In my neighborhood there are two retired pilots . One is/was an airline pilot and one flys/flew a Heuy for fire fighting. The Airline pilot has been retired for two or three years and the helo pilot is just retired this season. It was interesting what they actually said about age and loosing the mental edge of youth . They both said they probably could go longer but wanted to retire with an unclouded record.
Pilot retirement talk at the Christmas party.
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The day before a pilot retires he is at his prime. Its all hours of experience rather than hand/eye coordination.
I have read that at about age 40 pilots begin having trouble doing night landings on carriers due to night vision problems.
When pilots can no longer pass the required medicals they can still get a license to fly planes like an ultralight.
So watch out for the old geezers flying ultralights over your head.
I have read that at about age 40 pilots begin having trouble doing night landings on carriers due to night vision problems.
When pilots can no longer pass the required medicals they can still get a license to fly planes like an ultralight.
So watch out for the old geezers flying ultralights over your head.
In 1978 a Continental captain of a DC-10 on his retirement flight from LAX to Hawaii with an unblemished record just paid back the flying public for all his years as a commercial pilot. As they were taking off tires started failing and a fire started in the left main landing gear. He had not reached the point of no return and began the process of rejecting the take off. The DC-10 started to pull to the left toward a maintenance building and instead of fighting the turn he increased it and turned between the airport maintenance building and the Hertz maintenance building. He split the difference with about 20 feet of space on each wing tip and came to a safe stop. This was an amazing feat considering that from his seat he could not see either wing.
He figured this out on the fly, so to speak and saved the lives of everyone on that plane. In later years this incident was recreated on one of the new sophisticated flight simulators that are used to train and certify airline pilots in emergency procedures and the decisions this pilot made in the heat of the moment turned out to be the only solution that did result in a crash and explosion of a giant airplane loaded with passengers and completely full of fuel and cargo for the long haul to Hawaii.
He was 62 years old and the FAA considered him too old to fly anymore. I'll bet that any passengers on that flight would disagree.
He figured this out on the fly, so to speak and saved the lives of everyone on that plane. In later years this incident was recreated on one of the new sophisticated flight simulators that are used to train and certify airline pilots in emergency procedures and the decisions this pilot made in the heat of the moment turned out to be the only solution that did result in a crash and explosion of a giant airplane loaded with passengers and completely full of fuel and cargo for the long haul to Hawaii.
He was 62 years old and the FAA considered him too old to fly anymore. I'll bet that any passengers on that flight would disagree.
Originally Posted By: CT8
In my neighborhood there are two retired pilots . One is/was an airline pilot and one flys/flew a Heuy for fire fighting. The Airline pilot has been retired for two or three years and the helo pilot is just retired this season. It was interesting what they actually said about age and loosing the mental edge of youth . They both said they probably could go longer but wanted to retire with an unclouded record.
Obviously, you were talking with a couple of very self critical guys who are aware of the physical ravages of time. But my observations of pilots making serious mistakes is, most serious mistakes are not physical, but are the product of bad judgment. The "Chain of events" that cause most accidents get interrupted when a well experienced pilot recognizes the problem and addresses it. It is more important to have the correct reaction than for that reaction to be a split second faster......But possibly incorrect.
Most pilots recognize any loss of mental acuity, and make the decision to stop flying. Too bad drivers do not do the same.
In my neighborhood there are two retired pilots . One is/was an airline pilot and one flys/flew a Heuy for fire fighting. The Airline pilot has been retired for two or three years and the helo pilot is just retired this season. It was interesting what they actually said about age and loosing the mental edge of youth . They both said they probably could go longer but wanted to retire with an unclouded record.
Obviously, you were talking with a couple of very self critical guys who are aware of the physical ravages of time. But my observations of pilots making serious mistakes is, most serious mistakes are not physical, but are the product of bad judgment. The "Chain of events" that cause most accidents get interrupted when a well experienced pilot recognizes the problem and addresses it. It is more important to have the correct reaction than for that reaction to be a split second faster......But possibly incorrect.
Most pilots recognize any loss of mental acuity, and make the decision to stop flying. Too bad drivers do not do the same.
Years of sheer boredom and one instance of sheer terror and all that experience and judgement saved a lot of lives.
Originally Posted By: CT8
In my neighborhood there are two retired pilots . One is/was an airline pilot and one flys/flew a Heuy for fire fighting. The Airline pilot has been retired for two or three years and the helo pilot is just retired this season. It was interesting what they actually said about age and loosing the mental edge of youth . They both said they probably could go longer but wanted to retire with an unclouded record.
There was a LOT of talk about that surrounding the Reno air races this year. "Tiger" Destefani came back out of retirement at age 70 to fly his P-51, 'Strega,' against 20-something Steven Hinton, Jr. (who flew Strega to the Championship for Tiger a few times, but has been flying 'Voodoo' the past two years).
Given the finish of the Unlimited gold Saturday heat where Tiger came from behind and absolutely nailed a textbook diving pass at the finish line (but was DQ'd on a technicality *and* suffered engine damage), its hard to argue that pilots can't remain at the top of their game for a LONG time... but Destefani himself has been quoted as saying that he's retired for good and its largely the eyesight that's the problem. Its hard for him to see the pylons against the desert background at 500 mph anymore. As I get older myself, I notice the same thing. I just can't SEE like I used to. The experience, judgement, and skill may all be there- heck, better than ever due to experience, but the information input just isn't as good.
In my neighborhood there are two retired pilots . One is/was an airline pilot and one flys/flew a Heuy for fire fighting. The Airline pilot has been retired for two or three years and the helo pilot is just retired this season. It was interesting what they actually said about age and loosing the mental edge of youth . They both said they probably could go longer but wanted to retire with an unclouded record.
There was a LOT of talk about that surrounding the Reno air races this year. "Tiger" Destefani came back out of retirement at age 70 to fly his P-51, 'Strega,' against 20-something Steven Hinton, Jr. (who flew Strega to the Championship for Tiger a few times, but has been flying 'Voodoo' the past two years).
Given the finish of the Unlimited gold Saturday heat where Tiger came from behind and absolutely nailed a textbook diving pass at the finish line (but was DQ'd on a technicality *and* suffered engine damage), its hard to argue that pilots can't remain at the top of their game for a LONG time... but Destefani himself has been quoted as saying that he's retired for good and its largely the eyesight that's the problem. Its hard for him to see the pylons against the desert background at 500 mph anymore. As I get older myself, I notice the same thing. I just can't SEE like I used to. The experience, judgement, and skill may all be there- heck, better than ever due to experience, but the information input just isn't as good.
Originally Posted By: Donald
The day before a pilot retires he is at his prime. Its all hours of experience rather than hand/eye coordination.
I have read that at about age 40 pilots begin having trouble doing night landings on carriers due to night vision problems.
When pilots can no longer pass the required medicals they can still get a license to fly planes like an ultralight.
So watch out for the old geezers flying ultralights over your head.
OK, many good points in all the posts here, along with some half truths....
Age 60 was the retirement age to fly an airliner until 5 years ago, when it changed to age 65. The DC-10 story pilot had to have been 59. No if, ands, or buts. On his 60th birthday, he was illegal...
You can get a 1st class medical beyond age 60 ( or 65)
https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/medical_certification/faq/
But you can't fly an airliner.
Some pilots have night vision problems far younger than age 40, some have outstanding vision well past that age, but in your mid 40s, the need for reading glasses happens to just about everyone. It's called presbyopia.
(As an example, for both my Navy physical and FAA medical this summer, my distance vision neasured 20/12 in one eye, 20/15 in the other, but I started needing reading glasses 8 years ago, at 43).
I am not aware of hand/eye coordination degrading with age, though many other physical performance measures decline...but it's clear that judgement improves with experience.
I wouldn't worry about the geezer flying overhead, I would, however, worry about anyone else in an ultralight. You don't need a pilot's license to fly that thing...the geezer probably already knew how to fly and lost his medical...everyone else in one is an unlicensed risk...
The day before a pilot retires he is at his prime. Its all hours of experience rather than hand/eye coordination.
I have read that at about age 40 pilots begin having trouble doing night landings on carriers due to night vision problems.
When pilots can no longer pass the required medicals they can still get a license to fly planes like an ultralight.
So watch out for the old geezers flying ultralights over your head.
OK, many good points in all the posts here, along with some half truths....
Age 60 was the retirement age to fly an airliner until 5 years ago, when it changed to age 65. The DC-10 story pilot had to have been 59. No if, ands, or buts. On his 60th birthday, he was illegal...
You can get a 1st class medical beyond age 60 ( or 65)
https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/medical_certification/faq/
But you can't fly an airliner.
Some pilots have night vision problems far younger than age 40, some have outstanding vision well past that age, but in your mid 40s, the need for reading glasses happens to just about everyone. It's called presbyopia.
(As an example, for both my Navy physical and FAA medical this summer, my distance vision neasured 20/12 in one eye, 20/15 in the other, but I started needing reading glasses 8 years ago, at 43).
I am not aware of hand/eye coordination degrading with age, though many other physical performance measures decline...but it's clear that judgement improves with experience.
I wouldn't worry about the geezer flying overhead, I would, however, worry about anyone else in an ultralight. You don't need a pilot's license to fly that thing...the geezer probably already knew how to fly and lost his medical...everyone else in one is an unlicensed risk...
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Originally Posted By: OneEyeJack
In 1978 a Continental captain of a DC-10 on his retirement flight from LAX to Hawaii with an unblemished record just paid back the flying public for all his years as a commercial pilot. As they were taking off tires started failing and a fire started in the left main landing gear. He had not reached the point of no return and began the process of rejecting the take off. The DC-10 started to pull to the left toward a maintenance building and instead of fighting the turn he increased it and turned between the airport maintenance building and the Hertz maintenance building. He split the difference with about 20 feet of space on each wing tip and came to a safe stop. This was an amazing feat considering that from his seat he could not see either wing.
He figured this out on the fly, so to speak and saved the lives of everyone on that plane. In later years this incident was recreated on one of the new sophisticated flight simulators that are used to train and certify airline pilots in emergency procedures and the decisions this pilot made in the heat of the moment turned out to be the only solution that did result in a crash and explosion of a giant airplane loaded with passengers and completely full of fuel and cargo for the long haul to Hawaii.
He was 62 years old and the FAA considered him too old to fly anymore. I'll bet that any passengers on that flight would disagree.
Not true. The Captain was 59 years old and the aircraft stayed within the runway environment. The landing gear collapsed because the Captain didn't keep the aircraft on the runway the entire time. 2 people were killed in the resulting fire. I'm not blaming the Captain, but when you abort a takeoff, you need to keep it on the runway if at all possible. If I depart the side of the runway during a rejected takeoff, I failed that checkride.
Please read the accident report for what the NTSB had filed concerning this accident: the flight above ended up quite differently then depicted above. Here's a copy of the NTSB report that describes what really happened:
http://www.airdisaster.com/reports/ntsb/AAR79-01.pdf
Although it sounds like a great story, the aircraft ended up at the departure end of the runway between the approach lights. Flight Simulators in the 70's were quite rudimentary with poor visual systems, and even worse motion systems. Flight simulators also did not have access to accurate flight test data with respect to ground handling characteristics with contaminants like water, snow, wet rubber residue, painted runway surfaces, etc. In short, going into a simulator would be fine for rejected takeoff practice, but in those days simulators could only be used up to a certain point during initial training then an aircraft was used for a final checkride and type rating before flying the aircraft with passengers on a revenue flight.
The simulator fidelity is so accurate today that when we check out on a new aircraft, the first time we fly the airplane is with passengers on board.
Hope the information helps,
757Guy
In 1978 a Continental captain of a DC-10 on his retirement flight from LAX to Hawaii with an unblemished record just paid back the flying public for all his years as a commercial pilot. As they were taking off tires started failing and a fire started in the left main landing gear. He had not reached the point of no return and began the process of rejecting the take off. The DC-10 started to pull to the left toward a maintenance building and instead of fighting the turn he increased it and turned between the airport maintenance building and the Hertz maintenance building. He split the difference with about 20 feet of space on each wing tip and came to a safe stop. This was an amazing feat considering that from his seat he could not see either wing.
He figured this out on the fly, so to speak and saved the lives of everyone on that plane. In later years this incident was recreated on one of the new sophisticated flight simulators that are used to train and certify airline pilots in emergency procedures and the decisions this pilot made in the heat of the moment turned out to be the only solution that did result in a crash and explosion of a giant airplane loaded with passengers and completely full of fuel and cargo for the long haul to Hawaii.
He was 62 years old and the FAA considered him too old to fly anymore. I'll bet that any passengers on that flight would disagree.
Not true. The Captain was 59 years old and the aircraft stayed within the runway environment. The landing gear collapsed because the Captain didn't keep the aircraft on the runway the entire time. 2 people were killed in the resulting fire. I'm not blaming the Captain, but when you abort a takeoff, you need to keep it on the runway if at all possible. If I depart the side of the runway during a rejected takeoff, I failed that checkride.
Please read the accident report for what the NTSB had filed concerning this accident: the flight above ended up quite differently then depicted above. Here's a copy of the NTSB report that describes what really happened:
http://www.airdisaster.com/reports/ntsb/AAR79-01.pdf
Although it sounds like a great story, the aircraft ended up at the departure end of the runway between the approach lights. Flight Simulators in the 70's were quite rudimentary with poor visual systems, and even worse motion systems. Flight simulators also did not have access to accurate flight test data with respect to ground handling characteristics with contaminants like water, snow, wet rubber residue, painted runway surfaces, etc. In short, going into a simulator would be fine for rejected takeoff practice, but in those days simulators could only be used up to a certain point during initial training then an aircraft was used for a final checkride and type rating before flying the aircraft with passengers on a revenue flight.
The simulator fidelity is so accurate today that when we check out on a new aircraft, the first time we fly the airplane is with passengers on board.
Hope the information helps,
757Guy
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I'm 51, a pilot and aircraft owner. I am far more capable now then when I was young. Experience counts. However the physical degradation is starting to show up. Good thing flying does not require extreme physical strength (most of the time) I'm at the gym daily, in a valiant attempt at retaining strength and flexibility.
I wouldn't trust my self flying a paper airplane but at 51 I was a stud muffin and now at 61 no matter how I try to stay in shape [exercise eat healthy take supplements etc] I am really crashing!!! Seen you plane in postings it is quite a jewel IMHO!
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