Oils that dont burn in a healthy 5.4L Triton?

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Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
There is more to this than just a myth and I think that Ford might know a thing or two about their engines since they designed them--a 50 grade oil is not for that engine and nothing heavier than a 20 grade is needed--wanted or desired is something else entirely.

There is nothing more to that myth, its just that and nothing more or less. Obviously they designed that engine to run on more than on one grade of oil. Proof? Ford GT500 5.4L specs 5w-50.
In the US CAFE is in the mix not so with other countries where it is NOT spec oil.

So it would seem the 5.4 modular can run on anything from 5w20 to 5w50 and anything in between.

I see you are running 0w20. Does your owners manual spec 0w20? What happened to specs or is that just for other people?
 
Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
There is more to this than just a myth and I think that Ford might know a thing or two about their engines since they designed them--a 50 grade oil is not for that engine and nothing heavier than a 20 grade is needed--wanted or desired is something else entirely.

There is nothing more to that myth, its just that and nothing more or less. Obviously they designed that engine to run on more than on one grade of oil. Proof? Ford GT500 5.4L specs 5w-50.
In the US CAFE is in the mix not so with other countries where it is NOT spec oil.

So it would seem the 5.4 modular can run on anything from 5w20 to 5w50 and anything in between.

I see you are running 0w20. Does your owners manual allow for 0w20? What happened to specs?

The 5.4L in the GT 500 is not exactly the same as the one in my FX4. The Mustang is DOHC and is supercharged. It DEFINITELY will not be ran the same and current Mustangs have different viscosities depending on the usage--no shocker there. The 0W-20 that I am running absolutely meets the Ford specification (WSS-M2C930–A) for my 5.4L so nothing happened to the specs--and they are not just for other people; check your facts.
 
Does the owners manual say 0w20 or 5w20? I would bet it has nothing about 0w20 in there.
The GT 500 is still a 5.4 modular. Check your facts.
 
The 03-04 supercharged 4.6 in the terminator mustangs called for a 5w-20. The gt-500 has the same supercharger but bolted to 5.4,like the raptor,yet it specifies a 5w-50.
So even though the termi is boosted it still calls for a 20 grade.
Now as far as vvt goes I cannot say for sure how the ford version is affected as far as oil goes however I'm pretty experienced with the dodge version and I can say without a doubt everything works just fine with a 0w-40 in the sump.
Now unless it's a race engine or a motorcycle why would anyone use a 15w-50 in an engine that specifies a 20 grade.
Kinda dumb.
As far as the whole vvt thing goes I'm pretty sure a 5w-20 cold is a whole lot thicker than a 40 grade hot,yet these systems seem to operate fine with cold oil so common sense tells me that hot oil,even a grade or 2 thicker should be fine too.
I can believe a cold 15w-50 woukd slow down the operation of the vvt though until the oil got hot,so perhaps that's what fx is noticing.
Regardless fx has many used oil analysis that prove a mod motor will run and wear just fine with a 20 grade so truth be told why go thicker.
Unless the engine will experience above average oil temps for a considerable amount of time why bother.
For me to go thicker I'd need a reason,and even then FX's data proves its not required.
And engines of today,and yesteryear can function on a range of oil grades,but only one grade is optimal,and that wholly depends on how it's operated and the ambient conditions.
So if I was out in the desert I'd go thicker. Here in saskatchewan thinner is better.

There are no hard and fast rules when it comes to engine oil,so make a choice based on each case taking in to consideration ambient and how it will be operated.
And a 15w-50 is retarded in a mod motor unless there's a reason for it.
 
Originally Posted By: Trav
Does the owners manual say 0w20 or 5w20? I would bet it has nothing about 0w20 in there.
The GT 500 is still a 5.4 modular. Check your facts.
It says oil that meets WSS-M2C930–A and API certification mark. M1 AFE 0W-20 and M1EP 0W-20 meets that all day. The actual Ford specification for an engine that requires 0W-20 is WSS-M2C947-A (which is not on any of the M1 AFE or M1EP bottles that I have as shown below).

I understand they are both modulars, however, we were discussing VCT and thick oils. The GT-500 engine does not have the same upper end as my 5.4L--does it even have VCT? Additionally, though they are modulars, I would hazard a guess that being supercharged none of the clearances are the same and certainly the load on the engine is vastly different thereby requiring a thicker oil.

My facts are checked...


M1EP 0W-20:

JZXP6h.jpg



M1 AFE 0W-20:


WmVOk7.jpg
 
Originally Posted By: 2012AccentSE
I just got my new (to me) 2008 F150 King Ranch. I went on a 1000 mile road trip to AZ to buy an atv with my cousin. The truck burned a 16th to 8th of a qt at 75-90 mph. Some wot runs were in there too. Truck currently has Castrol 5w30 that the dealer used when they prepped the truck for delivery. I have 62,000 miles and the dipstick and oil are still very clean. Truck has been serviced regularly by the previous, and ONLY owner.

Recommendations for an oil that doesn't burn easily, especially in these 5.4's?

thanks!


Thought you said the 5.4 burns oil? Many would be thankful for your results.
 
Yes VCT is used on many of the high HP modular 5.4 Australia has a couple that spec much thicker oils. The older GT500 was an iron block engine.
Anyway to my point. You are showing a bottle of Mobil 1 0w20 but going by the book Ford specs a 5w20 not a 0w20. WSS-M2C930–A is a energy conserving oil 5w20 Mobil claims their oil meets so you are saying you trust Mobil knows more than Ford and they built the engine. Post the page out of your owners manual.
See where this is going? You don't follow the book yourself. You stray away from the manual yourself because Mobil says so but call others out for doing so.

Ford mentions nothing about 0w20 in their owners manual. They did publish this "We strongly promote 5w20 for ALL their customers. They left out "except those in any other country in the world other than the NA".

http://www.ecopoweroil.com/files/ford_fuel_recommendations_8_25_05.pdf

You also told the OP to go 15-17K OCI. What does Ford have to say about that or is that Mobil's or someone on the boards recommendation also?
Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
I would run M1 AFE or EP (whichever is available) in 0W-20 for 15-17K OCIs with a Fram Ultra oil filter on it.


Originally Posted By: FoMoCo
Typical driving habits

In general, Ford Motor Company recommends the following oil change schedule:

2008 and newer model-year vehicles: every 7,500 miles or every six months, whichever comes first

- See more at: http://support.ford.com/maintenance/when-to-change-oil#sthash.eM2KVRRc.dpuf
 
No, Ford doesn't spec a 5W-20. They "spec" a specification, which the 0W-20 meets.

You aren't really going to try and make the argument that a 0W-XX that meets the Ford spec is unsuitable for the engine, but a 5W-XX is suitable, are you?

Originally Posted By: Trav
Yes VCT is used on many of the high HP modular 5.4 Australia has a couple that spec much thicker oils. The older GT500 was an iron block engine.
Anyway to my point. You are showing a bottle of Mobil 1 0w20 but going by the book Ford specs a 5w20 not a 0w20. WSS-M2C930–A is a energy conserving oil 5w20 Mobil claims their oil meets so you are saying you trust Mobil knows more than Ford and they built the engine. Post the page out of your owners manual.
See where this is going? You don't follow the book yourself. You stray away from the manual yourself because Mobil says so but call others out for doing so.

Ford mentions nothing about 0w20 in their owners manual. They did publish this "We strongly promote 5w20 for ALL their customers. They left out "except those in any other country in the world other than the NA".

http://www.ecopoweroil.com/files/ford_fuel_recommendations_8_25_05.pdf

You also told the OP to go 15-17K OCI. What does Ford have to say about that or is that Mobil's or someone on the boards recommendation also?
 
Originally Posted By: Trav
Yes VCT is used on many of the high HP modular 5.4 Australia has a couple that spec much thicker oils. The older GT500 was an iron block engine.
Anyway to my point. You are showing a bottle of Mobil 1 0w20 but going by the book Ford specs a 5w20 not a 0w20. WSS-M2C930–A is a energy conserving oil 5w20 Mobil claims their oil meets so you are saying you trust Mobil knows more than Ford and they built the engine. Post the page out of your owners manual.
See where this is going? You don't follow the book yourself. You stray away from the manual yourself because Mobil says so but call others out for doing so.

Ford mentions nothing about 0w20 in their owners manual. They did publish this "We strongly promote 5w20 for ALL their customers. They left out "except those in any other country in the world other than the NA".

http://www.ecopoweroil.com/files/ford_fuel_recommendations_8_25_05.pdf

You also told the OP to go 15-17K OCI. What does Ford have to say about that or is that Mobil's or someone on the boards recommendation also?
Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
I would run M1 AFE or EP (whichever is available) in 0W-20 for 15-17K OCIs with a Fram Ultra oil filter on it.


Originally Posted By: FoMoCo
Typical driving habits

In general, Ford Motor Company recommends the following oil change schedule:

2008 and newer model-year vehicles: every 7,500 miles or every six months, whichever comes first

- See more at: http://support.ford.com/maintenance/when-to-change-oil#sthash.eM2KVRRc.dpuf

Since the oil I am using meets the Ford specification, I do not see how I am "straying" in the slightest. If you do, then fair enough, that is your choice to do view it in such a manner. I stated to go for a 15K-17K OCI on a 2008 vehicle because it is no longer under warranty and using a synthetic for such a short OCI (7,500) is a waste. I remained within the 7,500 mile OCI while I was in warranty (even using Pennzoil Ultra for only 7,500 miles), and then began to extend past that based upon science and data. I can say this because I have the data to back it up. I have UOA'ed every fluid change in my FX4 since its birth--ALL of them including axles, transmission, power steering, and transfer case and I believe the data speaks for itself.

I am also not using an Australian engine as a comparison. Do the US GT 500 engines have VCT or not? I do not know, but I do know they are DOHC and supercharged and my 5.4L is not--therefore I do not see this as an apples to apples comparison of engines, but that is my choice to view it in such a manner.

In any event, I believe that this is becoming OT from the OP's questions and I have no intention to hijack his thread with our bantering.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Quote:
GT500, Boss, GT 5.4L Supercharged 4V Ti-VCT V-8 Engine

Just because your engine is doing okay with that kind of OCI is meaningless to the OP and IMHO does not merit a recommendation he do the same.

We can go into this another time but as you say its a bit of a highjack of the OP's thread.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Trav
Quote:
GT500, Boss, GT 5.4L Supercharged 4V Ti-VCT V-8 Engine

Just because your engine is doing okay with that kind of OCI is meaningless to the OP and IMHO does not merit a recommendation he do the same.
Not really since M1EP is rated for 15K? I did not do it blindly and he should not either, but it is quite doable especially with the highway miles that he stated he is doing.

Originally Posted By: Trav
We can go into this another time but as you say its a bit of a highjack of the OP's thread.
Touche
11.gif
 
Trav/2010_FX4: I agree with both of you in that the VCT simply cannot be affected given the massive effect temperature alone has on viscosity (touching on Trav's point) and that the spec from Ford (WSS-xxx) is all that is required in this application and is met by both a 5w-20 and a number of 0w-20 lubricants, the most notable and widely available being the Mobil 1 AFE 0w-20 product.

Since the 3V was a xW-20 spec engine from the get-go (unlike its 2V sibling) I would not be concerned about running a 0w-20/5w-20 in it, just like I do in our Charger. But I have no doubt it would be fine on the oil grades spec'd for it elsewhere in the world like an xw-30. They just aren't necessary for it.

That said, if it has consumption issues, there is no harm in stepping up a grade or so and see if it helps
smile.gif
 
Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
There is more to this than just a myth and I think that Ford might know a thing or two about their engines since they designed them--a 50 grade oil is not for that engine and nothing heavier than a 20 grade is needed--wanted or desired is something else entirely.

There is nothing more to that myth, its just that and nothing more or less. Obviously they designed that engine to run on more than on one grade of oil. Proof? Ford GT500 5.4L specs 5w-50.
In the US CAFE is in the mix not so with other countries where it is NOT spec oil.

So it would seem the 5.4 modular can run on anything from 5w20 to 5w50 and anything in between.

I see you are running 0w20. Does your owners manual allow for 0w20? What happened to specs?

The 5.4L in the GT 500 is not exactly the same as the one in my FX4. The Mustang is DOHC and is supercharged. It DEFINITELY will not be ran the same and current Mustangs have different viscosities depending on the usage--no shocker there. The 0W-20 that I am running absolutely meets the Ford specification (WSS-M2C930–A) for my 5.4L so nothing happened to the specs--and they are not just for other people; check your facts.


All GT500s use the 3V oil pump (highest volume 4.6/5.4 pump) and the 2007-2010 GT500s share main clearance specs with the 5.4 3V. The ONLY reason the GT500 gets a 5W-50 spec is based on Ford's projected usage profile, just like 2011-up Mustang GT 5.0 (Track Pack) and 2012/13 Boss 302. There is nothing inherent to the 5.4 3V that makes it less tolerant of thicker oil than other Modulars, the VCT works just fine with 30 & 40 weights.
 
Even though a heated discussion came about, I'm learning a lot about these trucks and their motors. I think Im going to try the MC/MC combo for the next run and see how it does. I know a few of you said there is no issue with a little burning, but I'm so used to not having ANY oil burn off....So for me, at least, I can be doing a little better.
smile.gif
 
My son and I poured in M1 0W-40 into his 08 5.4L 3V FX4 2 years ago when he left for college...

We change it every 7K miles... With either a M/C FL820S filter or Fram Ultra XG2!

He makes 5 to 6 trips back home a year...238 mile round trip...

The 5.4L 3V now has 198K miles on her and runs awesome... Between 7K mile OCI he has only had to add oil one time...it was just barely low on the dipstick...

As far as I can tell by how smooth the 5.4L 3V Run/Idles/Sounds M1 0W-40 has not caused any issues as of to date... Awesome Oil! Awesome Engine! Like stated above-->It does not create a lot of HP or Torque but is Very Durable & Dependable if taken care of...
 
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