'Net Neutrality'

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Originally Posted By: hatt
Originally Posted By: Nick R
Originally Posted By: hatt
Everyone buys into these catchy names. This "net neutrality" ruing will make the net neutral about like the Affordable Care Act lowered medical care costs.


The government weren't the ones who came up with the name "net neutrality" It' a concept that has been around for years. It simply means that all traffic on the internet, all sites, are treated equally by ISPs and other carriers.
Doesn't matter how it came around. It's now being used to do whatever the 300+ page secret ruling says. Clearly they didn't need 300+ pages to say that ISPs need to be "neutral." So clearly there's going to be [censored] loads of [censored]. We'll see when the stuff is finally released. Unfortunately you guys will have invested so much time defending some utopian idea you'll never be able to admit you were totally wrong.


It's amusing how sure you are that the FCC is out to get you.
 
For some reason a whole lot of people aren't smart enough to figure out that ISP will simply slow everyone. They'd have to be totally retarded to invest billions so other companies can cash in while they're locked into some .gov [censored].
 
Originally Posted By: hatt
For some reason a whole lot of people aren't smart enough to figure out that ISP will simply slow everyone. They'd have to be totally retarded to invest billions so other companies can cash in while they're locked into some .gov [censored].


You clearly lack basic reasoning skills. ISPs will not slow everyone down. They are not anywhere close to maximum capacity for their infrastructure in all but a few areas (NYC, for example). You also seem to forget the purpose they serve. ISPs connect the internet to consumers. The internet, and the billions of dollars in commerce it serves. In other words, they indirectly exist so other companies CAN cash in. And cut the [censored], there is not a single ISP that is hurting for money. They are all operating on such a ridiculous profit margin it's ridiculous. If your ISP charged you $100/mo for internet, they pocket ~$90 of that as profit. And that is no exaggeration. I worked for an ISP, and that is the fact of the matter.
 
Originally Posted By: dishdude
Washington Post story

Pretty decent article that answers a lot of questions regarding the process, and when we'll see the entire rule.



SHHHHH! You can't talk about that! You can't mention anything remotely rational! God forbid anyone thinks the FCC isn't out to destroy our lives and take our children!
 
Originally Posted By: Nick R
Originally Posted By: Nate1979
I'm wondering if on my next flight I should sit in first class without paying for first class fare and just say to the stewardesses that I want "flight neutrality."



Stop being stupid. I pay TWC $65/mo for 50/5. I should not have to pay extra to get faster speeds for specific sites. A $8 "streaming video" package, to take advantage of the 50mbps I already pay for.

Your argument is [censored] stupid, because it implies people should have to pay extra to take advantage of that which they are already paying for.

They sell us INTERNET. Not "we sell you the privilege of needing to pay us even more for access to pieces of the internet"



So you are ok that they can charge consumer different prices for different speeds but you are not ok that they do different speeds for different sites?

I completely disagree and hope this fails in the courts just like the last time. I should be able to buy a Lexus instead of a Toyota, fly first class instead of coach, have a mansion instead of a shack, and pay for high speed access to sites like Netflix if I want to or can afford it.

IMO as long as they set clear terms and conditions with pricing levels all can understand I should be able to pay for faster access to Netflix if I can afford it.

The world is full of inequalities. We don't live in a Utopian country. Sites whose customers are willing to pay for faster speed should be able to pay for it. Stifling innovation is just another excuse for socialism.

You pay for 50/5 today. Tomorrow they should change that to 50/5 for All sites except Netflix and for Netflix if you want a faster speed you have to pay extra (or whatever other sites they decide is a bandwidth hog).
 
Originally Posted By: Nick R
Originally Posted By: hatt
For some reason a whole lot of people aren't smart enough to figure out that ISP will simply slow everyone. They'd have to be totally retarded to invest billions so other companies can cash in while they're locked into some .gov [censored].


You clearly lack basic reasoning skills. ISPs will not slow everyone down. They are not anywhere close to maximum capacity for their infrastructure in all but a few areas (NYC, for example). You also seem to forget the purpose they serve. ISPs connect the internet to consumers. The internet, and the billions of dollars in commerce it serves. In other words, they indirectly exist so other companies CAN cash in. And cut the [censored], there is not a single ISP that is hurting for money. They are all operating on such a ridiculous profit margin it's ridiculous. If your ISP charged you $100/mo for internet, they pocket ~$90 of that as profit. And that is no exaggeration. I worked for an ISP, and that is the fact of the matter.

You don't think the phone companies were making huge profits leasing you the same phone and selling you the same service for 30 years?
 
Originally Posted By: Nick R
Originally Posted By: hatt
For some reason a whole lot of people aren't smart enough to figure out that ISP will simply slow everyone. They'd have to be totally retarded to invest billions so other companies can cash in while they're locked into some .gov [censored].


You clearly lack basic reasoning skills. ISPs will not slow everyone down. They are not anywhere close to maximum capacity for their infrastructure in all but a few areas (NYC, for example). You also seem to forget the purpose they serve. ISPs connect the internet to consumers. The internet, and the billions of dollars in commerce it serves. In other words, they indirectly exist so other companies CAN cash in. And cut the [censored], there is not a single ISP that is hurting for money. They are all operating on such a ridiculous profit margin it's ridiculous. If your ISP charged you $100/mo for internet, they pocket ~$90 of that as profit. And that is no exaggeration. I worked for an ISP, and that is the fact of the matter.



Who are you to decide which companies are making enough money or not? No public owned company is going to sit by and let their profit margins be cut when they have a fiduciary duty to their stock holders. High prices for all or slower speeds for all, reduced investment.
 
Oh need to call the next town. Long distance charges apply. Man the good old days. Government control is sweet.
 
Originally Posted By: Nate1979


Who are you to decide which companies are making enough money or not? No public owned company is going to sit by and let their profit margins be cut when they have a fiduciary duty to their stock holders. High prices for all or slower speeds for all, reduced investment.
No dude. You're so wrong. The ISPs are gonna invest billions in upgrades so they can charge the same and Netflix/etc can stream UHD for a premium. .gov FTW. ISP are mean.
 
Originally Posted By: Nick R


You clearly lack basic reasoning skills. ISPs will not slow everyone down. They are not anywhere close to maximum capacity for their infrastructure in all but a few areas (NYC, for example). You also seem to forget the purpose they serve. ISPs connect the internet to consumers. The internet, and the billions of dollars in commerce it serves. In other words, they indirectly exist so other companies CAN cash in. And cut the [censored], there is not a single ISP that is hurting for money. They are all operating on such a ridiculous profit margin it's ridiculous. If your ISP charged you $100/mo for internet, they pocket ~$90 of that as profit. And that is no exaggeration. I worked for an ISP, and that is the fact of the matter.



Well there you go. Take the risk and start your own ISP, and run it as you deem fit. It should be a piece of cake for someone with such vast experience..

Let us know when we can sign-up for your high-speed internet access, which is cheap for us, and limits how much profit you can make. Lest your profit reach "obscene" levels.
 
The FCC gets to determine what's called "internet" so you can compare competitors on speed, price, and customer service instead of all of the above plus "free favorite channels."

I'm pleased as punch that if I chose dirty coal or clean solar power, both are delivered to my DVD player in the same 120V, 60 Hz format. The internet I deliver to said media player should work the same no matter what "brand" it is. Unless they'd like to use a name other than "internet"... like bubbly wine can't be called Champagne unless it meets a specific French Government standard, that's honored by US Customs.
 
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Originally Posted By: 02SE


Well there you go. Take the risk and start your own ISP, and run it as you deem fit. It should be a piece of cake for someone with such vast experience..

Let us know when we can sign-up for your high-speed internet access, which is cheap for us, and limits how much profit you can make. Lest your profit reach "obscene" levels.

The guys are all talk. If they had say in Comcast they'd be doing the same or worst. Reminds of the idiots complaining about taxes being too low. But. They never write a check for the extra they think they should owe. Or Algore complaining about my truck from his private jet.
 
Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: hatt
Oh need to call the next town. Long distance charges apply. Man the good old days. Government control is sweet.


The FCC gets to determine what's called "internet" so you can compare competitors on speed, price, and customer service instead of all of the above plus "free favorite channels."

I'm pleased as punch that if I chose dirty coal or clean solar power, both are delivered to my DVD player in the same 120V, 60 Hz format. The internet I deliver to said media player should work the same no matter what "brand" it is. Unless they'd like to use a name other than "internet"... like bubbly wine can't be called Champagne unless it meets a specific French Government standard, that's honored by US Customs.
What did any of that have to do with my post?
 
Originally Posted By: Nick R
The internet DOES need regulation, because ISPs are starting to figure out just how much they can get away with screwing over their customers. The answer is-- as much as they want, because we are a "captive audience" we don't have a choice. If I want high speed internet, my only choice is Time Warner Cable. If I don't like how they are treating me, I can't just switch to someone else. And that means without basic regulation, ISPs are going to start even more doing things to pad their own bottom lines. Make you pay extra to get to certain sites. Make services that compete with theirs a worse experience so you are more likely to buy THEIR service. [censored] like this. It's started to happen already, and if the FCC is not allowed to pass net neutrality regulation, we might as well kiss new technology and development of the internet goodbye. Or rather, our ISP overlords will be the ones who will tell us what we are allowed to use.

  • What's your definition of "high speed internet"?
    -
  • So you have no competition in your area? There are other options if you don't like how you're being treated. After all, you now have an insiders perspective.
    -
  • You've stated government "basic regulation" as a method to prevent ISP's from "padding their own bottom lines." What about personal regulation and being pro-active?
    -
  • Being a TWC former-employee, you have the inside scoup on telling customers here how to get a better deal. So why don't you? I've posted many times how I get a better deal out of AT&T. Even posted their CRD number. If TWC is your only option, and their profits are "obscene" why not educate fellow users how to get a better deal? OR ween yourself from endless supply of #$%^! supplied from the engorged digital ^!^ (milk supply).
    -
  • BTW, look at your phone/internet bill. See all of those taxes listed? Local, state & federal. Some of us here remember when those didn't exist. The TAX on my phone bill alone is close to 50%. Look up the Telecommunication Act. Whose admin was it passed under? (Clintons). It's "purpose" was to "wire up the schools". OK...they were and are. Yet that tax has never gone away.....decades later. All schools and libraries, both public & private, now have computers + internet. Done. Check that box.
    -
  • It's not wise to carry water for Big Brother. Eventually, you'll be drowned in it. Caveat Emptor.
 
Originally Posted By: hatt
Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: hatt
Oh need to call the next town. Long distance charges apply. Man the good old days. Government control is sweet.


The FCC gets to determine what's called "internet" so you can compare competitors on speed, price, and customer service instead of all of the above plus "free favorite channels."

I'm pleased as punch that if I chose dirty coal or clean solar power, both are delivered to my DVD player in the same 120V, 60 Hz format. The internet I deliver to said media player should work the same no matter what "brand" it is. Unless they'd like to use a name other than "internet"... like bubbly wine can't be called Champagne unless it meets a specific French Government standard, that's honored by US Customs.
What did any of that have to do with my post?


What he is saying is that internet should be internet. It should be the same no matter which isp you have. Also your above argument about the Lexus vs Toyotas already exists now. I can choose from either 2/1, 15/1, 20/2, 30/5 and 50/5. I already pay for the fastest speed available tI me. The Lexus in your argument. What you are arguing for is the @ equivalent of buying a Lexus and then being told if you want an engine you have to pay additional. And if you want tires, that's an additional upcharge as well.
 
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
Originally Posted By: Nick R
The internet DOES need regulation, because ISPs are starting to figure out just how much they can get away with screwing over their customers. The answer is-- as much as they want, because we are a "captive audience" we don't have a choice. If I want high speed internet, my only choice is Time Warner Cable. If I don't like how they are treating me, I can't just switch to someone else. And that means without basic regulation, ISPs are going to start even more doing things to pad their own bottom lines. Make you pay extra to get to certain sites. Make services that compete with theirs a worse experience so you are more likely to buy THEIR service. [censored] like this. It's started to happen already, and if the FCC is not allowed to pass net neutrality regulation, we might as well kiss new technology and development of the internet goodbye. Or rather, our ISP overlords will be the ones who will tell us what we are allowed to use.

  • What's your definition of "high speed internet"?
    -
  • So you have no competition in your area? There are other options if you don't like how you're being treated. After all, you now have an insiders perspective.
    -
  • You've stated government "basic regulation" as a method to prevent ISP's from "padding their own bottom lines." What about personal regulation and being pro-active?
    -
  • Being a TWC former-employee, you have the inside scoup on telling customers here how to get a better deal. So why don't you? I've posted many times how I get a better deal out of AT&T. Even posted their CRD number. If TWC is your only option, and their profits are "obscene" why not educate fellow users how to get a better deal? OR ween yourself from endless supply of #$%^! supplied from the engorged digital ^!^ (milk supply).
    -
  • BTW, look at your phone/internet bill. See all of those taxes listed? Local, state & federal. Some of us here remember when those didn't exist. The TAX on my phone bill alone is close to 50%. Look up the Telecommunication Act. Whose admin was it passed under? (Clintons). It's "purpose" was to "wire up the schools". OK...they were and are. Yet that tax has never gone away.....decades later. All schools and libraries, both public & private, now have computers + internet. Done. Check that box.
    -
  • It's not wise to carry water for Big Brother. Eventually, you'll be drowned in it. Caveat Emptor.
I have helped people on here get a better deal on their twc service before. I tell people all the time how to do it. There is one member on here I even went do far as to directly help him with his account when I still worked there. He is free to chime in if he wants.

In short, you don't know anything, shut your mouth.
 
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Originally Posted By: Nate1979
Originally Posted By: Nick R
Originally Posted By: hatt
For some reason a whole lot of people aren't smart enough to figure out that ISP will simply slow everyone. They'd have to be totally retarded to invest billions so other companies can cash in while they're locked into some .gov [censored].


You clearly lack basic reasoning skills. ISPs will not slow everyone down. They are not anywhere close to maximum capacity for their infrastructure in all but a few areas (NYC, for example). You also seem to forget the purpose they serve. ISPs connect the internet to consumers. The internet, and the billions of dollars in commerce it serves. In other words, they indirectly exist so other companies CAN cash in. And cut the [censored], there is not a single ISP that is hurting for money. They are all operating on such a ridiculous profit margin it's ridiculous. If your ISP charged you $100/mo for internet, they pocket ~$90 of that as profit. And that is no exaggeration. I worked for an ISP, and that is the fact of the matter.



Who are you to decide which companies are making enough money or not? No public owned company is going to sit by and let their profit margins be cut when they have a fiduciary duty to their stock holders. High prices for all or slower speeds for all, reduced investment.


This is the reason the ftc, FCC and DOJ exist. To prevent companies from engaging in anti competetive, anti consumer activities. The old rules were struck down because isps were not classified as common carriers so the FCC could not impose ccommon carrier like rules on them. The FCC was told if they wanted to do it, they would have to reclassify internet as a utility. Which is what they just did.
 
Kind of a coincidence that to get the rule to pass that they need to classify it as a utility and what do you know? FCC decides that the internet is a utility. That stinks of corruption or as most people call it a normal day for the govt.
 
If the internet is to be treated as a utility, then it will only get more expensive. On my utility bills, on top of the taxes I have delivery charges, pension charges, yes I pay utilities pension, peak, off peak and a host of other nonsense.

I can't wait for another "outraged" post seeking government's solution...
 
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