ODO fraud. What would you do about it?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Originally Posted By: jrmason
If your absolutely certain he is committing fraud, put him on blast on Craigslist. List his ad number, car info and VIN, contact info, etc to make other potential buyers beware. Not only could it save someone from getting scammed, but will put people on the lookout for him in the future. Just make sure you have your info right, because falsely accusing someone of a crime just makes for another victim.


I bought a stolen car on CL once. VIN was upside-down on the car.

Posted it on Craigslist... received threat from dealer to remove it.

They were dead wrong... bill of sale, no title... broken ignition..

Mount Vernon, Ohio. Snyder's Auto Sales.

They are now on blast.
 
It's actually quite a challenge to modify the odometer reader on many modern cars.

BMW uses a typical European system. It records the mileage in at least three internal modules, and updates them each time the car is turned off. It also records the mileage in the key -- it reads the key transponder memory, checks the old value is the lower than the current odometer, and updates the key with the new odometer value.

It's still possible to roll back the miles, but it requires access to multiple circuit boards, sometimes even soldering wires to the pins of surface mount parts. And only some key transponders can have their mileage field cleared, requiring new transponder keys ($$).
 
Or just access to a wrecked version of the same car to pull parts from. Presto! That E-class with 220,000 miles now has 75K!
 
Originally Posted By: djb
It's actually quite a challenge to modify the odometer reader on many modern cars.

BMW uses a typical European system. It records the mileage in at least three internal modules, and updates them each time the car is turned off. It also records the mileage in the key -- it reads the key transponder memory, checks the old value is the lower than the current odometer, and updates the key with the new odometer value.

It's still possible to roll back the miles, but it requires access to multiple circuit boards, sometimes even soldering wires to the pins of surface mount parts. And only some key transponders can have their mileage field cleared, requiring new transponder keys ($$).



Also, are the mileage and the VIN not recorded in the ECM? In that case, anyone plugging in a scan tool will see the mileage and VIN. This makes it hard to change either the odometer or the ECM.
 
I'm talking about toyota here. The ODO miles are coded on EEPROM in gauge cluster and not ECM. All it takes is to switch a cluster or rewrite the EEPROM. I've seen 3 instances of ODO fraud so far on cars listed on Craigslist.

My car shopping is over, I got cheap 2003 Saturn Ion on auction. This is for my teenage son. That should teach him some car maintenance.

Yes, I will flag those postings.
 
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.
 
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.

Interesting philosophy... I'm sure some would panic at the thought of mileage being an arbitrary number, but I agree with you wholeheartedly.
 
Originally Posted By: leeharvey418
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.

Interesting philosophy... I'm sure some would panic at the thought of mileage being an arbitrary number, but I agree with you wholeheartedly.


I only do this because of my own experiences buying cars. A 3 year old Renault Clio with 24000 miles, bought as an approved used car from a main dealership. Nothing but problems, I did more miles in their courtesy cars than I drove in my own!
1986 vw golf with 210,000 never needed anything except fuel, passed its yearly road worthiness inspection without so much as an advisory notice.
A friends Benz with a damaged instrument cluster, the one we pulled out was showing 65 ish thousand miles, replaced it with a working cluster showing 190 ish thousand.

I like the analogy of people, and their age and fitness.
You can have an obese 18 year old with high blood pressure and diabetes, at the same time you can have a fighting fit 60 year old who eats right and exercises.

That's why, in my own little world, mileage is an arbitrary number at does not factor in to wether i should buy the car or not.
 
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.


I junked a 20-year old truck with rusty frame and dodgy welds I had performed. I could have sold it for a couple hundred bucks more but opted not to in a rare smidgen of concern for my fellow man.

Junkyard employee took it home and was trying to sell it on craigslist. I literally discovered it surfing for something else.
cool.gif


If I had a car with rolled back odo, I could get sued as being part of its chain of custody years later, when least expecting it, even if I didn't know. A good reason to pay lip service to avoiding such a thing.
 
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.


that's all good, but we are talking about fraud to inflate the car value at sale.
 
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.


So...you'd buy a car with 300,000 miles, then?
 
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.


that's all good, but we are talking about fraud to inflate the car value at sale.


Thats all good too, but the value of the vehicle at point t of sale should be determined by its.condition.
Too bad not everybody can think critically and/or use bitog.
 
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.


So...you'd buy a car with 300,000 miles, then?


If it was the right makes and model, at the right price and in the right condition, id buy it without needing to know the mileage.

Cars get.to a point where things start to fail. A few years later, everything perishable has been replaced.(or the car has been scrapped).
Also, you can learn a lot more about a car by lifting the bonnet and crawling round underneath it than you ever could by asking.g how many miles are on it..

All of the above is my opinion, and it workshop just fine for me in my own little world. If the seller wont let me do a thorough inspection before.I buy, he's probably hiding something.
 
Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.


I junked a 20-year old truck with rusty frame and dodgy welds I had performed. I could have sold it for a couple hundred bucks more but opted not to in a rare smidgen of concern for my fellow man.

Junkyard employee took it home and was trying to sell it on craigslist. I literally discovered it surfing for something else.
cool.gif


If I had a car with rolled back odo, I could get sued as being part of its chain of custody years later, when least expecting it, even if I didn't know. A good reason to pay lip service to avoiding such a thing.


In a way this kind of correlates with my view - you didn't get rid of it due to mileage, you got.rid.of.it due to condition. Would you have kept it if it only had 5k miles?! No way, it'd still be a death trap!

Condition is king
wink.gif
 
Condition is king, but so many problems are predictable by age and/or miles. Most buyers don't want to do anything on a "new" car purchase. Gas and drive.

Taking into account possible repairs it often seems wiser to buy newer and not run the risk.
 
Originally Posted By: Olas
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.


So...you'd buy a car with 300,000 miles, then?


If it was the right makes and model, at the right price and in the right condition, id buy it without needing to know the mileage.

Cars get.to a point where things start to fail. A few years later, everything perishable has been replaced.(or the car has been scrapped).
Also, you can learn a lot more about a car by lifting the bonnet and crawling round underneath it than you ever could by asking.g how many miles are on it..

All of the above is my opinion, and it workshop just fine for me in my own little world. If the seller wont let me do a thorough inspection before.I buy, he's probably hiding something.


So...you'd PAY the same for a car with 300k and one with 80k?
 
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: Olas
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: Olas
It doesn't matter what the mileage is on the car, or what mleage is reported on the odo, it's just a number.
You buy the car on condition, not a magic number on the dash oard.


So...you'd buy a car with 300,000 miles, then?


If it was the right makes and model, at the right price and in the right condition, id buy it without needing to know the mileage.

Cars get.to a point where things start to fail. A few years later, everything perishable has been replaced.(or the car has been scrapped).
Also, you can learn a lot more about a car by lifting the bonnet and crawling round underneath it than you ever could by asking.g how many miles are on it..

All of the above is my opinion, and it workshop just fine for me in my own little world. If the seller wont let me do a thorough inspection before.I buy, he's probably hiding something.


So...you'd PAY the same for a car with 300k and one with 80k?


Jarlaxe, I DO get what he is saying... Mileage does not tell the whole story.

Though everyone thinks it does, and usually uses it as a criterion.

Which makes me laugh, because if that car had 101,000 miles and you searched for 100k, but it was perfect car...

No. No longer believing validity of SOLELY mileage.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

A
Flickering dash at idle, did not start after I shut it off, battery voltage 12.7 when off. Is alternator fine?
Replies
13
Views
1K
mk378
W
2008 Toyota Yaris M/T - Good deal or money pit?
2 3
Replies
41
Views
4K
02zx9r rev2
M
  • Locked
4Runner Odometer Rollback
2
Replies
30
Views
5K
JustinH
CarbonSteel
2019 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rental
2 3
Replies
54
Views
5K
Srt20
N
  • Locked
VW Corrado, What is it worth? $$
2
Replies
33
Views
16K
paulbuss
Back
Top