A happy medium...

[Nick R]

As I left work at 6:30 this morning, enjoying the "fanastic" job ODOT does here (Can I just say I miss NYS DOT) I can't help but wonder why it is that in most things there is balance. A bell curve if you will. But not when it comes to people driving in the snow. You either have those guys doing 80mph in the snow in their big 4WD trucks and duallies.

OR you have the people doing well under what could be considered prudent, say doing 25mph on the highway. Like this morning, I held to about 45-50 on a road I would normally be doing 75 on. But then I had pickups and sports cars roaring up behind me doing at least 70mph. And then there were the people doing about 25mph and being even more of a danger than the snow itself.

Seriously, somewhere between those two extremes there has to be a happy medium, and I wonder why it's so hard for people to find it.

 

[Pop_Rivit]

Your happy medium isn't the same as everyone else's happy medium.

One of the skills that a good driver has is the ability to recognize that there is a wide range of drivers on the road. A good driver adjusts his/her driving to both traffic flow as well as the road conditions.

The perfect world you're in search of simply doesn't exist. Never has, never will.

 

[eljefino]

Everyone faster than you is an idiot and everyone slower is a moron.

Who said this first, George Carlin?

I'd hate to be on a road with this speed disparity. Someone's going to get creamed.

And those going 25 say, well I'll run these bald tires and just take it easy, I'll get by.

 

[Silverado12]

It happens around here too. 45-50 is a perfectly reasonable, common sense speed when you're driving in snow. The 70 mph guys should be stopped by the police and told to slow down. Maybe there should be portable signs displaying the inclement weather speed. 25 is too slow, I agree. I miss NY when it comes to how they take care of the roads, too. They do pay some high taxes, but you get something in return. I had to go through PA to get to Rochester, NY (Valeo Automotive, used to be ACDelco) on my regular truck run and PA was pretty scary to say the least.

 

[JHZR2]

I don't know where you are in OH, or where you were driving, but I have driven across the OH and IN turnpikes during both heavy rain and heavy snow.

What I observed is that the tandem trucks and other tractor trailers slow down very little (resulting in me seeing one flipped and one hanging off an overpass), and when they do, they not only put off a buffeting wind, but also throw substantial spray in the form of snow or water.

Because of the motion as well as the visibility issues that these excessively fast trucks cause, the only way to securely drive under control and in an appropriate manner for the conditions is to go slower than one would ordinarily go. This causes a speed disparity which makes things worse.

There is no magic number of what speed is appropriate for what conditions. I find the car lengths rule set smarter - not that one car length per 10 MPH is reasonable in good conditions, but that or more is smart in bad ones.

 

[skyactiv]

What the DOT needs to do is modernize and switch over to variable speed limit signs on much of our interstate highway system.

 

[NMBurb02]

I am sure there were plenty of people going the same speed as you but you did not encounter them because they were going the same speed as you. If you were doing 45-50 mph and another car was doing 45-50 mph while traveling in the same direction with a 1/2 mile separation, neither of you would catch up with the other for quite a while unless we are talking about a 3+ mph speed differential and 20+ mile drive.

 

[Brybo86]

Originally Posted By: eljefino


And those going 25 say, well I'll run these bald tires and just take it easy, I'll get by.


New York is nice enough to collect your money and tell you how your tires are...in the form of a mandatory yearly inspection. so bald tires are very unlikely.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Originally Posted By: Brybo86
Originally Posted By: eljefino


And those going 25 say, well I'll run these bald tires and just take it easy, I'll get by.


New York is nice enough to collect your money and tell you how your tires are...in the form of a mandatory yearly inspection. so bald tires are very unlikely.


They say your tires are bad a 2/32'' of tread ... There's no way that is safe in the snow.

When I'm driving in snow and bad weather conditions, I do my best to avoid the Interstates at all costs. If I *do* have to use one, I just get in with the slow driving people and follow them.

I figure, if people with bald tires are moving along at 25 and not wrecking, I should be okay with good snow tires and also going slow.

 

[A_Harman]

Some rules I follow in winter driving:

I try to drive so that I am closing on the next car I'm about to pass at ~5 mph faster than they are going. I don't want to remain beside a car for any longer than necessary because it gives him more of a chance to lose it or forget I'm there and come over on me. I don't want to come blasting up on a car 15-25 mph faster than they are because I want to give them time to see me, and give myself time to slow if they swerve in front of me.

I try to place my car so that I have about equal spacing between the car ahead and the car behind. I might get closer to the car ahead because I have confidence that I can brake better due to my snow tires, and want to give the car behind a little more distance to not rear-end me.

Spray coming from the car ahead is good because it means the road is merely wet, and not icy.

 

[KrisZ]

The very slow drivers, especially the ones on the left lane do bug me a little, but I learned long time ago not to get emotional for this type of behaviour while behind the wheel. I usually put on some music and just go with the flow, concentrating on road and others around me.
Getting frustrated or angry just leads to bad decisions.

 

[Silverado12]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
I don't know where you are in OH, or where you were driving, but I have driven across the OH and IN turnpikes during both heavy rain and heavy snow.

What I observed is that the tandem trucks and other tractor trailers slow down very little (resulting in me seeing one flipped and one hanging off an overpass), and when they do, they not only put off a buffeting wind, but also throw substantial spray in the form of snow or water.

Because of the motion as well as the visibility issues that these excessively fast trucks cause, the only way to securely drive under control and in an appropriate manner for the conditions is to go slower than one would ordinarily go. This causes a speed disparity which makes things worse.

There is no magic number of what speed is appropriate for what conditions. I find the car lengths rule set smarter - not that one car length per 10 MPH is reasonable in good conditions, but that or more is smart in bad ones.



As a truck driver myself (semi-retired now), I get annoyed when other truck drivers are speeding like that. It makes us all look bad. The good drivers get little recognition. BTW I have been driving 20 years with no preventable accidents. Something I am very proud of.

 

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: Nick R
As I left work at 6:30 this morning, enjoying the "fanastic" job ODOT does here (Can I just say I miss NYS DOT) I can't help but wonder why it is that in most things there is balance. A bell curve if you will. But not when it comes to people driving in the snow. You either have those guys doing 80mph in the snow in their big 4WD trucks and duallies.

OR you have the people doing well under what could be considered prudent, say doing 25mph on the highway. Like this morning, I held to about 45-50 on a road I would normally be doing 75 on. But then I had pickups and sports cars roaring up behind me doing at least 70mph. And then there were the people doing about 25mph and being even more of a danger than the snow itself.

Seriously, somewhere between those two extremes there has to be a happy medium, and I wonder why it's so hard for people to find it.
That's why from time to time you see those HUGE pileups.

 

[HerrStig]

I haven driven a LOT of miles without bending a car, driven military ALL WDs, autocrossed sport sedans, and put "a few" miles on motor bikes. I make sure my tires and wipers are in good shape before winter, but I still drive much like an old lady and avoid drastic control inputs when it gets slick. My worry is some hotshot will lose it and create a mess I can't avoid. Passing and being passed are dangerous times, especially where there is an unplowed ridge of snow between lanes.

 

[HerrStig]

I have driven a LOT of miles without bending a car, driven military ALL WDs, autocrossed sport sedans, and put "a few" miles on motor bikes. I put a lot of miles on a tail happy "old" Beetle in bad weather. I make sure my tires and wipers are in good shape before winter, but I still drive much like an old lady and avoid drastic control inputs when it gets slick. My worry is some hotshot will lose it and create a mess I can't avoid. Passing and being passed are dangerous times, especially where there is an unplowed ridge of snow between lanes. I've found driving on a frozen lake is good practice, but there's only so much you can do when you lose grip.

 

[99Saturn]

The 25mph folks don't bother me, I just remember how annoying it is when I am practically getting tailgated in snow by someone that wants to get past me.

I lost it going around a turn before, going what I thought was a reasonable speed given the conditions and the traffic flow. Complete loss of control of the car but didn't hit anything/no damage - after that, I'd much rather be a slowpoke, or be behind one.

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: Nick R
As I left work at 6:30 this morning, enjoying the "fanastic" job ODOT does here (Can I just say I miss NYS DOT) I can't help but wonder why it is that in most things there is balance. A bell curve if you will. But not when it comes to people driving in the snow. You either have those guys doing 80mph in the snow in their big 4WD trucks and duallies.

OR you have the people doing well under what could be considered prudent, say doing 25mph on the highway. Like this morning, I held to about 45-50 on a road I would normally be doing 75 on. But then I had pickups and sports cars roaring up behind me doing at least 70mph. And then there were the people doing about 25mph and being even more of a danger than the snow itself.

Seriously, somewhere between those two extremes there has to be a happy medium, and I wonder why it's so hard for people to find it.


I would venture to guess it was for this very reason the huge pile-up occurred on I-94 in MI a couple weeks ago...some doing 70 and others doing 25...not a good mix...

 

[Yah-Tah-Hey]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
I don't know where you are in OH, or where you were driving, but I have driven across the OH and IN turnpikes during both heavy rain and heavy snow.

What I observed is that the tandem trucks and other tractor trailers slow down very little (resulting in me seeing one flipped and one hanging off an overpass), and when they do, they not only put off a buffeting wind, but also throw substantial spray in the form of snow or water.

Because of the motion as well as the visibility issues that these excessively fast trucks cause, the only way to securely drive under control and in an appropriate manner for the conditions is to go slower than one would ordinarily go. This causes a speed disparity which makes things worse.

There is no magic number of what speed is appropriate for what conditions. I find the car lengths rule set smarter - not that one car length per 10 MPH is reasonable in good conditions, but that or more is smart in bad ones.

 

[Yah-Tah-Hey]

Originally Posted By: HosteenJorje
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
I don't know where you are in OH, or where you were driving, but I have driven across the OH and IN turnpikes during both heavy rain and heavy snow.

What I observed is that the tandem trucks and other tractor trailers slow down very little (resulting in me seeing one flipped and one hanging off an overpass), and when they do, they not only put off a buffeting wind, but also throw substantial spray in the form of snow or water.

Because of the motion as well as the visibility issues that these excessively fast trucks cause, the only way to securely drive under control and in an appropriate manner for the conditions is to go slower than one would ordinarily go. This causes a speed disparity which makes things worse.

There is no magic number of what speed is appropriate for what conditions. I find the car lengths rule set smarter - not that one car length per 10 MPH is reasonable in good conditions, but that or more is smart in bad ones.
The one car length per 10 miles per hours hasn't been taught for decades in defensive driving courses. It's now a three second count. Deteriorating conditions add to the second count. No one could ever judge following distance by the 10 mph method anyway. The "one thousand one, one thousand two, one thousand three" method for determining following distance is the way to go. Around here, following too close is a major cause of accidents. That and distracted drivers with their cell phone stuck in their ear chatting someone up about some inane nothing.

 

[HTSS_TR]

We don't have problem with snow or ice in So Cal, but we do have problems with not too considerate drivers on highways.

The I5 south to San Diego is mostly 4 and 5 lanes each way, most of distance I saw more than 65-70% of all vehicles on the 2 left lanes, less than 30-35% on the 2 right lanes and sometime the right most lane was empty for several miles while the left lanes were crowded, usually the right lanes are moving faster than left lanes, therefore I was almost always in the faster moving right lanes.