winter driving fun.

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Yesterday central Pennsylvania had a major ice storm. Just after I passed the top of a mountain and headed down a narrow two lane downhill stretch, I heard the familiar thump thump of a flat tire (2005 honda civic). A 1/4 mile later, there was finally a safe place to pull off the road.Sure enough, the right rear tire was flat. Also, naturally I had forgot to wear my gloves that day. When I pulled out the doughnut and the jack, the tool used to raise the jack was missing. Rifling through the car I did find a pair of pliers that the handle of which would fit in the jack, but at this point I was pretty flustered and freezing. I got the lug nuts off, put on the doughnut in the freezing downpour, then could only find three of the four nuts. Eventually, I found the fourth nut on the floor of the car and completed the installation. I then had to drive another 35 miles on the doughnut through the ice to the closest garage, a Pep Boys (my LEAST favorite place). I asked them to try to plug the tire as I didn't relish driving around on three winter tires and an all-season (would be 5 day wait for a winter tire, and it wouldn't match the others on the car).

While going through all of this I discovered my cell phone was missing. Searched high and low, couldn't find it, and I knew I had it in the car after changing the flat. The Pep Boys guy showed me the metal shard about an inch long going through the tread right on the should er of the tire. Can't plug it safely. So I opted for their cheapest all-season tire (they only had two to pick from in my 14 inch size). Meanwhile I searched everywhere for my phone and prayed to find it (I don't think I've ever prayed so much in such a short time as yesterday evening.) Finally I found it buried in the snow and ice in the parking lot, amazingly it still worked and still is after drying out. So now I've got three snow tires and a cheap all season generic tire on the right rear of my car with another 8 inches of snow coming today.

Surprisingly driving on the doughnut and then the all season tire in the ice and snow wasn't as tricky as I expected, just had to be very careful breaking and turning. Today is literally supposed to be the end of the bad weather for the season (yeah,right), so I will leave the all season on for this storm (no choice anyway). I only drive the car in the winter, next winter I'll replace with four new winter tires. In all, a harrowing experience made worse by lack of staying calm and lack of preparedness.

Lessons learned: Always have proper clothes for a disaster requiring you to be in the elements for an extended period of time. Make sure your jack and associated tools are all present and in working order. STAY CALM, drive carefully and say your prayers. All in all, the Pep Boys guys treated me well and although the tire is a cheapie as most of theirs are they got me back on the road quickly and at a good price.
 
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Harbor freight gives away cheap gloves now and again. Dollar tree has them for a buck, too. Great for the trunk.

Even a pair of nitrile gloves are great to have to keep grease off, for all we know one could get a flat on the way to a job interview, wedding, etc. They keep you dry in the cold, better than nothing.

Good news in all this is your donut had air.
 
I think you might have been missled. Instead of a plug, a patch could have been used, or a a patch and a tube. Plugs are not emloyed in the sidewall area of a radial because of the flexing, but patches and tubs can handle it.
 
Originally Posted By: dlayman

Lessons learned: Always have proper clothes for a disaster requiring you to be in the elements for an extended period of time. Make sure your jack and associated tools are all present and in working order. STAY CALM, drive carefully and say your prayers.


Those are some good lessons!

My kids are used to "dress for the weather" even when they're getting in the car. They've grown up in Vermont, waited for the bus in below zero weather (their mother's choice, not mine), and know what it's like to be stuck outside...they get it...but not many folks have had to live through a breakdown like yours.

In the back of my 4 Runner are a first aid kit, CB Radio, inverter, tools, a come-along, tow strap, some MREs, a couple of water bottles, a spare QT or two of oil, boots, hat, gloves, an extra ski jacket and a couple of blankets.

All from my days as a kid growing up in Winnipeg, and living in Colorado, and Vermont, where it might be 20 miles to the next house, and even now, there was no cell coverage. A few hours in below zero weather in those circumstances could put you in jeopardy...

Folks take a lot of things for granted.

I'm glad that you no longer do!
 
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Originally Posted By: HerrStig
I think you might have been missled. Instead of a plug, a patch could have been used, or a a patch and a tube. Plugs are not emloyed in the sidewall area of a radial because of the flexing, but patches and tubs can handle it.


I've damaged sidewalls before (4 Wheeling and on the road) and never, ever, has a shop been willing to repair sidewall damage. Patch, plug, miracle goo, doesn't matter - the sidewall flexes too much to be repaired.
 
I think a significant part of the problem was the 1/4 mile I had to drive on it once it was flat. Likely, it was also nearly flat for some time before I noticed it. The sidewall had visible damage that could be seen on the inside of the tire. There were actually small bits of rubber inside that were collected in the inside of the tire, not sure if that was from sidewall or what.
 
Originally Posted By: dlayman
I think a significant part of the problem was the 1/4 mile I had to drive on it once it was flat. Likely, it was also nearly flat for some time before I noticed it. The sidewall had visible damage that could be seen on the inside of the tire. There were actually small bits of rubber inside that were collected in the inside of the tire, not sure if that was from sidewall or what.

The tire was done then, even if it was just a nail in a patchable area. Oh well, at least 14" tires are cheap. Watch the snow tire sales now and you might get a set for $160-200.
 
Yesterday on the way home from work in a bit of an ice storm I got passed by someone with 3 all seasons and a donut spare in the front. It was ... entertaining watching the car try to get moving in the snow.
 
From my USAF flying days I recall the words "You must dress to egress." If one must bail out of a nice, comfortable cockpit at 30,000 feet you don't want to be without jacket, gloves, etc for the ride down when it's -30 F, and then you need to survive on the ground until someone finds you. It's a similar concept when you're driving a car; it's a good idea to bring some minimal survival gear in case you have trouble.
 
After I had a flat a couple years ago, I make sure to have some paper towels, nitrile gloves and a big garbage bag (to hold the old tire) in a gallon sized ziploc bag in the spare tire well. I also went ahead and bought a couple extra 19mm sockets and cheap HF breaker bars to keep in the car.

I got another flat just a few weeks ago and was happy to have that stuff with me. (Why is it that I've only gotten flats on cold, snowy days?)

By far, the worst part of changing a tire is using the scissor jacks with the hook end of the bar, I've considered adding a bottle jack to the car's kit.

Good job having an aired up spare!
 
Originally Posted By: EdwardC
After I had a flat a couple years ago, I make sure to have some paper towels, nitrile gloves and a big garbage bag (to hold the old tire) in a gallon sized ziploc bag in the spare tire well. I also went ahead and bought a couple extra 19mm sockets and cheap HF breaker bars to keep in the car.

I got another flat just a few weeks ago and was happy to have that stuff with me. (Why is it that I've only gotten flats on cold, snowy days?)

By far, the worst part of changing a tire is using the scissor jacks with the hook end of the bar, I've considered adding a bottle jack to the car's kit.

Good job having an aired up spare!


I've been really lucky, in that each time I had a damaged tire it was caught before I was stuck with a flat on the side of the road. I have been surprised with some hard hits and popping noises that ended up being nothing, but my first thought is, "oh, no, I really hope I don't get a flat now!" Why? Well, because, like the OP, those events usually happen when I don't have my tool bag with me.

On our trip to FL this past holiday, I did have a full toolbag, including bottle jack and better handtools, and I did make sure the spare was fully inflated (which I usually do yearly,) but day-to-day, I admit that I don't have these things with me, and having a flat would be that much more of a pain!

Gloves and a bag don't way much and can be stashed almost anywhere, so after reading this I think I'll stash some in each car.
 
dlayman,
I have a pair of 14" Winterforce snows used 2 seasons mounted on Honda steelies. They are from my 2012(?) Honda Fit I got them as a minus 2 fitment from the tirerack. If you lived nearby I give 'em to ya for 20 bucks.

I dont know if they will fit your application.

-Ken
 
Originally Posted By: HerrStig
I think you might have been missled. Instead of a plug, a patch could have been used, or a a patch and a tube. Plugs are not emloyed in the sidewall area of a radial because of the flexing, but patches and tubs can handle it.


You have been misled.
 
Originally Posted By: dlayman
.....The sidewall had visible damage that could be seen on the inside of the tire. There were actually small bits of rubber inside that were collected in the inside of the tire, not sure if that was from sidewall or what.


Those bits of rubber were from the innerliner (the air retaining rubber), from the tire rubbing on itself.

Yeah, and it doesn't take very long to get that. I heard of situations where the tire popped, and they pulled over immediately and there was that kind of damage - maybe a couple hundred feet?
 
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Originally Posted By: Papa Bear
I have a AAA card (CAA here in Canada) in my wallet and a over half full tank of gas.


AAA was a 3 hour wait due to all the people in the ditch, and they couldn't even guarantee that. Their service gets worse and worse.
 
Originally Posted By: zzyzzx
And the reason you were driving on ice was???


to get home from work. We've had terrible driving conditions nearly every day since he first of the year. If I didn't go to / from work on each bad day, I'd be out of vacation for the year already. With the four good winter tires, I can conquer most anything. Surprisingly, even with the rear donut, I didn't have much trouble. All in all, at this point I view it as a positive learning experience, and the next time it happens I'll be better prepared
 
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
Originally Posted By: dlayman
.....The sidewall had visible damage that could be seen on the inside of the tire. There were actually small bits of rubber inside that were collected in the inside of the tire, not sure if that was from sidewall or what.


Those bits of rubber were from the innerliner (the air retaining rubber), from the tire rubbing on itself.

Yeah, and it doesn't take very long to get that. I heard of situations where the tire popped, and they pulled over immediately and there was that kind of damage - maybe a couple hundred feet?


Thanks for that info. I wasn't sure what it was, but there was a good bit of it. Yeah, I didn't drive very far on it, but when it happened I was in between two mountainsides with almost no berm, and had to get to a safe area to get off the road, wasn't much more than the distance you mentioned. Where I work, we get a lot of metal shards in the parking lot (nice); almost everyone here has had a flat tire or more than one in the last couple years. I check mine before I drive off, and it looked OK when I left, but obviously wasn't
 
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