On a car so new I'd bring it back to the dealer and demand a warranty fix.
The valve guides were improperly installed at the factory.
The valve guides were improperly installed at the factory.
Wonderful. Blue smoke on cold start.
- Thread starter thunderfog
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My FX45 has done that since new. People on the FX45 and M45 forums attribute it to low tension rings. I have found it is noticeably worse if I am running a bottle of Techron through it - no idea why.
It is much worse if I start it cold, move it and then restart it later.
I find it kind of embarrassing, but I live with it. At least now I can blame it on high miles.
It is much worse if I start it cold, move it and then restart it later.
I find it kind of embarrassing, but I live with it. At least now I can blame it on high miles.
Originally Posted By: CBR.worm
My FX45 has done that since new. People on the FX45 and M45 forums attribute it to low tension rings. I have found it is noticeably worse if I am running a bottle of Techron through it - no idea why.
It is much worse if I start it cold, move it and then restart it later.
I find it kind of embarrassing, but I live with it. At least now I can blame it on high miles.
If it was the rings, wouldn't it be constant as opposed to just at start up?
My FX45 has done that since new. People on the FX45 and M45 forums attribute it to low tension rings. I have found it is noticeably worse if I am running a bottle of Techron through it - no idea why.
It is much worse if I start it cold, move it and then restart it later.
I find it kind of embarrassing, but I live with it. At least now I can blame it on high miles.
If it was the rings, wouldn't it be constant as opposed to just at start up?
Originally Posted By: thunderfog
If it was the rings, wouldn't it be constant as opposed to just at start up?
Is your parking space perfectly level, or does it allow your car to tilt to the left or right?
If the oil control ring gaps end up at he bottom of the cylinder more oil can pass into the combustion chamber. If all the ring gaps end up at the bottom you can have a real mosquito fogger if tilted a bit. That's the nature of a boxer engine. If it only smokes when tilted or is intermittent, that can be "normal". If it starts smoking every start, you have a problem.
Ed
If it was the rings, wouldn't it be constant as opposed to just at start up?
Is your parking space perfectly level, or does it allow your car to tilt to the left or right?
If the oil control ring gaps end up at he bottom of the cylinder more oil can pass into the combustion chamber. If all the ring gaps end up at the bottom you can have a real mosquito fogger if tilted a bit. That's the nature of a boxer engine. If it only smokes when tilted or is intermittent, that can be "normal". If it starts smoking every start, you have a problem.
Ed
Originally Posted By: edhackett
Originally Posted By: thunderfog
If it was the rings, wouldn't it be constant as opposed to just at start up?
Is your parking space perfectly level, or does it allow your car to tilt to the left or right?
If the oil control ring gaps end up at he bottom of the cylinder more oil can pass into the combustion chamber. If all the ring gaps end up at the bottom you can have a real mosquito fogger if tilted a bit. That's the nature of a boxer engine. If it only smokes when tilted or is intermittent, that can be "normal". If it starts smoking every start, you have a problem.
Ed
Hi Ed. Thanks for the response. The spot is pretty much perfectly flat according to the eyeball test. I'm in the process of checking the consistency with every cold start.
Originally Posted By: thunderfog
If it was the rings, wouldn't it be constant as opposed to just at start up?
Is your parking space perfectly level, or does it allow your car to tilt to the left or right?
If the oil control ring gaps end up at he bottom of the cylinder more oil can pass into the combustion chamber. If all the ring gaps end up at the bottom you can have a real mosquito fogger if tilted a bit. That's the nature of a boxer engine. If it only smokes when tilted or is intermittent, that can be "normal". If it starts smoking every start, you have a problem.
Ed
Hi Ed. Thanks for the response. The spot is pretty much perfectly flat according to the eyeball test. I'm in the process of checking the consistency with every cold start.
Mine done a puff a bunch of times, and now isn't doing anymore ... Did more after a flush and refill. Is yours at full level?
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Originally Posted By: Pontual
Mine done a puff a bunch of times, and now isn't doing anymore ... Did more after a flush and refill. Is yours at full level?
I have about 800 miles on the current oil. Level is right at the full mark. I do my own oil changes.
Mine done a puff a bunch of times, and now isn't doing anymore ... Did more after a flush and refill. Is yours at full level?
I have about 800 miles on the current oil. Level is right at the full mark. I do my own oil changes.
This is a 2014 car, I do not understend why some would say "don't worry it's normal"?
Personally I do not think it's normal on such a new car and I would start keeping a log book of the events. I would mark the date, outside temperature and mileage on each occurrence.
BTW, OP what was the oputside temperature?
This is a classic oil burning scenario (don't we have few threads about this in the oil section?) and will only get worse, not better. Certain oils may mask it, but will not fix the issue. The best course of action is to track the oil usage, and get it covered under warranty. I would also check out Subie forums to see how the oil burning issue progresses with miles. If it tapers off eventually and stays relatively low, then I would say "it's normal", but until then I would treat it as abnormal.
Personally I do not think it's normal on such a new car and I would start keeping a log book of the events. I would mark the date, outside temperature and mileage on each occurrence.
BTW, OP what was the oputside temperature?
This is a classic oil burning scenario (don't we have few threads about this in the oil section?) and will only get worse, not better. Certain oils may mask it, but will not fix the issue. The best course of action is to track the oil usage, and get it covered under warranty. I would also check out Subie forums to see how the oil burning issue progresses with miles. If it tapers off eventually and stays relatively low, then I would say "it's normal", but until then I would treat it as abnormal.
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
This is a 2014 car, I do not understend why some would say "don't worry it's normal"?
Personally I do not think it's normal on such a new car and I would start keeping a log book of the events. I would mark the date, outside temperature and mileage on each occurrence.
BTW, OP what was the oputside temperature?
This is a classic oil burning scenario (don't we have few threads about this in the oil section?) and will only get worse, not better. Certain oils may mask it, but will not fix the issue. The best course of action is to track the oil usage, and get it covered under warranty. I would also check out Subie forums to see how the oil burning issue progresses with miles. If it tapers off eventually and stays relatively low, then I would say "it's normal", but until then I would treat it as abnormal.
nasioc.com doesn't have much on this particular issue for the '12+ Imprezas, only the general use of oil that has seen to be excessive in many cases.
Temperatures outside have been below 40F and as low as 25F. Since I noticed this Friday, it's 5/5 on cold starts seeing the blue puff, including this morning.
I'm going to try to get a video of it. I tried last night, but it was dark and I couldn't get enough light to get a good representation. I know it did it however, because you could clearly smell it. I've had a car in the past that burned oil, so I'm very familiar with it.
Once I get good video, and am sure that it is not an intermittent issue (avoiding the dealer's "we couldn't recreate the issue" response) I will take it in. I have the extended to 100k miles, so no hurry is necessary.
This is a 2014 car, I do not understend why some would say "don't worry it's normal"?
Personally I do not think it's normal on such a new car and I would start keeping a log book of the events. I would mark the date, outside temperature and mileage on each occurrence.
BTW, OP what was the oputside temperature?
This is a classic oil burning scenario (don't we have few threads about this in the oil section?) and will only get worse, not better. Certain oils may mask it, but will not fix the issue. The best course of action is to track the oil usage, and get it covered under warranty. I would also check out Subie forums to see how the oil burning issue progresses with miles. If it tapers off eventually and stays relatively low, then I would say "it's normal", but until then I would treat it as abnormal.
nasioc.com doesn't have much on this particular issue for the '12+ Imprezas, only the general use of oil that has seen to be excessive in many cases.
Temperatures outside have been below 40F and as low as 25F. Since I noticed this Friday, it's 5/5 on cold starts seeing the blue puff, including this morning.
I'm going to try to get a video of it. I tried last night, but it was dark and I couldn't get enough light to get a good representation. I know it did it however, because you could clearly smell it. I've had a car in the past that burned oil, so I'm very familiar with it.
Once I get good video, and am sure that it is not an intermittent issue (avoiding the dealer's "we couldn't recreate the issue" response) I will take it in. I have the extended to 100k miles, so no hurry is necessary.
Go to the dealer NOW. Don't wait to have it documented.
Originally Posted By: thunderfog
Temperatures outside have been below 40F and as low as 25F. Since I noticed this Friday, it's 5/5 on cold starts seeing the blue puff, including this morning.
I wonder if the issue is present at higher temps, keep us posted.
Also, since you have quite a bit of miles on the car that's so new, I wonder how it was broken in. Were the early miles done mostly on the highway or city/town type of driving?
Temperatures outside have been below 40F and as low as 25F. Since I noticed this Friday, it's 5/5 on cold starts seeing the blue puff, including this morning.
I wonder if the issue is present at higher temps, keep us posted.
Also, since you have quite a bit of miles on the car that's so new, I wonder how it was broken in. Were the early miles done mostly on the highway or city/town type of driving?
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
Originally Posted By: thunderfog
Temperatures outside have been below 40F and as low as 25F. Since I noticed this Friday, it's 5/5 on cold starts seeing the blue puff, including this morning.
I wonder if the issue is present at higher temps, keep us posted.
Also, since you have quite a bit of miles on the car that's so new, I wonder how it was broken in. Were the early miles done mostly on the highway or city/town type of driving?
I don't notice anything after those first few seconds at start-up.
Break in: I employ the "don't baby it, but don't drive it like you stole it" method. The miles were varied for the first 1000, but mostly city. I put the engine under load to seat the rings without busting the RPMs wide open several times within this period. RPMs never really went above 4500 doing this (reline is like 6600).
Originally Posted By: thunderfog
Temperatures outside have been below 40F and as low as 25F. Since I noticed this Friday, it's 5/5 on cold starts seeing the blue puff, including this morning.
I wonder if the issue is present at higher temps, keep us posted.
Also, since you have quite a bit of miles on the car that's so new, I wonder how it was broken in. Were the early miles done mostly on the highway or city/town type of driving?
I don't notice anything after those first few seconds at start-up.
Break in: I employ the "don't baby it, but don't drive it like you stole it" method. The miles were varied for the first 1000, but mostly city. I put the engine under load to seat the rings without busting the RPMs wide open several times within this period. RPMs never really went above 4500 doing this (reline is like 6600).
Originally Posted By: CBR.worm
My FX45 has done that since new. People on the FX45 and M45 forums attribute it to low tension rings. I have found it is noticeably worse if I am running a bottle of Techron through it - no idea why.
It is much worse if I start it cold, move it and then restart it later.
I find it kind of embarrassing, but I live with it. At least now I can blame it on high miles.
Nissan did a poor job of installing/spec'ing the oil rings than. Their is no magic in oil rings at this point, manufactures know how to make them.
A modern vehicle should not burn oil on start up.
Were not talking about 10+ year old cars with spaceship mileage on them. If the OP's car was a 2000 Subaru with 200k on it than, sure the valve stem seals do tend to get a bit hard.
If I shelled out money for a new car and it blew smoke like a $3k beater I would raise holly [censored] until it was fixed or lemon law it.
My FX45 has done that since new. People on the FX45 and M45 forums attribute it to low tension rings. I have found it is noticeably worse if I am running a bottle of Techron through it - no idea why.
It is much worse if I start it cold, move it and then restart it later.
I find it kind of embarrassing, but I live with it. At least now I can blame it on high miles.
Nissan did a poor job of installing/spec'ing the oil rings than. Their is no magic in oil rings at this point, manufactures know how to make them.
A modern vehicle should not burn oil on start up.
Were not talking about 10+ year old cars with spaceship mileage on them. If the OP's car was a 2000 Subaru with 200k on it than, sure the valve stem seals do tend to get a bit hard.
If I shelled out money for a new car and it blew smoke like a $3k beater I would raise holly [censored] until it was fixed or lemon law it.
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For anyone that still may be interested/following this thread, the last 3 cold starts have been totally clean to the best I can tell. No real changes in environment either - flat surface, same temperatures for the most part, etc.
I'm confused. Anyone with more knowledge than me have any idea?
I'm confused. Anyone with more knowledge than me have any idea?
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Originally Posted By: CBR.worm
My FX45 has done that since new. People on the FX45 and M45 forums attribute it to low tension rings. I have found it is noticeably worse if I am running a bottle of Techron through it - no idea why.
It is much worse if I start it cold, move it and then restart it later.
I find it kind of embarrassing, but I live with it. At least now I can blame it on high miles.
Nissan did a poor job of installing/spec'ing the oil rings than. Their is no magic in oil rings at this point, manufactures know how to make them.
A modern vehicle should not burn oil on start up.
Were not talking about 10+ year old cars with spaceship mileage on them. If the OP's car was a 2000 Subaru with 200k on it than, sure the valve stem seals do tend to get a bit hard.
If I shelled out money for a new car and it blew smoke like a $3k beater I would raise holly [censored] until it was fixed or lemon law it.
Yeah, that is the general consensus. Nissan dropped the ball on a few issues with these vehicles, but overall there still aren't many vehicles I would prefer to drive and maintain. The only other vehicle we really liked for this application was a couple year old Porsche Cayenne S (or Turbo) - but we were concerned about long term reliability and it being too expensive to be ruined by the kids.
Originally Posted By: CBR.worm
My FX45 has done that since new. People on the FX45 and M45 forums attribute it to low tension rings. I have found it is noticeably worse if I am running a bottle of Techron through it - no idea why.
It is much worse if I start it cold, move it and then restart it later.
I find it kind of embarrassing, but I live with it. At least now I can blame it on high miles.
Nissan did a poor job of installing/spec'ing the oil rings than. Their is no magic in oil rings at this point, manufactures know how to make them.
A modern vehicle should not burn oil on start up.
Were not talking about 10+ year old cars with spaceship mileage on them. If the OP's car was a 2000 Subaru with 200k on it than, sure the valve stem seals do tend to get a bit hard.
If I shelled out money for a new car and it blew smoke like a $3k beater I would raise holly [censored] until it was fixed or lemon law it.
Yeah, that is the general consensus. Nissan dropped the ball on a few issues with these vehicles, but overall there still aren't many vehicles I would prefer to drive and maintain. The only other vehicle we really liked for this application was a couple year old Porsche Cayenne S (or Turbo) - but we were concerned about long term reliability and it being too expensive to be ruined by the kids.
Try letting the oil level a tad below full mark. I think that was what made mine stop the puff dragoning every cold startup. Would be good if you could confirm that.
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I've noticed the same blue puff on start with a friend's 09-ish Impreza 2.5. Car has ~75k miles on it. Doesn't burn any noticeable oil, so I'd consider it ignorable.
Reviving this. Unless I missed it somewhere along the way, I hadn't had the smoke at start up issue until this morning. It went on for a good 5-7 seconds. I wish I had my camera rolling for this one...it was a lot of blue smoke.
I was parked on a very slight uphill incline, it's cold out today in the 20s, and it was shut off yesterday after a 130 mile road trip.
It's still way too intermittent to take in. Does anyone have any guesses?
I was parked on a very slight uphill incline, it's cold out today in the 20s, and it was shut off yesterday after a 130 mile road trip.
It's still way too intermittent to take in. Does anyone have any guesses?
If you're not burning more than a quart in an oci, Subaru probably won't do anything about it. Good luck.
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Nissan did a poor job of installing/spec'ing the oil rings than. Their is no magic in oil rings at this point, manufactures know how to make them.
While its true that oil control rings are old tech, the EPA's regulations have forced the automakers to use low tension rings that are relatively new. The good old rings that are proven are no longer used, and the low tension, low resistance rings aren't holding up.
Nissan did a poor job of installing/spec'ing the oil rings than. Their is no magic in oil rings at this point, manufactures know how to make them.
While its true that oil control rings are old tech, the EPA's regulations have forced the automakers to use low tension rings that are relatively new. The good old rings that are proven are no longer used, and the low tension, low resistance rings aren't holding up.
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