Castrol EDGE 0w20 - 4,892mi - 2013 Mazda CX-5

[CrawfishTails]

Given that the fuel-diluted oil had a very low KV100=5.3, it may be a good idea to add some Polymer Ester (Hyper Lube no-zinc formula zinc replacement AW product) as MolaKule has used this kind of trick to get wear down in a low-viscosity oil.

Originally Posted By: MolaKule
I have used this kind of polymer chemistry in reduced ZDDP (experimental) formulations and I found I could reduce viscosity and still lower wear rates.

Suggested dossge ratio is about 1oz Hyper:13oz PCMO so what I suggest (since I don't see any viscosity or VII data) is adding 2-3oz of this stuff to a quart of oil and have the mix analyzed to make sure the VOA viscosity is still in the 0w20 range or whatever range of oil viscosity you may be using.

The polymer ester I use is about 140 weight (approx. 35 cSt) in its virgin form, but I suspect this stuff is "cut-down" to a 20 or 30 weight.

 

[jaybone]

Yes it's Edge has titanium in it!

 

[LX289]

Great Results other than the fuel dilution. I would keep running the oil

 

[Nick R]

This is a great looking UOA (other than the fuel) and I've been looking for one, as this is the oil I'm currently running in my Focus. I feel comfortable doing my usual 8-10k run on it now.

 

[camrydriver111]

If you run premium in a Skyactiv engine do you get more power?

Correct me if I'm wrong but regular gas (RON 95) in Europe is like our premium (AKI 91) in NA.

I hard time believing Europe vs. NA engines are different since engines are supposed to adjust to octane and making different engines would be expensive for the manufacturer.

 

[redbone3]

I thought the whole idea of direct injection engines was to prevent knocking (Pre ignition) by not having any fuel there to pre-ignite (Inject fuel just before the plug fires), enabling a high compression on low octane fuel. If this is true, how much would a higher octane help?

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: redbone3
I thought the whole idea of direct injection engines was to prevent knocking (Pre ignition) by not having any fuel there to pre-ignite (Inject fuel just before the plug fires), enabling a high compression on low octane fuel. If this is true, how much would a higher octane help?


Knocking is typically end gas auto-ignition, where the bit of fuel/air mix at the end of combustion self ignites after being heated by the pressure wave heading towards it...DI helps there, but now they are learning hat the little bit of oil that sneaks past the rings in this area can also "knock", badly enough to collapse ring lands.

Even in D.I. the fuel is injected and the air/fuel compressed, octane is still necessary.

 

[CrawfishTails]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Knocking is typically end gas auto-ignition, where the bit of fuel/air mix at the end of combustion self ignites after being heated by the pressure wave heading towards it...DI helps there, but now they are learning hat the little bit of oil that sneaks past the rings in this area can also "knock", badly enough to collapse ring lands.

Even in D.I. the fuel is injected and the air/fuel compressed, octane is still necessary.


Where did you hear that? Reference? Interesting if true.

 

[CT8]

Originally Posted By: CrawfishTails
Given that the fuel-diluted oil had a very low KV100=5.3, it may be a good idea to add some Polymer Ester (Hyper Lube no-zinc formula zinc replacement AW product) as MolaKule has used this kind of trick to get wear down in a low-viscosity oil.

Originally Posted By: MolaKule
I have used this kind of polymer chemistry in reduced ZDDP (experimental) formulations and I found I could reduce viscosity and still lower wear rates.

Suggested dossge ratio is about 1oz Hyper:13oz PCMO so what I suggest (since I don't see any viscosity or VII data) is adding 2-3oz of this stuff to a quart of oil and have the mix analyzed to make sure the VOA viscosity is still in the 0w20 range or whatever range of oil viscosity you may be using.

The polymer ester I use is about 140 weight (approx. 35 cSt) in its virgin form, but I suspect this stuff is "cut-down" to a 20 or 30 weight.
Hyperlube is expensive.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: CrawfishTails
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Knocking is typically end gas auto-ignition, where the bit of fuel/air mix at the end of combustion self ignites after being heated by the pressure wave heading towards it...DI helps there, but now they are learning hat the little bit of oil that sneaks past the rings in this area can also "knock", badly enough to collapse ring lands.

Even in D.I. the fuel is injected and the air/fuel compressed, octane is still necessary.


Where did you hear that? Reference? Interesting if true.


Nah, I just made it up.

http://papers.sae.org/2015-01-0758/

http://papers.sae.org/2014-01-1212/

It's specifically being looked at for GF6.

http://www.slideshare.net/AftonChemical/...ion-engine-oils

http://www.stle.org/resources/articledetails.aspx?did=1671

Discussed previously, including the lubricant reactivity stuff.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3488915/Lubricant_Reactivity_wrt_Engin

 

[CrawfishTails]

^^^^ Thanks Shannow for the references. You're one of the reasons why bitog is good to get into. I lean toward the technical-truth as much as possible.
Interesting results here. I had no idea oil was getting into pre-ignition near the rings.

 

[CrawfishTails]

Read Shannow's references above.

Related to this thread, a comment about what Mazda does in their own Mazda Genuine Motor Oil, MGMO 0w-20, and why all Mazda owners might want to use it.

"The inclusion of lubricant oil lowers the auto-ignition temperature of the oil-fuel mixed droplet [Amann, et al., SAE 2012-01-1140]"

"Mechanism consistent with lubricant sensitivity forming deposits on top cylinder walls (basestock quality, additives)."

Another reason to use synthetic oil!!! :
--- Using Group III or PAO basestocks in oil reduced low-speed pre-ignition (LSPI) frequency*

---- More moly in the oil decreased LSPI frequency* (Might be why Mazda, big on high compression SkyActiv engines, puts a lot of moly in their own oil.

*Takueuchi et al. [SAE 2012-01-1615]

 

[CrawfishTails]

And yet, with all the attention LSPI is getting, Ecoboost, SkyActiv, other turbo or non-turbo high compression DI engines seem to be doing OK right now.

 

[Shannow]

Yeah, I don't think that they are getting the cylinder pressures of the turbos.

Seems to be hinged around high boost, high torque, low revs.

 

[wemay]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: Boss302fan
Originally Posted By: badtlc
The simplest fix is run premium fuel. Otherwise you can go up to a w30 like Mobil1 0W-30.

I wouldn't freak out about it. Fuel dilution hasn't shown to do any harm at this point in any engine.


Why is running Premium fuel a fix? Just curious. Thanks.


These engines lean out the A:F mixture when on premium (less fuel). These high compression engines were designed to run on premium and then provided bandaids in order to run on regular.


Can you present the testing information for this school of thought? I am very interested in reading this since it would be simple for all mfrs to just recommend Premium fuels as a solution.

If dilution troubles the OP, the only 'fix' I currently know of and that has been discussed in many Lubrizol papers is shortened oci after break-in period.

 

[BrianC]

Where can I buy Wear Check analysis kits?

 

[badtlc]

Originally Posted By: camrydriver111
If you run premium in a Skyactiv engine do you get more power?


Yes, not massive or anything but you do get some.

 

[badtlc]

Originally Posted By: wemay

Can you present the testing information for this school of thought? I am very interested in reading this since it would be simple for all mfrs to just recommend Premium fuels as a solution.

If dilution troubles the OP, the only 'fix' I currently know of and that has been discussed in many Lubrizol papers is shortened oci after break-in period.


Yes, just look at my UOAs. Not even a hint of fuel dilution.

 

[BrianC]

Where can I by Wear Check sampling Kits?

 

[Eddie]

badtic: where can I review your UOAs on mazda SkyActive engines? Thanks. Ed