Moly in Pennzoil Products

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I noticed that PYB has very high Moly compared to PP and PU. Why do you think this is and why not have higher amounts in their better oils?
 
There is speculation that Pennzoil is using Infineum's trinuclear moly product in their synthetic oils (Infineum is a joint venture between Mobil Oil and Royal Dutch Shell, so this would make sense). The trinuclear version, while more expensive, can achieve the same effect at a much lower treatment rate.

In the less expensive products like PYB, they are likely using a less expensive product, which requires a higher treatment rate.
 
Originally Posted By: danthaman1980
There is speculation that Pennzoil is using Infineum's trinuclear moly product in their synthetic oils (Infineum is a joint venture between Mobil Oil and Royal Dutch Shell, so this would make sense). The trinuclear version, while more expensive, can achieve the same effect at a much lower treatment rate.

In the less expensive products like PYB, they are likely using a less expensive product, which requires a higher treatment rate.



Are you sure? I haven't read about that anywhere. It might be speculation it might be fact. But I'm not accepting what you say as gospel.

How do we know what form of Moly is in PYB vs. PUP?
 
Originally Posted By: Phishin
How do we know what form of Moly is in PYB vs. PUP?


We don't. That's why it's speculation.
smile.gif


This was fairly widely discussed a year or two ago when we saw the molybdenum treatment rate decline by orders of magnitude in some oils (notably some of the Japanese OEM oils).
 
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
We don't. That's why it's speculation.
smile.gif


This was fairly widely discussed a year or two ago when we saw the molybdenum treatment rate decline by orders of magnitude in some oils (notably some of the Japanese OEM oils).


^^^ Thanks for this! I was careful to point out that it was speculation right from the start, and I never said it was fact or gospel!!!

We are speculating that SOPUS would be reaping the benefits from Shell's joint venture w/Mobil by using Infineum's trinuclear moly in some products. It has never been confirmed. But the OP didn't ask for proof, the OP asked "Why do you think this is and why not have higher amounts in their better oils?" I think/speculate that it is due to trinuclear moly.
wink.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: Phishin
How do we know what form of Moly is in PYB vs. PUP?


We don't. That's why it's speculation.
smile.gif


This was fairly widely discussed a year or two ago when we saw the molybdenum treatment rate decline by orders of magnitude in some oils (notably some of the Japanese OEM oils).


From ConocoPhillips...
http://www.ocsoil.fi/upload/News on Lubes/ILSAC-GF-5.pdf

The TEOST 33C bench test evaluates an engine oil’s tendency to form high-temperature
deposits. This test was originally developed and included in GF-2 to evaluate turbocharger
deposits. It was not part of GF-3 or GF-4, but is back in GF-5 in anticipation of greater use of
turbochargers. Turbochargers allow the automakers to use smaller displacement, more fuel-
efficient engines while still maintaining high power output. Deposit buildup in the turbocharger
bearing areas can lead to loss of engine performance, turbocharger failure and possibly engine
failure. In GF-2, the maximum limit for deposits was 60 mg. For GF-5, the maximum limit is 30
mg (except there is no limit for SAE 0W-20 oils because some Japanese OEMs recommend
SAE 0W-20 oils with high molybdenum content which will not pass this test).
 
wemay,

Interesting. Thanks for posting this information. It makes sense given that supposedly much of GF-6 is about turbocharged DI. This is the second reference that I've seen apparently saying to defer from using oils w/metal additives like molybdenum disulphide in DI engines ( but especially turbo'd ones ). With DI, you've got to look at the engine and not pontificate about "how great it would be" if the oil had moly in it.
 
See my UOA here:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3689425/Pennz_Ultra_5W-30_Euro_L,_Niss#Post3689425

Note the previous Moly numbers from mileage 24,985 and back compared to this recent one with Pennz Ultra L and the one before with regular Ultra. Those numbers up to 24,985 miles were using Redline 5W-30. The Ultra L that I used by mistake still gave a very good report.

The Ultra has negligible amounts of Moly and the Redline is much higher than the universal averages for Moly. Are those averages for my UOA's or for all 5W-30's that Blackstone checks ?
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Vuflanovsky
wemay,

Interesting. Thanks for posting this information. It makes sense given that supposedly much of GF-6 is about turbocharged DI. This is the second reference that I've seen apparently saying to defer from using oils w/metal additives like molybdenum disulphide in DI engines ( but especially turbo'd ones ). With DI, you've got to look at the engine and not pontificate about "how great it would be" if the oil had moly in it.


Any time. I too am beginning to tailor oil purchase accordingly.
 
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: Phishin
How do we know what form of Moly is in PYB vs. PUP?


We don't. That's why it's speculation.
smile.gif


And fair speculation, too. Obviously Shell and XOM are making this ingredient for something.
 
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