Honda Ultra NEXT JDM oil VOA

[A_Harman]

Originally Posted By: fourside


However, the speculated VI of this oil on Japanese websites was just that - speculation, as the sources themselves even said. The estimates were based on a (flawed) belief that the KV40 was 16.72 and the KV100 was 5.070. My results with Blackstone were 20.844 cSt @40C and 5.13 @ 100C, resulting in the 191 VI result. That said, I'm still very keen to see how this oil fares in my car.


You went and got your own data. This puts you in a small group of people who find out things for themselves instead of just repeating other peoples dubious assumptions. Maybe you could post the UOA result on the Japanese websites.

 

[CATERHAM]

Just as a point of interest since the rest of us can't get this oil, Motul 300V Sprint 0W-15 is available and has the same KV100 of 5.1cSt (it's HTHSV is 2.0cP) but does have a lower 155 VI. Using the new lighter SAE grading system, this would be a 0W-12. While not as light as NEXT it is lighter than Sustina 0W-20 so should be suitable for Honda Fit, Insight and other models that NEXT is specified for (outside of warranty of course).

 

[fourside]

Good to know! For the record, this stuff isn't particularly expensive in Japan. 4L can be had for the current equivalent of about $25 USD, which is about $6/quart. Unfortunately the cost of shipping a 4L container would probably make it even more expensive than Sustina.

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Motul 300V Sprint 0W-15 is available and has the same KV100 of 5.1cSt (it's HTHSV is 2.0cP) but does have a lower 155 VI.


I take for granted that this stuff does not contain a single micro milligram of ANY VII, given that VI, and the high group 5 base stock content, correct?

IF it did not bring down the VI so much, it would be a good 'thinning mixer' to add to their Trophy 300V 0W-40, which sadly cannot afford to lose any VI, as it is at 'only' at 186 to begin with.

 

[fourside]

A little update on the MPG performance of this oil. My previous best on a trip up north to Orange County was about 42mpg. Today, driving the same route, I managed over 45mpg.

Now, this did also include a little more efficient driving on my part, but nothing too crazy. So far I'm impressed with the freed up fuel efficiency with this lightweight oil and if it performs well in UOAs I may decide to continue running it.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Motul 300V Sprint 0W-15 is available and has the same KV100 of 5.1cSt (it's HTHSV is 2.0cP) but does have a lower 155 VI.


I take for granted that this stuff does not contain a single micro milligram of ANY VII, given that VI, and the high group 5 base stock content, correct?

IF it did not bring down the VI so much, it would be a good 'thinning mixer' to add to their Trophy 300V 0W-40, which sadly cannot afford to lose any VI, as it is at 'only' at 186 to begin with.

Yes it likely isn't formulated with any VIIs other than the polymer dispersants that are in the DI package.

In the PDS for this race oriented oil it states it's not to be blended. And a VOA of Trophy 300V 0W-40 indicated a VI in the low 170 range IIRC.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: fourside
I think you're most likely right on that. I don't have an HTHS number for this. Most of what's available online in Japanese is speculative (thus, the incorrect VI prediction) but the consensus does seem to be that it's around SAE 8.

Since the Motul 300V Sprint 0W-15 has the same KV100 and a HTHSV of 2.0cP with only a 155 VI one would think the much higher VI Honda NEXT oil would have an even higher HTHSV making it an SAE 12.
The only problem is, Motul being ester based and likely formulated without VIIs probably has a higher pressure-viscosity coefficient meaning that's it's HTHSV is higher relative to it's KV100.
That said, my guess is that Honda Ultra NEXT would be an SAE 12.

 

[Shannow]

CATERHAM,
you've mentioned this "pressure viscosity" co-efficient a couple of time WRT HTHS.

Could you please expound on this, what it is, and where you can get references on it ?

Or are you mistaking "shear rate" for pressure ?

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
In the PDS for this race oriented oil it states it's not to be blended. And a VOA of Trophy 300V 0W-40 indicated a VI in the low 170 range IIRC.


WOW, THAT low, huh? (Of course many on here would consider that a HIGH VI!

)

Here I was thinking that the spec sheet claim was low.

Looks like I will stick to my current blend with more RL 0W-40 for the summer mix.

 

[fourside]

UOA posted! Here you go guys:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3742266#Post3742266

 

[friendly_jacek]

Originally Posted By: fourside
A little update on the MPG performance of this oil. My previous best on a trip up north to Orange County was about 42mpg. Today, driving the same route, I managed over 45mpg.


what speed if i may ask? MPG without MPH is worthless for comparison sake.
what oil was used for the 42 number?

 

[fourside]

Both trips would've been driven at 70-80mph depending on the conditions on the highway - slower uphill and faster down. I don't think my driving habits were significantly different between the two.

 

[friendly_jacek]

well, at those speeds, this is very impressive. i assume MT?

 

[fourside]

MT indeed. My mpg for full tanks range anywhere from 35mpg on the low end to 39-40 on the higher end (my best was 46mpg but that was nearly all highway). The car is capable of even better fuel efficiency than I can get out of it, I'm sure. I tend to drive it harder than I should most of the time rather than try to maximize efficiency.

 

[Gokhan]

FWIW, waking up a dead thread, I estimated the HTHS viscosity of the Nissan Next oil to be 1.85 cP using my calculator, adjusting the base-oil viscosity to be that of a GTL +DDI pack (~ 150). So, it is a SAE 0W-8, with the HTHS viscosity right in the middle between the lower limits of SAE 8 (1.7 cP) and SAE 12 (2.0 cP).

Base oil and VII calculator

 

[Gokhan]

FWIW, waking up a dead thread, I estimated the HTHS viscosity of the Nissan Next oil to be 1.85 cP using my calculator, adjusting the base-oil viscosity to be that of a GTL +DDI pack (~ 150). So, it is a SAE 0W-8, with the HTHS viscosity right in the middle between the lower limits of SAE 8 (1.7 cP) and SAE 12 (2.0 cP).

Base oil and VII calculator

Correction: Honda Ultra Next.