Hundreds march at McDonald's HQ over low wages

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
The retail and food industry is generally low paying for hourly Non management positions. At some point you have to make a career decision not to be stuck in a low paying job.

When I was 15 years old I was working in a supermarket at 6:30 AM on the weekends, I'm white and laugh at when people say 'white privileged folks' having an easy road in life. My sister worked at Burger King in high school, now is a lawyer.... She is also white and unprivileged.



I hear you, growing up in England, I too worked from the age of 13, maybe 14, collecting eggs in battery chicken houses, did school, technical college, an apprenticeship in toolmaking, made it up into the engineers office where I was plugged and plugged for more and more work until I couldnt take anymore. I quit 11/11/01 of all days. Now I work in a wearhouse doing mostly unskilled labor where im lucky that my boss sees my value and pays me more than he would have to if he paid someone else.

Im white and I see the fact that I am privileged here in the US compared to those that are not. Its the simple fact of racial inequality/divide, like it or not. In this country, to be male & white has you at the top of the tree. There are capital C citizens and lwr case c citizens. That rabbit hole goes much deeper but [censored] there to be read.
Don't let the screen door hit you....

 

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: tenderloin
At least in Southern California what has happened over the past decades are many jobs including fast food that was once done by teenagers and college students are now done by mostly Hispanic adults. What was once pocket money or money towards something...a car, education expenses etc. has now become wages to live on...even raise a family on...something these jobs were never intended do. Add in the devastating effect particularly on teenage unemployment in the inner cities where many of these jobs were lost... and we have a mess. Kids without jobs, losing hope. Adults trying to survive (I am sure in some cases with government help) on jobs that were not meant to live on let alone raise a family. IMO this will just get worse as millions more come here every year looking for a better life. $15 an hour will not IMO change/fix the problem
You are exactly right.

 

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser
Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser
Its obvious that none of us here have all the answers, especially me.

Im disgusted by corporate greed and the great inequality.

I do wonder, having looked over the comments, who here does not have white skin? I'd say that us that do have little idea of what its really like to be of color in the US.

The system is broken and I maintain that until we change how money works, we'll change little, if anything.
Fiat money breaks societies and its breaking this american empire, this is a society on its way down, the signs are screamingly clear.

How much do I make?...enough to live a simple life, to run a 15 yr old car. Im many things but greedy aint one.

As for McDonalds being a stepping stone to other things, for many that is the case but not all. If its a longer term job, I ask the same question, why should ANYONE that works 40+ hours still be poor?

We come here and discuss things, we clash, we disagree, but every single person on this planet deserves at least a basic standard of living and to be provided with clean water, food and shelter. It aint happening.
Fine, add a little extra to your tax return, Nothing stopping you from that, is there?


So that I can help pay a little more of the country's debt?..no thanks.
Thanks for NOT putting your money where your mouth is.

 

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: user52165
I wonder how many of those workers have an iphone 5 or 6 at $80/mo and .................?

I read somewhere that McD has a test lab with robotics flipping burgers and other tasks. Just a matter of time before they are implemented.
Looks like we'll have to outlaw them as well.

 

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: Astro14
So, which are they doing? Shelling out money for education, or working?

You missed my point. I was saying we can't expect people who are already making less than a living wage to choose to work (and thus earn) even less AND take on the financial burdens of an education. That's getting more and more true by the day as colleges get more competitive, degrees are worth less and less, and the cost of higher education skyrockets.

There has to be another solution. Imposing on companies to pay more is a terrible one by any standard, but it's far from the worst.


Originally Posted By: Astro14
You do realize that there are opportunities for folks from all walks of life.

Of course there are. And if you read carefully, I don't imply otherwise.

What I'm arguing is that there aren't enough opportunities for everyone.
Yup, no indians (like Granny Warren) needed, just chiefs. Karl Marx had a solution, it didn't work. The leftists claim "because it wasn't done right". They prefer boiling the frog slowly.

 

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: spasm3
The market does not support it. These are basically entry level minimal skill jobs in a low cost low quality food market. The jobs are not designed to be for a long career.
Why should someone demand higher pay when you flip burgers or push the cheeseburger button. No real physical demands, no real education skills needed, and no shortage of workers.

I'm not knocking those who do that, its just that the job skills don't warrant a higher rate of pay.
It's not as though they haven't been told since the first grade they need to get an education, academic or vocational, but they "knew better". I see kids a generation out of the South East Asian jungle going to Harvard on merit, while "other minorities" want more AA admissions. The left loves to sell the notion that under THEM, "everybody will win". Yup, neat trick, and that's all it is. It all works until you run out of other folks money.

 

[user52165]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Originally Posted By: tenderloin
At least in Southern California what has happened over the past decades are many jobs including fast food that was once done by teenagers and college students are now done by mostly Hispanic adults. What was once pocket money or money towards something...a car, education expenses etc. has now become wages to live on...even raise a family on...something these jobs were never intended do. Add in the devastating effect particularly on teenage unemployment in the inner cities where many of these jobs were lost... and we have a mess. Kids without jobs, losing hope. Adults trying to survive (I am sure in some cases with government help) on jobs that were not meant to live on let alone raise a family. IMO this will just get worse as millions more come here every year looking for a better life. $15 an hour will not IMO change/fix the problem
You are exactly right.


+2 And I'm sure other places also.

 

[tenderloin]

The same people complaining about low wages in many cases are also supporters of open borders, H1B visas etc.

 

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: tenderloin
The same people complaining about low wages in many cases are also supporters of open borders, H1B visas etc.
+1. Is it too much to ask for a coherent immigration policy which balances the ability to supply work and government services against the numbers admitted? Looks like the policy today is to import voters for "our" side instead, regardless of what the rest of us can afford can support.

 

[tenderloin]

Originally Posted By: tenderloin
At least in Southern California what has happened over the past decades are many jobs including fast food that was once done by teenagers and college students are now done by mostly Hispanic adults. What was once pocket money or money towards something...a car, education expenses etc. has now become wages to live on...even raise a family on...something these jobs were never intended do. Add in the devastating effect particularly on teenage unemployment in the inner cities where many of these jobs were lost... and we have a mess. Kids without jobs, losing hope. Adults trying to survive (I am sure in some cases with government help) on jobs that were not meant to live on let alone raise a family. IMO this will just get worse as millions more come here every year looking for a better life. $15 an hour will not IMO change/fix the problem

On the other side, construction and warehouse jobs etc. that once paid a living wage..enough to raise a family on.. have been taken over by others who work for far less. In my area for decades most construction jobs were done by white and black Americans. These men worked hard and were paid a good wage...again where they could have a decent life and raise a family. Along came a group who while working hard worked for much less. Contractors over time replaced the white and black workers until only a few in supervisor jobs remain. The bleeding heart "white privilege" gang never addresses that tragedy that cost hundreds of thousand of US born workers of all colors to leave an industry (construction) that once was a source of family raising jobs.

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: user52165
I wonder how many of those workers have an iphone 5 or 6 at $80/mo and .................?

I read somewhere that McD has a test lab with robotics flipping burgers and other tasks. Just a matter of time before they are implemented.


They feel the sense of entitlement. Phone, TV etc.

 

[4D-56]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser
Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser
Its obvious that none of us here have all the answers, especially me.

Im disgusted by corporate greed and the great inequality.

I do wonder, having looked over the comments, who here does not have white skin? I'd say that us that do have little idea of what its really like to be of color in the US.

The system is broken and I maintain that until we change how money works, we'll change little, if anything.
Fiat money breaks societies and its breaking this american empire, this is a society on its way down, the signs are screamingly clear.

How much do I make?...enough to live a simple life, to run a 15 yr old car. Im many things but greedy aint one.

As for McDonalds being a stepping stone to other things, for many that is the case but not all. If its a longer term job, I ask the same question, why should ANYONE that works 40+ hours still be poor?

We come here and discuss things, we clash, we disagree, but every single person on this planet deserves at least a basic standard of living and to be provided with clean water, food and shelter. It aint happening.
Fine, add a little extra to your tax return, Nothing stopping you from that, is there?


So that I can help pay a little more of the country's debt?..no thanks.
Thanks for NOT putting your money where your mouth is.


How can you put it anywhere when it is prob the greatest problem? Its worth nothing.

 

[mtndew_dad]

That's twice now you have mentioned how a person of color is at a disadvantage in the US. This is 2015, not 1960. I work at one of those large greedy corporations that disgust you so much. Not only do they provide a highly needed and desired product, thousands of people are employed by the company and nobody makes minimum wage. This greedy corporation is also very generous to the community and people in need. As I look around the office, I see a very diverse workforce. Many "people of color", not one of which earned their job because the were a minority. They earned it by being the best and brightest of those that applied for the job to begin with. We are all created equal in the human rights sense, but we are not all created equal when it come to intelligence, motivation or artistic and creative ability.

In a prior job, I had to go into residences all over the city. Rich and poor, white and "people of color". The poorest of the poor still seemed to be able to afford cigarettes, a smart phone, xBox and big screen TV. They lack good judgement from my point of view, and that most likely carried through at school and on the job. Frankly, they seemed content with their simple existence and a higher minimum wage would only mean more video games and Cheetos. They would not invest in an education or learning a trade. They all had clean water, food and shelter, so their basic needs were met. They fill a segment of the workforce that fits their skill set and nobody is stopping them from improving upon that. By forcing a higher than market wage to be paid, it will really hurt the people you aim to help the most. Those greedy corporations and franchise owners will in turn be forced to raise the price at the consumer level, making those basic needs more difficult to afford. How does that benefit a disabled, retired or unemployed person who doesn't get that pay raise?

I can't stand the thought of innocent children going hungry. Maybe instead of forcing McDonalds to pay double the minimum wage they could donate a meal for every hour an employee works at minimum wage. I am not in favor of any government law that pushes wages beyond what the market supports, but I bet a meal donation program would do more good for those who truly need it than a pumped up minimum wage.

Just "thinking out loud" here.

 

[4D-56]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
The retail and food industry is generally low paying for hourly Non management positions. At some point you have to make a career decision not to be stuck in a low paying job.

When I was 15 years old I was working in a supermarket at 6:30 AM on the weekends, I'm white and laugh at when people say 'white privileged folks' having an easy road in life. My sister worked at Burger King in high school, now is a lawyer.... She is also white and unprivileged.



I hear you, growing up in England, I too worked from the age of 13, maybe 14, collecting eggs in battery chicken houses, did school, technical college, an apprenticeship in toolmaking, made it up into the engineers office where I was plugged and plugged for more and more work until I couldnt take anymore. I quit 11/11/01 of all days. Now I work in a wearhouse doing mostly unskilled labor where im lucky that my boss sees my value and pays me more than he would have to if he paid someone else.

Im white and I see the fact that I am privileged here in the US compared to those that are not. Its the simple fact of racial inequality/divide, like it or not. In this country, to be male & white has you at the top of the tree. There are capital C citizens and lwr case c citizens. That rabbit hole goes much deeper but [censored] there to be read.
Don't let the screen door hit you....


??

 

[Tdbo]

Originally Posted By: spasm3
The market does not support it. These are basically entry level minimal skill jobs in a low cost low quality food market. The jobs are not designed to be for a long career.
Why should someone demand higher pay when you flip burgers or push the cheeseburger button. No real physical demands, no real education skills needed, and no shortage of workers.

I'm not knocking those who do that, its just that the job skills don't warrant a higher rate of pay.


You obviously understand the basic fundamentals of Economics.
I also understand the basic fundamentals of Economics.
The problem is does the basic burger flipper in the fast food joint of your choice understand the basic fundamentals of Economics?
No they don't. However they understand and fully embrace the concept of entitlement that is permeating this country.

 

[Win]

Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser

With respect, this is an easy, common and inadequate response to a great and growing issue in this country.



With respect, price out acquisition of a franchise location, land, site work, concrete, building costs, equipment, and operating costs, and then get back to us with your plan to remedy the low wage problem.

 

[eljefino]

Originally Posted By: Win
Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser

With respect, this is an easy, common and inadequate response to a great and growing issue in this country.



With respect, price out acquisition of a franchise location, land, site work, concrete, building costs, equipment, and operating costs, and then get back to us with your plan to remedy the low wage problem.


This is a straw man argument as one assumes this restaurant will be an island of above-market pay in a city of $7.25/hr.

Macro-economics doesn't work this way (and one single restaurant would be unsustainable.) As the lobbying is for a raise of a buck a year until $15 is hit sometime in the 2020's, the market will adjust. Will the franchise fee drop b/c it's not worth owning a business that requires low wage humans? Will the real estate drop? Will the core fast food eating base of customers get richer and be able to spend another dime on hamburgers? The models have been run... it comes out for the 3rd option.

 

[IndyIan]

We have $9-10 combos up here at the fast food joints and they aren't closing down. Also the truly poor people aren't using a fast food joint regularly anyways, as its a waste of money, so it doesn't matter to them if a combo becomes more expensive.

My view from the outside of the US, is not you have "white privilege", but you have "capital privilege". So kids of equal intelligence and drive will have vastly different life skill building opportunities depending how much money your parents have. The tiny school districts seem designed to perpetuate cycle of being poor and on welfare, and the differences in school funding basically says to poor kids that you are not worth educating...
Sure some McD's employees aren't going to spend extra wages on getting their kids into college, but probably the ones who bothered to protest do have bigger ambitions than just getting a bigger TV...

 

[SteveSRT8]

It's sad to see the lower wage workers being manipulated right out of their jobs. Raise the wages. They've already done it in a couple of major cities and the economic effects are well known. The jobs dry up, businesses close, more folks on the dole. We already have 109 million people who want work and cannot find it!

Note also that throwing more money at a corrupted school system will never fix it. Here we have a Superintendent at 250k with TWO assistants who make 100k a year each! It's a bit heavy at the top, and the unions are in complete control. Absolutely impossible to change it the way it is currently structured.

My wife routinely sees clients who have children who have NEVER seen a parent get up and go to work. EVER! These kids will never be productive members of society. We have done this to ourselves. Expect a great decline in this country for a few decades while we either figure it out or cease to exist...

 

[Win]

Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: Win
Originally Posted By: stro_cruiser

With respect, this is an easy, common and inadequate response to a great and growing issue in this country.



With respect, price out acquisition of a franchise location, land, site work, concrete, building costs, equipment, and operating costs, and then get back to us with your plan to remedy the low wage problem.


This is a straw man argument as one assumes this restaurant will be an island of above-market pay in a city of $7.25/hr.

Macro-economics doesn't work this way (and one single restaurant would be unsustainable.) As the lobbying is for a raise of a buck a year until $15 is hit sometime in the 2020's, the market will adjust. Will the franchise fee drop b/c it's not worth owning a business that requires low wage humans? Will the real estate drop? Will the core fast food eating base of customers get richer and be able to spend another dime on hamburgers? The models have been run... it comes out for the 3rd option.



Straw man? Have you ever created a business from scratch?

You increase the value of labor by increasing the demand for it. It's not rocket science.