What's so special about Amsoil?

[Revving2Redline]

It might do a little better if they made some high mileage synthetics. Amsoil wants people to repair leaking vehicles for best results where others are making a adequate alternative that saves people money with oils that might prolong a leak/consumption. I like to shop late and sometimes change oil late; amsoil store isnt open for my schedule. They mostly pushed me away from their products when they start getting oci sensative about my aftermarket exhaust and dry filterintake system and warranty issues.But a stock Z06 500HP Vette all OEM keeps the extended oci warranty. Keep your product, it might be better but PUP 5w30 under 30.00 for 5qts is something they cant even come close to.

 

[SlipperyPete]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
Originally Posted By: mannyhs
There can be a high cost to low prices.


To borrow a phrase, "That's the Wal Mart way."


What does everyone have against Walmart? They have a successful business model, employee thousands across the U.S. and offer great products at low prices. No one is going to spend 2-3x more than they have to, thus the success of Walmart.


Walmart avoided a concerted effort to unionize their workforce. So now the left and union types have to bash Walmart while shopping at other businesses who buy from China and pay a low wage.

 

[4wheeldog]

Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
Quote:

What does everyone have against Walmart?


They privatize profit and discharge risk


That is a very succinct way of putting it....But I wonder how many people realize that their taxes pay for Wallyworld's risk?

 

[Dallas69]

Amsoil wont do anything that any namebrand synthetic off the shelf oil can't do.
Some people will pay to be different.

 

[jk_636]

Originally Posted By: dave1251
Originally Posted By: jk_636
There is no reason to spend extra coin on Amsoil when you can get a 5 quart jug of Royal Purple for $37 at Walmart. You would be hard pressed to find a better oil at a better everyday value.

If Amsoil ever changes their ridiculous sales strategy and bring their oils to the mainstream market I would try them. Im surprised that their gimmicky sales strategy hasn't put them out of business yet. Most products cant survive over time relying on pyramid scheme sales strategies and mail order alone. JMHO


ST Syn at half the cost is a better value for a group III based PCMO.


RP is a group IV motor oil. How is super tech any better?

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
RP is a group IV motor oil. How is super tech any better?


It's what RP DO to their (alleged) GrIV to give is such mediocre specs that has me concerned.

How can they take PAO, and give is such poor low temperature performance ?

 

[jk_636]

What are you talking about? What mediocre specs are you referring to? What kind of low temp performance are you referring to? More facts are needed if you are going to bash a superior grade oil like that!

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
What are you talking about? What mediocre specs are you referring to? What kind of low temp performance are you referring to? More facts are needed if you are going to bash a superior grade oil like that!


Their PDS that shows the cold temp performance for their products, a number of which were not great. This was a heavily discussed topic recently.

 

[zpinch]

As far as I know, regular API RP is not a Grp IV synthetic, but Grp III, their HPS line is a heavy Grp IV based blend. Unless I am mistaken.

 

[147_Grain]

Originally Posted By: zpinch
As far as I know, regular API RP is not a Grp IV synthetic, but Grp III, their HPS line is a heavy Grp IV based blend. Unless I am mistaken.

Sounds like "API RP" is comparable to regular Mobil 1 (at best) and the HPS's base stock might be similar to Mobil's EP version.

 

[brandini]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
If you are in warranty you have to follow them. When out, you can do what you want, Amsoil, Mobil, or any other.

No you don't. You don't HAVE to do anything when you're in warranty. The only thing you have to do is cover your butt. Amsoil warrants their product and (insert brand of car here) warrants theirs and if (brand of car) wants to blame Amsoil on a failure they're going to have to back that up.

Quote:
UOAs time and time again show that not many OCIs have used the full life of any oil (Amsoil or not), and could go considerably longer then the manufacturer's OCI.

You're doing exactly what I said, playing the what if game. IF Amsoil doesn't make fiscal sense for you, don't use it. But don't try the shame on them game when their product will do what they claim. That makes no sense.

Quote:
You could save exactly the same amount of time and used oil on Mobil 1...and save some $$$ on intial purchase price as well.
Again you're agreeing with me, if you can, do. I am a customer from a time before even EP existed so call me loyal. Amsoil hasn't done me wrong, why would I switch?

Quote:
(Back when Mobil had a tech line in Australia, they confirmed that my own car, out of warranty, annual OCIs, even out to 40,000km were possible with M1)

So you're using long-drains that you just discarded above as a point of comparison now?

I get it, you get annoyed with the Kool-aid drinkers out there (don't we all)- but it's just oil, and nobody is forcing you to use it or shaming you for not using it. Do whatever makes you happy.

 

[Shannow]

No, you missed my point entirely...intentionally, it's what you dealers do.

It's the shoddy math and falacious argument that you need to do 3,000 mile changes, OR you need Amsoil.

If you have a failure under warranty, and are following Amsoil's suggestions, you OWN 100% of the issue until you can convince somebody to take your monkey.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: jk_636
What are you talking about? What mediocre specs are you referring to? What kind of low temp performance are you referring to? More facts are needed if you are going to bash a superior grade oil like that!


Their PDS that shows the cold temp performance for their products, a number of which were not great. This was a heavily discussed topic recently.


And I believe the "superior" part is what was most contested. I see nothing to indicate that they are superior, just another boutique oil with pricing to match...

 

[brandini]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
No, you missed my point entirely...intentionally, it's what you dealers do.

It's the shoddy math and falacious argument that you need to do 3,000 mile changes, OR you need Amsoil.

If you have a failure under warranty, and are following Amsoil's suggestions, you OWN 100% of the issue until you can convince somebody to take your monkey.

I haven't said anything about 3,000 mile changes, so how could my math be bad when I haven't given any. I don't do math with assumptions, that's just poor math.

That's not how a warranty works, I don't own the issue, the dealer does, then Amsoil, then me. I happen to follow instructions so that we'll never get to step 3.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: brandini
I haven't said anything about 3,000 mile changes, so how could my math be bad when I haven't given any. I don't do math with assumptions, that's just poor math.


In this thread, you harp about the whole cost of ownership, using to oil for 2-3 times longer, and your (dealer) "homepage" on your profile goes straight back to Amsoil.com, which DOES do the fallacious arguments and math of which I'm talking.

My bad, but again, you're using the dealer distraction technique...I didn't say that...no Amsoil, the product that you are a dealer for does.

Do you agree with their math ?

Yes/No will suffice.

Originally Posted By: brandini
That's not how a warranty works, I don't own the issue, the dealer does, then Amsoil, then me. I happen to follow instructions so that we'll never get to step 3.


No, as soon as you show them that you haven't followed the maintenance manual for the vehicle, the problem is yours until you can convince one or the other to take your monkey...regardless of Amsoil's skewed logic train on the process.

 

[Clevy]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
Originally Posted By: dave1251
Originally Posted By: jk_636
There is no reason to spend extra coin on Amsoil when you can get a 5 quart jug of Royal Purple for $37 at Walmart. You would be hard pressed to find a better oil at a better everyday value.

If Amsoil ever changes their ridiculous sales strategy and bring their oils to the mainstream market I would try them. Im surprised that their gimmicky sales strategy hasn't put them out of business yet. Most products cant survive over time relying on pyramid scheme sales strategies and mail order alone. JMHO


ST Syn at half the cost is a better value for a group III based PCMO.


RP is a group IV motor oil. How is super tech any better?



If it were a 100% PAO product then in service it would suck. So you are wrong.

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
There is no reason to spend extra coin on Amsoil when you can get a 5 quart jug of Royal Purple for $37 at Walmart. You would be hard pressed to find a better oil at a better everyday value.


I am starting to wonder if you are Merk with a different username.

 

[brandini]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: brandini
I haven't said anything about 3,000 mile changes, so how could my math be bad when I haven't given any. I don't do math with assumptions, that's just poor math.


In this thread, you harp about the whole cost of ownership, using to oil for 2-3 times longer, and your (dealer) "homepage" on your profile goes straight back to Amsoil.com, which DOES do the fallacious arguments and math of which I'm talking.

My bad, but again, you're using the dealer distraction technique...I didn't say that...no Amsoil, the product that you are a dealer for does.

Do you agree with their math ?

Yes/No will suffice.

No, I don't, hence why I don't say that I do. But you have to start somewhere, and we all used to be on 3,000 mile oil intervals. When I do math for a customer I ask them what they do now (not made up numbers), and compare that to Amsoil. If Amsoil has made the choice to go with the 25,000 mile tagline, that's on them, but the asterisk had better be pretty huge (and it usually is).

Quote:
Originally Posted By: brandini
That's not how a warranty works, I don't own the issue, the dealer does, then Amsoil, then me. I happen to follow instructions so that we'll never get to step 3.


No, as soon as you show them that you haven't followed the maintenance manual for the vehicle, the problem is yours until you can convince one or the other to take your monkey...regardless of Amsoil's skewed logic train on the process.

It's not on the customer to convince them, the dealer must attribute the failure to use of Amsoil for them to deny warranty coverage. If that were to happen and be true, Amsoil pays. Amsoil puts their warranty in writing for anyone to read. It's pretty simple. Amsoil will send you an oil analysis kit as part of the warranty claim. You think if the oil tests fine that the dealer's claim will hold water? The same federal law is what lets you use any brand oil in your car and not void a warranty unless the specs are not met.

I use their product because it works very well and saves me time and labor, and for me it makes financial sense. It's also been the solution for a few friends with ticking lifters and various other issues solved by one of their products. It's not rocket surgery, it's the combination of quality, cost, and the convenience of getting it all in one place that makes sense to me, if it doesn't for you, it doesn't for you. I'm not going to play games and whitewash the word in Amsoil is always the best, that's just silly. Why do you think Pablo has been around so long? He manages expectations and the product lives up to them. If you don't like it, that's perfectly ok.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
RP is a group IV motor oil. How is super tech any better?

No it is not PAO does not have such poor cold weather performance and such poor NOACK in virgin form. So either RP API is not a group IV based product or the formulators at Calumet are a bunch of nitwits.

I believe the former is more accurate.

 

[GemStater]

I used to be an avid Amsoil user but its fallen out of favor with me in recent years.

Here's why:

Around 2010, the EaO oil filter was redesigned. It went from 98.7% @ 15 microns to 98.7% @ 20 microns. During this time I discovered the EaO went from WIX/Donaldson construction to Champion Labs construction. Others made the same observation ->http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551795

When I asked Amsoil why an EaO costs $14.30 plus shipping and tax when the identical filter can be purchased from Amazon for $11.31 Prime? They flat out told me it's the dealer structure that inflates cost. Not making it up. Still have the e-mail. At that point I stopped buying EaO oil filters.

Then there is the Amsoil EaA Air Filters. I used to use those in the one vehicle they had an application for, but now they are discontinued.

The motor oil, after trying all three product lines in my applications, OE/XL/SS, I don't find it particularity the best bang for the buck. The SS did fine in my Van but I only drive about 5k miles per year, so I don't feel I can fully take advantage of the added cost. Then the OE and XL products don't really have anything to offer over what a name brand full synthetic can offer. In recent years the competition has really firmed up, this particularity with SOPUS GTL motor oils IMO.

For example, say the average consumer wants to buy only five quarts to do an oil change, typical. The price per quart including sales tax, shipping, PC fee versus the SOPUS full synthetic they can buy from the big box store:

Product---------------------------------------PP-------SS--------XL------------OE----------QSUD

Noack Volatility (ASTM D5800)----------------- 9.10------7.6------10.5----------10.9-----------8.8

CCS Viscosity (ASTM D5293)-------------------4080------3398-----5524----------4945---------4184

Total Base Number (ASTM D2896)---------------9.02------12.8-----9.0------------8.1----------8.5

Viscosity Index (ASTM D2270)-----------------171-------171------160------------166----------172

API SN---------------------------------------Yes--------Yes------Yes------------Yes---------Yes

ILSAC GF-5-----------------------------------Yes--------Yes------Yes------------Yes---------Yes

ACEA A1/B1-----------------------------------Yes--------Yes------Yes-------------No---------No

ACEA A5/B5-----------------------------------Yes--------Yes-------No-------------No---------No

GM dexos1------------------------------------Yes--------Yes-------Yes------------Yes--------Yes

Acura/Honda HTO-06---------------------------Yes--------No---------No------------No---------Yes

Price Per Qt. incl. Cost/Tax/Shipping--------------$5.42-----12.27----$10.06--------$8.39---------4.73

Not bashing Amsoil, I still use some of their products. IMHO, as far as I can tell, their gear lubes, trans fluids, power-sports and outboard products are a good value. For the average over-the-road motorist, the motor oil and oil filters are dated.