Used '04 F-450 w/ 6.0 PSD - Good idea or disaster?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Mar 2, 2004
Messages
4,098
Location
Kentucky
My work went and did the unthinakable-- dropped $14k on a 2004 F-450 DRW w/ 6.0L Powerstroke diesel engine. Truck has a whopping 220k miles on it, and I suppose its only saving grace is that it has the nice ZF 6-speed manual and is 4wd, short wheelbase (regular cab).

Our fleet has always consisted of first generation ('99-'04) Super Duties, with V10 automatics. These have been next to flawless, especially given that our maintenance regime consists of change engine oil + filter every 5k, and drive them until something breaks. I think we've put an ABS controller in one of them once, other than that they've been bulletproof. Recently, one of our F-350 4x4 duallies was totaled when a vehicle pulled out in front of one of our drivers and got T-boned. This truck will be the replacement.

The owner of the business is uneducated when it comes to vehicles, but is a biased die-hard Ford nut. Can't blame him, given the ownership experience we've had thus far. Until now, he hasn't been exposed to the 6.0L, or any of the Power Strokes, so he doesn't know the history of the 6.0L and its problems.

My question is, what headaches do you think we've just brought upon ourselves by introducing a Powerstroke to the fleet, especially the infamous 6.0L and one that's at very high mileage? I drove the truck around the yard yesterday and it's remarkably clean and looks well taken care of. Clutch and tranny are smooth as butter and engine bay looks incredibly clean (and not the polished-cover-in-armor-all clean you'd expect from a used car dealer). Oil is a nice golden brown, shows no signs of abuse or past problems. Coolant and other fluids look good. Front rotors are so new that the casting marks haven't even wore off yet. So clearly it's had some work done recently.

I'm not in charge of maintenance, but I can make suggestions on service intervals and would like your guys' opinions on what and how often it should be serviced. This company is not one that is going to pour hundreds of dollars every month to do things "right," like many on this board would do. But a good, reasonably service interval (like oil every 5k, fuel filters every 20k, trans fluid every 50k) has a good chance of being implemented for this truck.

We don't do frequent towing, but the trucks have a heavy payload. They take two 300 amp welder/generators, oxy/acetylene bottles, torches, tools, equipment, etc. (they're iron workers) to the jobsite daily. A couple/few times a month they're loaded to the max GVWR to deliver material to the jobsite. In essence, it'll be used like a F-450 should.
 
Well all I can tell you is when we had several of those in our fleet they were a nightmare. Literally spent weeks at the dealer.
They were stinky filthy running engines with numerous expensive problems. We also have had many 7.3L powerstroke and gmc 6.6L engines that are excellent.
Our dealer even suggested going with the v10 gas engine in the future.
 
Change the oil every 5K, use either Rotella T6, Mobil TDT, or a similar high quality synthetic 5W40. use only a Motorcraft oil filter that has the replaceable element, the ones that have the cap as part of the filter should be banished from the market.

Get rid of the gold coolant and change to Rotella ELC or similar and put on a coolant filter, Sinister makes a good one of the 6.0.

If you have an issue with the EGR cooler, replace it with a Bullet Proof one.

Might as well do the blue spring fuel pressure upgrade now.

Never let the batteries die, it will kill your FICM.
 
Considering that a neighbor had a F-450 with a 6.4 (considered the lesser evil of the two Ford diesel nightmares) come apart internally running down the interstate, unloaded, with the cruise set at 67, with less than 40k on the odometer...

All I can say is "Good Luck with that".
 
They are not great, but I imagine at 220,000 most of the stuff that goes wrong has been fixed to get to that point.
 
Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Considering that a neighbor had a F-450 with a 6.4 (considered the lesser evil of the two Ford diesel nightmares) come apart internally running down the interstate, unloaded, with the cruise set at 67, with less than 40k on the odometer...

All I can say is "Good Luck with that".


I would take a 6.0 over a 6.4 anyday.
 
Wow, when you Google "6.0 Powerstroke issues," that's a timesuck for sure.

I don't know much about diesel but that engine was doomed for failure. Sand left over inside from the casting procedure? Really? What parts supplier said "This is good enough" on that one?
 
from what I hear the engine that the 6.0 was derived from was a very good engine, then they proceeded to pile on all the emissions making it a not so good one.

I've heard time and time again once the quirks are worked out that engine can be bulletproof, of course that always takes time and money.
 
Ford cranked up the power and actually exceeded IH's maximum cylinder pressure limits. (Seriously.)

Best advice: when it barfs up the motor, a Cummins swap isn't any more money than a rebuilt 6.doh swap.
 
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Ford cranked up the power and actually exceeded IH's maximum cylinder pressure limits. (Seriously.)

Best advice: when it barfs up the motor, a Cummins swap isn't any more money than a rebuilt 6.doh swap.


The VT365 has all the same issues. It wasn't Ford's "power increase" that caused the problem.

Also, torque-wise, Ford made no more than International did. The difference was that Ford slightly extended the RPM range to increase horsepower.

The engine had numerous factory issues, some of which were fixed later on both both Ford/International (revised head bolts, upgraded EGR cooler, branch tube adapter....etc) but when bulletproofed is actually quite reliable.

A buddy of mine has worked on literally hundreds of DT444, VT365, Maxxforce 7...etc engines. He did fleet service for a school bus company and all those engines are used. He also owned a 6.0L PSD that ate two EGR coolers, an FICM, split the branch tube adapter and a set of injectors.

The transmission was the highlight of the truck. The 5R110 held up to increased power levels of 450HP/800TQ like a champion. He routinely towed to the limit of the truck.

After deleting the EGR, replacing the FICM, replacing the injectors and having the branch tube adapter done the engine was reliable. It also picked up about 2MPG with the EGR delete. He sold it a little over a year back and it is still around, now serving as a plow truck. The new owner has had no issues with it.

The EGR Cummins engines aren't immune to failure either. They were just better than the 6.0L was "as shipped".
 
Originally Posted By: Black_Thunder
from what I hear the engine that the 6.0 was derived from was a very good engine, then they proceeded to pile on all the emissions making it a not so good one.

I've heard time and time again once the quirks are worked out that engine can be bulletproof, of course that always takes time and money.


Both the VT365 (International version) and the 6.0L PSD had emissions junk in OTR trim. The EGR cooler was probably the highest failure item on the engine and if not caught could cause catastrophic engine failure.
 
The 6.0 is hit or miss, but at 220K, I would bet that's a good one.

The 6.0 definitely had design issues, but not all were bad, and the design issues can be worked out.

My cousin had a bone stock 2006 F-250 with the 6.0 and it was a very reliable truck. No major issues to speak of, and it was barely maintained.
 
Did you guys save the V10 out of the totaled pickup?

In reality if it has made it to 220,000 you should be ok.
 
Lose the EGR & EGR cooler, also switch the antifreeze from G-05 to a Cat approved EC-1 coolant, such as Peak Final Charge or equivalent, also put a head stud kit on it. My '04 E-350 made it to 250K+ before the TorqShift lost reverse completely, I ran Valvoline PBX 5W40 & Motorcraft oil filters changed religiously every 5K. It leaked coolant from DAY ONE & the head gaskets failed at 50K-but after Ford fixed it (in 2 months!) it ran pretty well.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top