Pentastar V6?

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I'm negotiating on some work trucks and the best deals are on the V6 ones. How is the Pentastar? Seems to get good reviews. I was going to get the Hemi but I'm changing gears and buying a less expensive truck for work, and getting a car instead as a toy.

I drove one with the 8spd and while not a Hemi it pulls well enough. A few google search's just turns up threads in truck forums with guys saying you need a Hemi with 3.92's out back in every single truck.

No one that owns one seems to complain much, so I guess that means they are pretty decent?
 
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My dad has loved the 3.6 in his 300.

Some NVH quirks, and early ones had head problems, plus mines got a light tick that Chrysler can't explain

But top spec, really powerful, pulls really well, and a possible 31 MPG.
 
I'd get it now before they go DI with it,
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which might happen to some of the line up as soon as the 2016 models roll off the line.

The currently configured engine is good and all the bugs have been worked out. Early on they had problems with the left cylinder head, that's history now. Adding DI might start the debugging process all over again.
 
I imagine its not the engine to get if you are towing something significant a lot. But I was impressed with it with the 5spd in a grand Cherokee and I imagine the extra ratios will cope with the extra weight of a truck.
 
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I'd get it now before they go DI with it,
27.gif
which might happen to some of the line up as soon as the 2016 models roll off the line.

The currently configured engine is good and all the bugs have been worked out. Early on they had problems with the left cylinder head, that's history now. Adding DI might start the debugging process all over again.


Yes, DI is coming on the Pentastar.
 
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I'd get it now before they go DI with it,
27.gif
which might happen to some of the line up as soon as the 2016 models roll off the line.

The currently configured engine is good and all the bugs have been worked out. Early on they had problems with the left cylinder head, that's history now. Adding DI might start the debugging process all over again.


Yes, DI is coming on the Pentastar.


It looks like the Wrangler might dodge it for 2016, and the GC will be the first to get it, along with the Mini Vans. I'm not sure about the Ram PU. There's lots of interesting but conflicting reports.
 
Nothing wrong with any v6 work trucks if your not towing real heavy stuff constantly....decent mileage and typically lots cheaper to buy....dont be scared of them...been there done that..
 
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I'd get it now before they go DI with it,
27.gif
....


No reason to hide IMO. DI is great for performance, but weak long term with the buildup issues. If they can solve that then we're talking.
 
Ive had a lot of minivans as rentals recently. Im also looking to buy one.
Ive mainly driven chrysler T&C vans, and Ill say that the pentastar in that does just fine accelerating and hauling six people plus luggage (figure 1300 lbs total) around.

So the question becomes what is the gearing difference and total mass difference of the pentastar in the T&C vs the ram?

Ill say that the sienna V6 is more isolated and a bit smoother at idle than the pentastar in a minivan. But Id have no hesitancy driving a T&C fully loaded with that engine, FWIW.

Looks like a Ram Tradesman V6 has a payload of around 1949 lb and a curb weight of around 4800 lb.

A T&C claims max payload of 1400 lb and weighs around 4700 lb.

So the T&C will be lighter, FWIW, but again, at those sorts of masses, loaded up, I was very pleased with the T&C.

So the real question is what sort of payloads and trailer weights are you expecting, and when youre hauling, is "performance" really a necessity?
 
Originally Posted By: Kuato
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I'd get it now before they go DI with it,
27.gif
....


No reason to hide IMO. DI is great for performance, but weak long term with the buildup issues. If they can solve that then we're talking.


Exactly. The problem is it will be first year for the Pentastar. I'm all for letting others do the product testing. That's why I hid, I figured I'd take some heat......
wink.gif



I've been reading a lot on the PUG update, it looks like only part of the line up will get the upgraded engine. Although I'm still not sure.
21.gif
 
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I love how people say you can't tow with a six cylinder. That's absurd. I towed with old trucks with weak inline sixes that barely had a third the horsepower the Pentastar does. As long as you're not over-stressing the transmission, towing and hauling is not a problem. If you're not convinced you need a V-8 for "cred", I wouldn't worry about it at all.
 
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: Kuato
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I'd get it now before they go DI with it,
27.gif
....


No reason to hide IMO. DI is great for performance, but weak long term with the buildup issues. If they can solve that then we're talking.


Exactly. The problem is it will be first year for the Pentastar. I'm all for letting others do the product testing. That's why I hid, I figured I'd take some heat......
wink.gif



I've been reading a lot on the PUG update, it looks like only part of the line up will get the upgraded engine. Although I'm still not sure.
21.gif



When I was working with Chrysler as a valvetrain component rep, I had a lot of contact with the Pentastar Upgrade program. Chrysler was not shy about calling themselves "Fast Followers" as far as engine technology is concerned. They are a much smaller company than GM and Ford, and don't have the resources to develop leading-edge technology from the ground up. So they have hung back from DI, waiting to see what works and what doesn't. Maybe they have learned from other OEM's mistakes, and can avoid most of them.
 
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Originally Posted By: JHZR2


So the question becomes what is the gearing difference and total mass difference of the pentastar in the T&C vs the ram?



Not sure if a valid comparison. The transmission(6speed vs 8 speed), driveline layout(FWD vs RWD), engine tuning V6(eg 283hp vs 305hp) are really different.

Having ridden in RAM v6 and driven T&C I did not recognize much in common.
 
I would only consider the Silverado/Sierra in a V6. Larger displacement and similar torque and hp at 1000 less rpm. We (business) only buy V6 GM full size work trucks, we keep them until over 200k.
 
Originally Posted By: mikefxu
I would only consider the Silverado/Sierra in a V6. Larger displacement and similar torque and hp at 1000 less rpm. We (business) only buy V6 GM full size work trucks, we keep them until over 200k.


be sure to clean the DI engine valves every 30k, they look absolutely horrible.

and OP, get the Hemi. The pentastars are interesting and okay, but the Hemi is well proven as a workhorse.
 
Originally Posted By: rjundi
Originally Posted By: JHZR2


So the question becomes what is the gearing difference and total mass difference of the pentastar in the T&C vs the ram?



Not sure if a valid comparison. The transmission(6speed vs 8 speed), driveline layout(FWD vs RWD), engine tuning V6(eg 283hp vs 305hp) are really different.

Having ridden in RAM v6 and driven T&C I did not recognize much in common.


Sure, the platforms are different. But what it comes down to is power/torque (are the ratings on the same engine particularly different), overall gearing (probably only 1st gear and final drive, the other added gears are just to maintain a power band for FE purposes).

Both versions make about the same torque, with the ram at lower RPM, which is good for hauling.

T&C: 283 hp @ 6,400 260 lb-ft @ 4,800
1500: 305 hp @ 6,400 269 lb-ft @ 4,175

So long story short, the ram makes more power, and torque lower down, in a platform that has roughly the same curb weight, and higher max payload (which for that to be relevant assumes that the payload allotment is actually being used and some appreciably fast acceleration is necessary).

The entire point is that if the T&C was more than suitable to move a similar mass with a non-trivial amount of payload, it should be just fine for the Ram, especially given the better ratings on the engine. The ram platform will obviosuly be better for hauling stuff.

As another anecdotal data point to emphasize the utility of the V6 work truck, FWIW, we routinely haul 4x55 gal oil drums (~2000 lb) in absolutely severe service terrain in the USVI with a 4.2L ford V6 without any complaints and >>100k miles. This is conditions where Honda ATs last only ~30k miles and even Toyotas are only good for around 100k. So I wouldnt underestimate the capability of a V6 truck, especially given the modern engines' power ratings which are as good as V8s were a few years ago.
 
I think the only question is if running some higher rpms is annoying to the buyer? 300hp is 300hp in any engine, but if you are someone that doesn't like to see/hear some revs then you'll have to spring for a big V8.
On a V6 truck test drive, it would be good to drive around for a bit in a gear holding 3-4k rpm just to hear what its like, because if you are towing something up a decent grade, you'll probably be at those rpms for a while.
I found the pentastar quite nice sounding all the way through the rev range but that was in a G. Cherokee.
 
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: Kuato
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I'd get it now before they go DI with it,
27.gif
....


No reason to hide IMO. DI is great for performance, but weak long term with the buildup issues. If they can solve that then we're talking.


Exactly. The problem is it will be first year for the Pentastar. I'm all for letting others do the product testing. That's why I hid, I figured I'd take some heat......
wink.gif



I've been reading a lot on the PUG update, it looks like only part of the line up will get the upgraded engine. Although I'm still not sure.
21.gif



When I was working with Chrysler as a valvetrain component rep, I had a lot of contact with the Pentastar Upgrade program. Chrysler was not shy about calling themselves "Fast Followers" as far as engine technology is concerned. They are a much smaller company than GM and Ford, and don't have the resources to develop leading-edge technology from the ground up. So they have hung back from DI, waiting to see what works and what doesn't. Maybe they have learned from other OEM's mistakes, and can avoid most of them.


That makes a lot of sense. I thought they held out for a good reason, maybe they did nail it. Still I'm afraid of the first year of anything new to a mfg.
 
PEAK torque readings are for advertising. The whole reason they are moving the camshafts around is to develop more torque at lower rpms while still giving you that high rpm charge to the redline.

The lil Pstar is a great engine. Let's hope DI doesn't ruin it...
 
Well I'll see if the dealer will deal on the V6 one, if not I might just order one. I don't tow ever so I don't even care if it has a hitch. My current truck doesn't have one.

Finding a regular cab reasonable optioned truck is challenging. I won't buy a new Chevy their is no storage behind the rear seats anymore.

I do just fine with my 190hp 4.3 V6 so 300 is plenty of power for my needs.
 
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