1997 Jeep GC 4.0 starts, then Dies, MN Cold

[niero]

Questions:
1. Does this sound like a gas line freeze?
2. If so, would "regular" HEET gasline antifreeze work? Or should I use the HEET Starting Fluid that you spray into the air intake? (That's the cold air intake, right?)
3. If not gasline freeze, other ideas as to what it could be?


Background:
1997 Jeep GC Laredo Tsi, inline 6. Engine has about 171,000 miles.
Oil changed three days ago. I requested full synthetic 10w30, but shop put full synthetic 5w30, per Jeep recommendations.

- Jeep was running great yesterday. It sat outside on the street last night. It got down to -14 F, I believe. Coldest it's been so far this year, anyway.

- Started it this morning. It turned over hard, but it started. Let it sit for 3 minutes (I know, should have let it warm up more).
- I then shifted into Drive, Reverse, then Drive. (Thought that might be a little easier on the tranny, rather than just putting it in Drive and going. Maybe that's a false idea.)

- I drove her very gently for two blocks, going only 10 mph. As I was turning right on a street, the engine died. Tried to start numerous times for the next 10 minutes.
Battery is only 1 year old. When she started this morning, battery gauge showed normal.
She was turning over hard, but eventually, as I pumped the gas pedal lightly, she started, but died right away.
Started again, and I then kept pressing the gas pedal over and over until I got into a parking space.

Gas line freeze? Other things it could be?
Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance if you're able to respond.

 

[CharBaby]

Check all of the ignition wires and make sure none of them are leaning on the exhaust manifold and have burnt causing a short in the starting process. This happens to many folks I know who own that Jeep and RAM. Now, this is the first question I ask!

Good Luck,

CB

 

[eljefino]

Might be a dirty idle air passage or control motor. Did it run well when your foot was lightly on the gas?

 

[Donald]

First - sure you have gas?

In this day of E10 gas, if you have a frozen gas line you have a big issue. I would not suggest any gas additive, 10% ethanol will handle a lot of moisture/water.

As others have said, look at the wires.

Mice nests, cold for them also.

Florida is warm this time of year.

 

[niero]

Thanks for the replies, all.

I will check the wires. Thanks.

It kept trying to die when I only pressed the gas pedal a little. I'd say it ran normal when I pressed it harder.
Does that tell me anything about the issue? Would that rule out a gasline freeze?

And I am sure that I have gas. Almost a full tank. Only about 60 miles on this tank.
I agree that gas line freeze would be odd with all the additives in regular gasoline, which is why I've never put gasline antifreeze in any car. But in a way it would be nice if it was just a gasline freeze, as that could be an easier fix than having it towed to the shop.

Regarding a dirty idle air passage or control motor, is the air passage the cold air intake?
What's the control motor?


Thanks. I really hope this isn't an expensive issue, whatever it is.

 

[niero]

I'm trying to gauge how likely a gas line freeze is. Along the lines of what Donald says, is it even possible to get a gasline freeze?

I'm debating whether it's worth it to go try to find HEET gas antifreeze, or just have it towed to the shop. It's just that the Jeep is in a parking ramp (only place I could get to where I wouldn't get a parking ticket), and it's gonna be a hassle getting it out and onto the truck.

 

[NHGUY]

Dry Gas nowadays is just a profit maker...not required anymore.But tell that to the 50-80 year olds...

 

[MNgopher]

Very unlikely that it is a gas line freeze. Gas has been E10 going back into the 90's in MN, and HEET has been virtually unneeded since then.

Time to start back tracking. On the gas line side, determine if you've got the correct pressure and adequate flow. If that checks out, then no, it isn't frozen fuel lines.

On my old Cherokee with the 4.0l, the usual suspect was the CPS (Crankshaft Position Sensor). It would flake out and you would just die randomly. This is one you buy at the dealership. No idea if its any different on the Grand Cherokee, but it was possible to replace it with all my socket extensions and 1 wobble on my old Cherokee. Virtually all done by feel. Lots of fun if you don't have a heated garage to work in right now.

 

[niero]

Awesome, thanks NHGuy and MNgopher. That helps. I don't think I'll waste time with HEET. I'll just get it towed to the shop.

Thanks.

 

[Drew99GT]

Cold weather will exacerbate any and every little problem on a vehicle; been dealing with gremlins on my Toyota all winter. A sensor that's on the cusp of dyeing will still work when temps are warm, but cold kills it.

 

[jeepman3071]

I don't think it is a gas line freeze. I would say either a fuel pump or CPS. When you turn the key to on but don't try to start it do you hear the fuel pump buzz?

 

[440Magnum]

Pull the codes. 4.0's tend to eat camshaft position sensors, and it sure sounds like that might be the issue.

Other things to look for are adequate fuel pressure and error codes from other sensors like throttle position or MAP.

 

[Nick1994]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Pull the codes. 4.0's tend to eat camshaft position sensors, and it sure sounds like that might be the issue.

Other things to look for are adequate fuel pressure and error codes from other sensors like throttle position or MAP.


+1

My grandpa's Jeep Cherokee 4.0L was just doing this VERY thing, and sometimes wouldn't start and sometimes did start. It was the cam-position sensor. It's under the distributor cap, easy to replace. In the case of his Jeep the distributor shaft had lots of play, causing the rotor to chew up the cam-position sensor.

 

[niero]

Awesome, thanks for the replies, all. That's good information.

I just called the shop, and they said they drove it into the garage without a problem. Couldn't replicate the issue. They said the battery should probably be replaced, and the code they got was a Lean Running code, I believe.
I have no idea what that is.

I mentioned the camshaft position sensor, and crank sensor but they said they checked and couldn't find a problem. So hopefully it's not too spendy.


However, the battery was replaced last January, almost exactly a year ago. And before that the battery died after only a year.

So the question is, is there something that could cause batteries to go bad so quickly?

 

[Warstud]

I'm going with Bad Fuel Pump.

 

[niero]

A bad fuel pump could put heavy wear on a battery?

 

[jeepman3071]

Originally Posted By: Warstud
I'm going with Bad Fuel Pump.


x2. That would explain the code for running lean. It is probably on its way out, but still working every so often, which is why the shop was able to drive it.

 

[Rolla07]

I wouldn't replace the battery unless you know its failing. Lean code wont have to do with the battery. Id check the fuel pump like the others have said.

 

[Donald]

I would only replace the battery if it fails a load or conductive test.

Fuel pump would be next then sensors.

My 4.0 engine is a different year, but a bad crankshaft sensor caused my Jeep to loose power for maybe 1/10 of a second every once and awhile.

 

[bullwinkle]

If you have an AZ or similar that has a fuel pressure gauge set in their loan-a-tool, get it & carry it-put it on when it dies, that combined with the missing fuel pump noise will aim you in the right direction. Could be a relay or bad connection somewhere too.