Check for vacuum leaks in the intake. They can cause excessively lean codes and engines not running properly.
1997 Jeep GC 4.0 starts, then Dies, MN Cold
- Thread starter niero
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Update:
I checked w/ the shop and they had checked for vaccuum leaks. Said they didn't find any, but I do have a couple other minor leaks, natural w/ the age of the vehicle.
- Minor tranny fluid leak. Hoping to get that taken care of within a month, depending on funds.
- Power steering
- differentials (those I want to address soon)
- coolant leak but not in the radiator
My coolant reservoir needs topping off every 6-8 weeks. But every time I do they check the radiator and say it's completely full. So the leak must be elsewhere.
Would it be worth it to put in some of those Stop Leak products in the tranny, and power steering?
http://www.valvoline.com/products/consum...th-stop-leak/38
or
http://www.stp.com/products/functional-fluids/power-steering-fluid-and-stop-leak/
For fuel injectors, are there any higher quality injectors that are recommended? I figure any smaller things like that that I can upgrade will help it run smoother, and maybe last longer.
I'm going to check the receipt and see if the IAC was cleaned.
Thanks.
I checked w/ the shop and they had checked for vaccuum leaks. Said they didn't find any, but I do have a couple other minor leaks, natural w/ the age of the vehicle.
- Minor tranny fluid leak. Hoping to get that taken care of within a month, depending on funds.
- Power steering
- differentials (those I want to address soon)
- coolant leak but not in the radiator
My coolant reservoir needs topping off every 6-8 weeks. But every time I do they check the radiator and say it's completely full. So the leak must be elsewhere.
Would it be worth it to put in some of those Stop Leak products in the tranny, and power steering?
http://www.valvoline.com/products/consum...th-stop-leak/38
or
http://www.stp.com/products/functional-fluids/power-steering-fluid-and-stop-leak/
For fuel injectors, are there any higher quality injectors that are recommended? I figure any smaller things like that that I can upgrade will help it run smoother, and maybe last longer.
I'm going to check the receipt and see if the IAC was cleaned.
Thanks.
DO NOT use stop leak, you will regret it. I'm betting your leaks are probably just lines that are getting old.
Next time the Jeep dies, try 1 or 2 taps on the underside of the fuel tank with a wrench or small hammer. If it starts right up, it will be the fuel pump causing the problem.
Nick1994
$100 site donor 2024
Originally Posted By: Yazmeister
Next time the Jeep dies, try 1 or 2 taps on the underside of the fuel tank with a wrench or small hammer. If it starts right up, it will be the fuel pump causing the problem.
The Cherokees have a gas tank skid plate and he won't be hitting the tank with a wrench.
Crawl underneath on the passenger side rear under the RR door and you'll be able to see where the fuel pump is on the tank, you can hit it there.
Next time the Jeep dies, try 1 or 2 taps on the underside of the fuel tank with a wrench or small hammer. If it starts right up, it will be the fuel pump causing the problem.
The Cherokees have a gas tank skid plate and he won't be hitting the tank with a wrench.
Crawl underneath on the passenger side rear under the RR door and you'll be able to see where the fuel pump is on the tank, you can hit it there.
Originally Posted By: niero
Update:
I checked w/ the shop and they had checked for vaccuum leaks. Said they didn't find any, but I do have a couple other minor leaks, natural w/ the age of the vehicle.
- Minor tranny fluid leak. Hoping to get that taken care of within a month, depending on funds.
- Power steering
- differentials (those I want to address soon)
- coolant leak but not in the radiator
My coolant reservoir needs topping off every 6-8 weeks. But every time I do they check the radiator and say it's completely full. So the leak must be elsewhere.
Would it be worth it to put in some of those Stop Leak products in the tranny, and power steering?
http://www.valvoline.com/products/consum...th-stop-leak/38
or
http://www.stp.com/products/functional-fluids/power-steering-fluid-and-stop-leak/
For fuel injectors, are there any higher quality injectors that are recommended? I figure any smaller things like that that I can upgrade will help it run smoother, and maybe last longer.
I'm going to check the receipt and see if the IAC was cleaned.
Thanks.
Coolant leak could be a water pump starting to go out, pretty easy to tell. The water pump is on the front of the motor and driven by the serpentine belt usually it's the pulley that the cooling fan is attached to. On the underside of the snout on the pump (where the pulley shaft comes through) there is a small weep hole, if there is coolant dripping out of that weep hole then the seals in the pump are failing and it should be replaced.
Update:
I checked w/ the shop and they had checked for vaccuum leaks. Said they didn't find any, but I do have a couple other minor leaks, natural w/ the age of the vehicle.
- Minor tranny fluid leak. Hoping to get that taken care of within a month, depending on funds.
- Power steering
- differentials (those I want to address soon)
- coolant leak but not in the radiator
My coolant reservoir needs topping off every 6-8 weeks. But every time I do they check the radiator and say it's completely full. So the leak must be elsewhere.
Would it be worth it to put in some of those Stop Leak products in the tranny, and power steering?
http://www.valvoline.com/products/consum...th-stop-leak/38
or
http://www.stp.com/products/functional-fluids/power-steering-fluid-and-stop-leak/
For fuel injectors, are there any higher quality injectors that are recommended? I figure any smaller things like that that I can upgrade will help it run smoother, and maybe last longer.
I'm going to check the receipt and see if the IAC was cleaned.
Thanks.
Coolant leak could be a water pump starting to go out, pretty easy to tell. The water pump is on the front of the motor and driven by the serpentine belt usually it's the pulley that the cooling fan is attached to. On the underside of the snout on the pump (where the pulley shaft comes through) there is a small weep hole, if there is coolant dripping out of that weep hole then the seals in the pump are failing and it should be replaced.
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
Originally Posted By: Yazmeister
Next time the Jeep dies, try 1 or 2 taps on the underside of the fuel tank with a wrench or small hammer. If it starts right up, it will be the fuel pump causing the problem.
The Cherokees have a gas tank skid plate and he won't be hitting the tank with a wrench.
Crawl underneath on the passenger side rear under the RR door and you'll be able to see where the fuel pump is on the tank, you can hit it there.
I could've sworn the Grand Cherokee's didn't have a skid plate under the gas tank. There was a recall just last year since there was a huge number of Jeep GC's that started on fire if rear-ended.
As I understand it, they would just put a trailer hitch on, instead of a skid plate. Mine already has a hitch, but I'd like to get a plate eventually.
Either way, that's good to know I have something I can try if it dies again.
Originally Posted By: ironman_gq
Coolant leak could be a water pump starting to go out, pretty easy to tell. The water pump is on the front of the motor and driven by the serpentine belt usually it's the pulley that the cooling fan is attached to. On the underside of the snout on the pump (where the pulley shaft comes through) there is a small weep hole, if there is coolant dripping out of that weep hole then the seals in the pump are failing and it should be replaced.
Awesome, I'll give that a look. Anything I can check myself saves at least $20 - $100 in diagnostics at the shop.
Originally Posted By: Yazmeister
Next time the Jeep dies, try 1 or 2 taps on the underside of the fuel tank with a wrench or small hammer. If it starts right up, it will be the fuel pump causing the problem.
The Cherokees have a gas tank skid plate and he won't be hitting the tank with a wrench.
Crawl underneath on the passenger side rear under the RR door and you'll be able to see where the fuel pump is on the tank, you can hit it there.
I could've sworn the Grand Cherokee's didn't have a skid plate under the gas tank. There was a recall just last year since there was a huge number of Jeep GC's that started on fire if rear-ended.
As I understand it, they would just put a trailer hitch on, instead of a skid plate. Mine already has a hitch, but I'd like to get a plate eventually.
Either way, that's good to know I have something I can try if it dies again.
Originally Posted By: ironman_gq
Coolant leak could be a water pump starting to go out, pretty easy to tell. The water pump is on the front of the motor and driven by the serpentine belt usually it's the pulley that the cooling fan is attached to. On the underside of the snout on the pump (where the pulley shaft comes through) there is a small weep hole, if there is coolant dripping out of that weep hole then the seals in the pump are failing and it should be replaced.
Awesome, I'll give that a look. Anything I can check myself saves at least $20 - $100 in diagnostics at the shop.
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
The Cherokees have a gas tank skid plate and he won't be hitting the tank with a wrench.
Crawl underneath on the passenger side rear under the RR door and you'll be able to see where the fuel pump is on the tank, you can hit it there.
Only some of them do, not all of them. In fact skid plates are a hard to find option on both Cherokees and Grand Cherokees.
The Cherokees have a gas tank skid plate and he won't be hitting the tank with a wrench.
Crawl underneath on the passenger side rear under the RR door and you'll be able to see where the fuel pump is on the tank, you can hit it there.
Only some of them do, not all of them. In fact skid plates are a hard to find option on both Cherokees and Grand Cherokees.
Quick Update
I remembered I had a bottle in the Jeep, so I added a little Marvel Mystery Oil to the fuel when I gassed up yesterday. Per the instructions, "Marvel recommends using 4oz of MMO for every 10 gallons of gasoline."
Tank had about 4 gallons left, a few notches above empty.
Jeep has a 23 gal tank. I added about 6 oz., so I'd have some left. I think it's helping in that the engine idle seems quieter, smoother idle, and it starts much smoother/a little quicker.
MMO FAQ: http://www.marvelmysteryoil.com/index.php/site/faq/
Info copy/pasted from here: http://www.marvelmysteryoil.com/index.php/site/mmo/
I've noticed this ticking sound for a while, so maybe next oil change I'll throw in another MMO into the oil.
"..added to engine oil, Marvel reduces/prevents valve sticking/clatter by breaking down deposits of carbon/sludge. ..valve sticking can be identified by a "ticking" sound from the engine when running.
It may be in my head, but since adding it to the fuel yesterday, the ticking seems quieter when idling. However, now that I think about it, I should probably check the belts, since IIRC, they can make slight "slapping/clicking" sounds.
It seems to help cold starting, though we haven't had anything below 12 degrees F for a week yet, at least in the Twin Cities, MN.
MMO's supposed to help easier cold weather starting with its extremely low pour point of (-65) Fahrenheit and ability to eliminate oil's tendency to congeal at low temperatures."
I've learned to take any benefits on any product w/ at least a grain of salt. But I do think MMO/Seafoam is probably better than most other additives (not to start an "additive war").
Question
Would MMO (or Seafoamn) in the fuel, or in the oil, clean the IAC, or any of the throttle control parts?
Thanks.
I remembered I had a bottle in the Jeep, so I added a little Marvel Mystery Oil to the fuel when I gassed up yesterday. Per the instructions, "Marvel recommends using 4oz of MMO for every 10 gallons of gasoline."
Tank had about 4 gallons left, a few notches above empty.
Jeep has a 23 gal tank. I added about 6 oz., so I'd have some left. I think it's helping in that the engine idle seems quieter, smoother idle, and it starts much smoother/a little quicker.
MMO FAQ: http://www.marvelmysteryoil.com/index.php/site/faq/
Info copy/pasted from here: http://www.marvelmysteryoil.com/index.php/site/mmo/
I've noticed this ticking sound for a while, so maybe next oil change I'll throw in another MMO into the oil.
"..added to engine oil, Marvel reduces/prevents valve sticking/clatter by breaking down deposits of carbon/sludge. ..valve sticking can be identified by a "ticking" sound from the engine when running.
It may be in my head, but since adding it to the fuel yesterday, the ticking seems quieter when idling. However, now that I think about it, I should probably check the belts, since IIRC, they can make slight "slapping/clicking" sounds.
It seems to help cold starting, though we haven't had anything below 12 degrees F for a week yet, at least in the Twin Cities, MN.
MMO's supposed to help easier cold weather starting with its extremely low pour point of (-65) Fahrenheit and ability to eliminate oil's tendency to congeal at low temperatures."
I've learned to take any benefits on any product w/ at least a grain of salt. But I do think MMO/Seafoam is probably better than most other additives (not to start an "additive war").
Question
Would MMO (or Seafoamn) in the fuel, or in the oil, clean the IAC, or any of the throttle control parts?
Thanks.
Nope. The fuel injectors are in the intake manifold after the throttle. The only time oil would pass by is when the vapors get sucked through the PCV.
Thanks, Miller88. Good to know.
I'm guess this info is wrong, as it seems to contradict what everyone on here says.
But I just called the shop to see what it would cost to take out and clean the Idle Control Valve. Figured if it's $20, no problem. If it's $80+ then I'll have to try it myself.
The guy at the service counter said, after checking their computer, that you can't clean the ICV, that since it's just a little piston, if there's a problem, then it would be the Idle Control Motor.
Is that correct?
I'm watching some videos on cleaning the ICV, so I may attempt it myself . . .
Thanks for the continuing help, guys. Much appreciated.
I'm guess this info is wrong, as it seems to contradict what everyone on here says.
But I just called the shop to see what it would cost to take out and clean the Idle Control Valve. Figured if it's $20, no problem. If it's $80+ then I'll have to try it myself.
The guy at the service counter said, after checking their computer, that you can't clean the ICV, that since it's just a little piston, if there's a problem, then it would be the Idle Control Motor.
Is that correct?
I'm watching some videos on cleaning the ICV, so I may attempt it myself . . .
Thanks for the continuing help, guys. Much appreciated.
If you are planning on cleaning the IAC valve passage, I would take the whole throttle body off and clean the underside including the throttle plate. Plus buy a new IAC valve (buy one from AAP if you have one near by--->AAP code). Just my 2 cents.
Originally Posted By: Yazmeister
If you are planning on cleaning the IAC valve passage, I would take the whole throttle body off and clean the underside including the throttle plate. Plus buy a new IAC valve (buy one from AAP if you have one near by--->AAP code). Just my 2 cents.
Thanks, Yazmeister. After some more research, I don't think I'll attempt this on my own. I talked to one shop and they wanted too much $$ in parts/labor, and wouldn't clean it. But they wanted $90 just for the part. NAPA has it for $40.
I'm taking it into a different, small shop I used to go to, this afternoon. He also seems to think that since we're taking it out, might as well replace it. Hopefully, I can get the issue fixed before our next cold snap.
Do you recommend Advanced Auto Parts over NAPA?
Thanks.
If you are planning on cleaning the IAC valve passage, I would take the whole throttle body off and clean the underside including the throttle plate. Plus buy a new IAC valve (buy one from AAP if you have one near by--->AAP code). Just my 2 cents.
Thanks, Yazmeister. After some more research, I don't think I'll attempt this on my own. I talked to one shop and they wanted too much $$ in parts/labor, and wouldn't clean it. But they wanted $90 just for the part. NAPA has it for $40.
I'm taking it into a different, small shop I used to go to, this afternoon. He also seems to think that since we're taking it out, might as well replace it. Hopefully, I can get the issue fixed before our next cold snap.
Do you recommend Advanced Auto Parts over NAPA?
Thanks.
I got the ICV cleaned, including the opening the ICV piston goes into. The idle is better, for sure. But I notice that I noticed that now, if I put it in reverse, the idle drops, engine almost dies. Or if I go from reverse into Drive quickly, idle drops, almost dies. I have to tap the throttle so it doesn't die.
I was thinking about cleaning the throttle control myself, as detailed here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJlGvei4dxs
Is this an okay way to do it? I've been reading different forums and there are a number of proposed ways to clean the TB.
At this point I'm not willing to remove the TB. Maybe another time as I get more comfortable.
- A couple posts say to pour (not spray) Seafoam in the throttle control while Jeep is running.
- Others say Seafoam isn't good, only use Mopar TB cleaner
- **Am I supposed to disconnect any sensors or the battery? I've read some odd things such as you MUST disconnect battery, or O2 sensor.
Other causes to this same idle problem:
- Even a slight vacuum leak in the system
- A worn out cat converter (Mine has had some kind of loose metal part, almost sounds like a couple ball bearings, rattling around inside it, ever since I got the Jeep. I was told the cat converter was still good, though, by the shop.
- Transmission leak/low tranny fluid. Some said this can cause idle prob, and I was told that the tranny fluid was a little low.
Thanks in advance if you have a chance to respond.
I was thinking about cleaning the throttle control myself, as detailed here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJlGvei4dxs
Is this an okay way to do it? I've been reading different forums and there are a number of proposed ways to clean the TB.
At this point I'm not willing to remove the TB. Maybe another time as I get more comfortable.
- A couple posts say to pour (not spray) Seafoam in the throttle control while Jeep is running.
- Others say Seafoam isn't good, only use Mopar TB cleaner
- **Am I supposed to disconnect any sensors or the battery? I've read some odd things such as you MUST disconnect battery, or O2 sensor.
Other causes to this same idle problem:
- Even a slight vacuum leak in the system
- A worn out cat converter (Mine has had some kind of loose metal part, almost sounds like a couple ball bearings, rattling around inside it, ever since I got the Jeep. I was told the cat converter was still good, though, by the shop.
- Transmission leak/low tranny fluid. Some said this can cause idle prob, and I was told that the tranny fluid was a little low.
Thanks in advance if you have a chance to respond.
Nick1994
$100 site donor 2024
I seafoamed my grandpas 96' Cherokee. Take off the air cleaner hose and pour about half a bottle down the throttle body slowly, just a trickle. Then shut it off and wait 15 minutes. Let it idle for a minute after the 15 minutes then give it some revs and drive it like you stole it.
Do this in an area where it can smoke like a freight train and won't fill traffic with smoke or someone's open window.
Do this in an area where it can smoke like a freight train and won't fill traffic with smoke or someone's open window.
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
I seafoamed my grandpas 96' Cherokee. Take off the air cleaner hose and pour about half a bottle down the throttle body slowly, just a trickle. Then shut it off and wait 15 minutes. Let it idle for a minute after the 15 minutes then give it some revs and drive it like you stole it.
Do this in an area where it can smoke like a freight train and won't fill traffic with smoke or someone's open window.
Thanks, Nick1994
So all I do is remove the air intake hose from the TB, correct?
I seafoamed my grandpas 96' Cherokee. Take off the air cleaner hose and pour about half a bottle down the throttle body slowly, just a trickle. Then shut it off and wait 15 minutes. Let it idle for a minute after the 15 minutes then give it some revs and drive it like you stole it.
Do this in an area where it can smoke like a freight train and won't fill traffic with smoke or someone's open window.
Thanks, Nick1994
So all I do is remove the air intake hose from the TB, correct?
Nick1994
$100 site donor 2024
Originally Posted By: niero
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
I seafoamed my grandpas 96' Cherokee. Take off the air cleaner hose and pour about half a bottle down the throttle body slowly, just a trickle. Then shut it off and wait 15 minutes. Let it idle for a minute after the 15 minutes then give it some revs and drive it like you stole it.
Do this in an area where it can smoke like a freight train and won't fill traffic with smoke or someone's open window.
Thanks, Nick1994
So all I do is remove the air intake hose from the TB, correct?
Yup. Seafoam is great stuff, some don't believe in it but my mechanic buddy has used it in a few cars to get them to pass emissions for the owners and that's all they cared about. For example, a moving truck with mega miles runs great but produced too much emissions, he seafoamed it and it passed with flying colors.
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
I seafoamed my grandpas 96' Cherokee. Take off the air cleaner hose and pour about half a bottle down the throttle body slowly, just a trickle. Then shut it off and wait 15 minutes. Let it idle for a minute after the 15 minutes then give it some revs and drive it like you stole it.
Do this in an area where it can smoke like a freight train and won't fill traffic with smoke or someone's open window.
Thanks, Nick1994
So all I do is remove the air intake hose from the TB, correct?
Yup. Seafoam is great stuff, some don't believe in it but my mechanic buddy has used it in a few cars to get them to pass emissions for the owners and that's all they cared about. For example, a moving truck with mega miles runs great but produced too much emissions, he seafoamed it and it passed with flying colors.
Decided to go w/ NAPA Throttle Body Cleaner spray.
http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/Catalo...2400_0006558880
Seafoam is more expensive, and since it's going to be about 10 degrees F tomorrow when doing this, my hands will be shaking. If I was pouring Seafoam I'd likely dump too much in accidentally.
Doing this tomorrow, will see how it goes.
http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/Catalo...2400_0006558880
Seafoam is more expensive, and since it's going to be about 10 degrees F tomorrow when doing this, my hands will be shaking. If I was pouring Seafoam I'd likely dump too much in accidentally.
Doing this tomorrow, will see how it goes.
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