving is stop and go, plus short trips to the numerous grocery stores nearby. Almost always manage to forget something
I think the VQ has become notorious for shearing oil because of its small sump.
Man, you are awesome !!
Well I have heard that the VQ35 motors are hard on oil. Have a tendency to shear oil very well. I've heard that the timing chain guides are where the weak point is in the motor. Guides break and cause all kinds of trouble. One reason I don't go way long intervals is what I've heard about these motors being hard on oil. But more importantly is the fact that 50% of my driving is stop and go, plus short trips to the numerous grocery stores nearby. Almost always manage to forget something
I think the VQ has become notorious for shearing oil because of its small sump.
Originally Posted By: SVTCobra
No correlation - plenty of Crown Vics with overhead cams and a really long timing chain - those run forever.
When I first started reading BITOG, timing chains causing depletion of oil was all the talk. That was long ago shot down after XM Q&A answered that question regarding 10-15K OCI.
No correlation - plenty of Crown Vics with overhead cams and a really long timing chain - those run forever.
When I first started reading BITOG, timing chains causing depletion of oil was all the talk. That was long ago shot down after XM Q&A answered that question regarding 10-15K OCI.
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I have 220k on my CR-V with a chain. No issues.
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Originally Posted By: bbhero
Man, you are awesome !!
Well I have heard that the VQ35 motors are hard on oil. Have a tendency to shear oil very well. I've heard that the timing chain guides are where the weak point is in the motor. Guides break and cause all kinds of trouble. One reason I don't go way long intervals is what I've heard about these motors being hard on oil. But more importantly is the fact that 50% of my driving is stop and go, plus short trips to the numerous grocery stores nearby. Almost always manage to forget something
I think the VQ has become notorious for shearing oil because of its small sump.
Agree on this point. My MIL's VQ37 is a 5 quart sump. So is my 4-cylinder CR-V.
Originally Posted By: bbhero
Man, you are awesome !!
Well I have heard that the VQ35 motors are hard on oil. Have a tendency to shear oil very well. I've heard that the timing chain guides are where the weak point is in the motor. Guides break and cause all kinds of trouble. One reason I don't go way long intervals is what I've heard about these motors being hard on oil. But more importantly is the fact that 50% of my driving is stop and go, plus short trips to the numerous grocery stores nearby. Almost always manage to forget something
I think the VQ has become notorious for shearing oil because of its small sump.
Agree on this point. My MIL's VQ37 is a 5 quart sump. So is my 4-cylinder CR-V.
My Navigator has big chains. Doesn't shear 5/20 much on 10k OCI'S, towing outrageously heavy loads.
Honda's R18 is another.
More factors involved, I think.
Honda's R18 is another.
More factors involved, I think.
Don't know if we can blame that either. People have been running chevrolet v8's with double roller chains and high power levels on 5 quart sumps for generations.
Originally Posted By: Chris Meutsch
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Originally Posted By: bbhero
Man, you are awesome !!
Well I have heard that the VQ35 motors are hard on oil. Have a tendency to shear oil very well. I've heard that the timing chain guides are where the weak point is in the motor. Guides break and cause all kinds of trouble. One reason I don't go way long intervals is what I've heard about these motors being hard on oil. But more importantly is the fact that 50% of my driving is stop and go, plus short trips to the numerous grocery stores nearby. Almost always manage to forget something
I think the VQ has become notorious for shearing oil because of its small sump.
Agree on this point. My MIL's VQ37 is a 5 quart sump. So is my 4-cylinder CR-V.
Prior to '03, Ford's mod motor 4.6 also have a 5qt sump... Was increased to 6 for the '03 MY...
AFAIK trucks were always at least 6 qt...
Supposedly the squeezing between chain links and gears damages the VIIs but that may well be on earlier oils... These engines can run 300K mi with relative ease, can't really be hard on oil...
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Originally Posted By: bbhero
Man, you are awesome !!
Well I have heard that the VQ35 motors are hard on oil. Have a tendency to shear oil very well. I've heard that the timing chain guides are where the weak point is in the motor. Guides break and cause all kinds of trouble. One reason I don't go way long intervals is what I've heard about these motors being hard on oil. But more importantly is the fact that 50% of my driving is stop and go, plus short trips to the numerous grocery stores nearby. Almost always manage to forget something
I think the VQ has become notorious for shearing oil because of its small sump.
Agree on this point. My MIL's VQ37 is a 5 quart sump. So is my 4-cylinder CR-V.
Prior to '03, Ford's mod motor 4.6 also have a 5qt sump... Was increased to 6 for the '03 MY...
AFAIK trucks were always at least 6 qt...
Supposedly the squeezing between chain links and gears damages the VIIs but that may well be on earlier oils... These engines can run 300K mi with relative ease, can't really be hard on oil...
No correlation.
Many timing chains aren't hard on oil at all. Plenty of belt-driven engines are hard on oil, such as Toyota's MZ sludger and VW's awful 1.8T.
Many timing chains aren't hard on oil at all. Plenty of belt-driven engines are hard on oil, such as Toyota's MZ sludger and VW's awful 1.8T.
Saab 2.3L engines are somewhat notorious for being hard on oil but it's due to the turbocharger and placement of the catalytic converter next to the oil pan, not because of their timing chains or balance chains.
I think the GM 3.6L DI engine, especially the ones in the Lambda platform (Enclave, Traverse, Acadia, Outlook) could be considered hard on oil. Maybe they (the 3.6L DI) have gotten better but the 2009 versions, based on UOAs here and elsewhere, showed that engine would chew up Mobil 1 in less than 5K miles and spit it out. Beats up most other oils as well. The OLM has been recalibrated, in 2011 (I believe it was 2011) GM went to a larger filter to increase the overall oil capacity, and in either 2010 or 2011 a more robust chain started being use. Still not an engine I would go by and trust the OLM for change intervals.
Originally Posted By: Camprunner
Is there any evidence that motors with sophisticated timing chain systems (long winding timing chains) cause motor oil to brake down faster during use?
1.6L GDI and turbocharged engine in Nissan Juke...breaks oil down like nobodies business. Every UOA on 2 Jukes now (13 and 15) is out of the grade, if not the grade below that.
QSUD 5w/30 2000 miles, 8.61 cSt @100C should be 8.8-11.1
Pennoil Ultra (the good stuff) 10w/30 3144 miles, all road trip, 9.10 cSt @100C, should be 9.7-11.9
Nissan FF 1426 miles, all local trips, 5.91 cSt @100C, unknown what it should be, but not this
Mobil 7500, 10w/30 2288 miles, road trip, 7.89 cSt @100C, should be 9.9-11.9
Is there any evidence that motors with sophisticated timing chain systems (long winding timing chains) cause motor oil to brake down faster during use?
1.6L GDI and turbocharged engine in Nissan Juke...breaks oil down like nobodies business. Every UOA on 2 Jukes now (13 and 15) is out of the grade, if not the grade below that.
QSUD 5w/30 2000 miles, 8.61 cSt @100C should be 8.8-11.1
Pennoil Ultra (the good stuff) 10w/30 3144 miles, all road trip, 9.10 cSt @100C, should be 9.7-11.9
Nissan FF 1426 miles, all local trips, 5.91 cSt @100C, unknown what it should be, but not this
Mobil 7500, 10w/30 2288 miles, road trip, 7.89 cSt @100C, should be 9.9-11.9
Originally Posted By: lonestar
I think the GM 3.6L DI engine, especially the ones in the Lambda platform (Enclave, Traverse, Acadia, Outlook) could be considered hard on oil. Maybe they (the 3.6L DI) have gotten better but the 2009 versions, based on UOAs here and elsewhere, showed that engine would chew up Mobil 1 in less than 5K miles and spit it out. Beats up most other oils as well. The OLM has been recalibrated, in 2011 (I believe it was 2011) GM went to a larger filter to increase the overall oil capacity, and in either 2010 or 2011 a more robust chain started being use. Still not an engine I would go by and trust the OLM for change intervals.
Being the owner of a 3.6l DI engine in our Acadia and from all the UOA's, ours at least is a beast on the oil. 5k miles is max distance for an oil change. Engine design and our driving style - trashed oil.
I think the GM 3.6L DI engine, especially the ones in the Lambda platform (Enclave, Traverse, Acadia, Outlook) could be considered hard on oil. Maybe they (the 3.6L DI) have gotten better but the 2009 versions, based on UOAs here and elsewhere, showed that engine would chew up Mobil 1 in less than 5K miles and spit it out. Beats up most other oils as well. The OLM has been recalibrated, in 2011 (I believe it was 2011) GM went to a larger filter to increase the overall oil capacity, and in either 2010 or 2011 a more robust chain started being use. Still not an engine I would go by and trust the OLM for change intervals.
Being the owner of a 3.6l DI engine in our Acadia and from all the UOA's, ours at least is a beast on the oil. 5k miles is max distance for an oil change. Engine design and our driving style - trashed oil.
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
I think the VQ has become notorious for shearing oil because of its small sump.
And somewhat related, the rather high oil temperatures can't help either.
I think the VQ has become notorious for shearing oil because of its small sump.
And somewhat related, the rather high oil temperatures can't help either.
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