Amsoil Recommendation for Cat C12 (pre everything)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Jan 25, 2007
Messages
8
Location
PA
Hello all. Hoping to get your opinion on which Amsoil I should switch my 2000 C12 (2KS) with 656,000 original over to. I am pretty set on Amsoil despite the high volume of oil and cost (which anymore isn't much over off the shelf synthetics anyway). Being a dealer I gotta represent, [right?] and w/ bypass filtration I am expecting to get quite an OCI out of it based on analysis.

I am thinking DEO, but my engine is completely pre-emission (no EGR or DPF) which is the opposite the oil is supposedly designed for, but then again I don't think it's doing any disservice to a pre emission engine?

Everyone is raving about HDD, but I'm not sure I'll be able to sleep at night running a non CJ-4 rated, wrong weight oil in a semi with 656,000 miles on it.

AME seems to maybe have some more shear stability? But I guess that's the trade off giving up weight range? (15w-40 vs 5w-40) This is going to be a year round oil for a home every night tractor in PA. Still mostly highway miles though. I do have and use a block heater.
 
three posts since 2007?

You're an Amsoil dealer than cannot make up his mind which lube to use in his OTR?

Tread carefully ...
 
Last edited:
Are there many people using expensive synthetics in OTR trucks? Would there really be a good return on investment over plain ol' 15w-40?
 
Your engine does not require CJ-4 oil, so not sure why it should put a crimp in your style. Only engines with emissions junk on them started requiring CJ-4. You can easily use a CI-4 or CI-4+, which the HDD is spec'd for. If I was you, and bound and determined to use Amsoil in a 30w, I would jump on the ACD 10w30 / 30w they have. It is a very stout oil that would meet your engine's specs. Doesn't use any viscosity improvers that can shear. And it is extremely cost effective compared to the HDD. But a lot can be said of the Delvac 10w30 synthetic blend. I have heard nothing but good about that oil.

Amsoil ACD $27.75 a gallon at PC pricing. HDD $33.70 a gallon at PC pricing. No brainer. ACD wins. Check out the data sheets and compare.
 
Originally Posted By: Bandito440
Are there many people using expensive synthetics in OTR trucks? Would there really be a good return on investment over plain ol' 15w-40?


I fit in the middle on my semi trucks. I use a blend from Schaeffer. Pricing as good or better than most similar products anywhere else and it gets shipped to me for free with some free oil sample kits and analysis thrown in for fun. I can't see dumping $30+ a gallon oil in my semi's. I regularly take them over 1 million miles without a major repair. Not sure a high ticket synthetic is going to deliver much better results.
 
Hi,

Originally Posted By: Bandito440
Are there many people using expensive synthetics in OTR trucks? Would there really be a good return on investment over plain ol' 15w-40?


I've posted much on this subject over the last decade.

In Australia lubricants are very expensive and my Fleet's economics were based on around 90kkms OCIs using a 5W-40 synthetic. Including downtime and labour costs it was very beneficial. It cost around $A200 for the synthetic lubricant and about half the price for a mineral 15W-40 - downtime involved and the labour costs were and still are a very significant component of each OCI. The problem with mineral lubricants was their increasing viscosity and an intolerance of soot loading during extended OCIs

Most fleets will only use the lubricants and OCIs mandated by the OEM. This has much to do with their standardised servicing routines and record keeping - and the quality of the servicing personnel!!

Many Euro OEMs have used synthetics for several decades, but again it comes back to the issues I noted above
 
As TT and Doug note, upscale products can make for a wise choice, and pay for themselves IF one manages the program correctly for both wear and ROI. These two are among the few that really understand that vehicular care isn't just about buying a lube; it's about managing an overall maintenance program.


I find it a bit odd the OP has only 3 posts since 2007, and as an Amsoil dealer he cannot decide which product to use ...
And yet I'm supposed to believe he is going to have the knowledge to manage a lube program properly? Hmmmmmmm ..........
 
Just tossing it out there...but there is also OE 15W-40.

I know it's a CJ-4 oil; but it says its fine for earlier engines.

If OCI's were maximized to their full extent, this could be a cheaper option than even ACD; and it gets you the 40-weight you want.
 
dnewton, if you don't have anything productive to say, just snark, please stay out of my thread. I regret mentioning, trying to be funny, that yes technically I am an Amsoil dealer. But in reality, I don't have a storefront, online or in person. I was a PC, then my ambitious but rubbish friend decided he wanted to be a big time dealer, and wanted to be "partners". I went along with it and it hasn't gone anywhere, but since we split the renewal it doesn't cost me any more than PC. And yes, I only have 3 posts since '07. I've found I can usually learn more from listening than speaking...

Tired Trucker thanks for clearing up the unimportantce of CJ-4 spec for my engine. I am young to this industry. In my time that spec has always been current. My first assigned truck was an '09! Are you Cowpie on thetruckersreport?

Cost is not an issue in my opinion. I always run the highest grade Amsoil in my vehicles (w/ ext OCI). I am with Doug's school of thought on this. Yes I was just at Tractor Supply yesterday and saw they had Rotella 5w-40 for $22 a gallon. With Amsoil at $30 that's $220 for an oil change instead of $300 (plus filters). But when your planning for 100k+ OCI (with bypass filtration and based on regular analysis), you burn $1,000/wk in fuel, and a rebuild costs $20k+ (not to mention the downtime), $80 is statistical noise. Yes I know there's 100 cheaper oils that will "do the job just fine", and they will probably all take this motor to 1,000,000, but I am an idealist, go big or go homer, prepare for the worst and hope for the best kind of person.

All that being said. I'm not dead set on a 30 or a 40 weight oil. My gut has me sleeping better on 40, since that's the spec, but I know there's guys pushing the envelope running 30 to increase fuel mileage. I haven't decided if that's smart or not. I would love to hear feedback on that.

My other first thought is if I'm plugging the truck in during winter, does that negate my preference of a 5w-40 over a 15w-40? Are there any key specs that are better on any of the 15w-40s?

I guess it might be worth mentioning/clear some things up: I just bought this tractor.

Thanks for the feedback.
 
Ok...So I did some more research and thinking. Please bear with me I'm definitely a student of this. Mostly Amsoil's own field study of DEO (referenced on here as well) set the direction of my thinking. Thinking about viscosity loss over time and extending drains, I decided to stick with a 40 weight. That way if/when I drop into a 30 weight range, I won't lose sleep over it and enjoy the marginal fuel economy advantage. I would not sleep well watching the viscosity of my 30 weight oil drop. I think going 40 weight could potentially help extend my drains longer.

Also looking at TBN, I like that AME starts highest, though I know that doesn't necessarily translate to maintaining the best over time. Considering also that I plug the truck in during winter, and that AME is still Amsoil's most popular diesel oil according to a dealer's website, I started leaning toward AME for my pre emission motor.

I did manage to dig up an old Amsoil field study of AME on the same fleet as the DEO study. The AME held TBN and viscosity higher over more than twice the number of hours, though I would say definitely an apples and oranges comparison despite being the same fleet. I think the fleet's percentage and degree of emission controls on the engines was the most significant factor in the time between studies and throws things way off.

I finally got a chance to print off Amsoil's spec sheets for all their 40 weight diesel oils and take them to bed with me last night. (I have a newborn, wife, and mother-in-law at home 24/7 at the moment.) Not much stands out except the 4 ball wear test. The performance of AME on that test impressed me.

With all this in mind, am I on the right track thinking AME?
 
And now the curve ball...My dad (JD dealer parts manager) is always going on about Plus 50. He's really been preaching it since he got back from parts expo in December. Though the message now is all about the 0W-40. The virgin analysis is pretty impressive. Is it possible to have too much of a good thing with regard to the add pack? I can get them both for roughly the same price.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=474722
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1209064
 
The 0W40 that is analyzed in that link is the older CH4 version. The newer CJ4 version has only 1.0% ash and a corresponding lower detergent level and TBN.

Charlie
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top