Large SUV's

[DBMaster]

I heard on KRLD this morning that the GM plant in Arlington is working extra shifts and overtime to crank out full size SUV's. Sales have picked up with the drop in gas prices. One of the vehicles they build there is the Cadillac Escalade.

Alas, human beings are incapable of learning from their mistakes. I'm sure gas will NEVER go back up in price, right?

 

[bepperb]

That might be true, but a lot of their large truck capacity was lost when they closed the Janesville plant in WI. So even if they are doing extra shifts there it's still way less production than a decade ago.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Not surprising.

Good time to buy a Mirage, though!

 

[John_K]

Originally Posted By: DBMaster
I heard on KRLD this morning that the GM plant in Arlington is working extra shifts and overtime to crank out full size SUV's. Sales have picked up with the drop in gas prices. One of the vehicles they build there is the Cadillac Escalade.

Alas, human beings are incapable of learning from their mistakes. I'm sure gas will NEVER go back up in price, right?


People never learn. Like Colbert said last night "gas is down for a week so sign me up for a 5 year lease on a land barge with the aerodynamics of a brick!"

John

 

[SilverC6]

My wife would probably like a new Escalade.

And I believe I received a $4,000 off coupon the other day from Cadillac.

The solution to the problem is to have more vehicles.

Own gas guzzling large/powerful vehicles for when you "need" them.

Then have a miserly fuel sipping car or two for when just getting there is the goal.

Then you can use the money you save on gasoline to offset the additional insurance and car payment costs you incur.

 

[bepperb]

Because if I'm buying a 90,000 dollar Cadillac Escalade I care if it's going to cost me 1800 or 2200 a year in gas?

If these vehicles are selling more than normal I'm sure it has much more to do with low interest rates and high stock prices. I'm sure increasing consumer confidence also has much more to do with these sales than gas prices.

And to be honest Car and Driver's last test had the Expedition an Tahoe getting 16 and 17mpg. That's about half the mileage of a car, but in a vehicle with much more capability. With what you give up for something like Prius with handling, performance, towing, occupant capacity, offroad/inclement weather use one would think you'd be getting 200 mpg, not double. To be honest our Sienna gets about 22~24mpg. If it had all wheel drive it wouldn't be much better, perhaps 10~20% better than these.

 

[Astro14]

Originally Posted By: John_K
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
I heard on KRLD this morning that the GM plant in Arlington is working extra shifts and overtime to crank out full size SUV's. Sales have picked up with the drop in gas prices. One of the vehicles they build there is the Cadillac Escalade.

Alas, human beings are incapable of learning from their mistakes. I'm sure gas will NEVER go back up in price, right?


People never learn. Like Colbert said last night "gas is down for a week so sign me up for a 5 year lease on a land barge with the aerodynamics of a brick!"

John


It's not that simple. Not everyone has gasoline cost at the top of their vehicle choice parameters. For example, I bought an aerodynamic, but very thirsty, twin-turbo V-12 when gas was $4.00/gallon.

Hint: there were considerations that were more important to me than gas mileage.

 

[dishdude]

They did just redesign this platform for 2015, so I am sure that is contributing to the demand. The Escalade is really sharp.

 

[cpayne5]

Originally Posted By: SilverC6
My wife would probably like a new Escalade.

And I believe I received a $4,000 off coupon the other day from Cadillac.

The solution to the problem is to have more vehicles.

Own gas guzzling large/powerful vehicles for when you "need" them.

Then have a miserly fuel sipping car or two for when just getting there is the goal.

Then you can use the money you save on gasoline to offset the additional insurance and car payment costs you incur.



Amen!

 

[exranger06]

Originally Posted By: Astro14
Originally Posted By: John_K
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
I heard on KRLD this morning that the GM plant in Arlington is working extra shifts and overtime to crank out full size SUV's. Sales have picked up with the drop in gas prices. One of the vehicles they build there is the Cadillac Escalade.

Alas, human beings are incapable of learning from their mistakes. I'm sure gas will NEVER go back up in price, right?


People never learn. Like Colbert said last night "gas is down for a week so sign me up for a 5 year lease on a land barge with the aerodynamics of a brick!"

John


It's not that simple. Not everyone has gasoline cost at the top of their vehicle choice parameters.

The fact that sales of these vehicles go way up when gas prices go down, and the exact opposite when gas prices go up, show that most people DO have gasoline cost as one of the top priorities.

 

[John_K]

Originally Posted By: exranger06
Originally Posted By: Astro14
Originally Posted By: John_K
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
I heard on KRLD this morning that the GM plant in Arlington is working extra shifts and overtime to crank out full size SUV's. Sales have picked up with the drop in gas prices. One of the vehicles they build there is the Cadillac Escalade.

Alas, human beings are incapable of learning from their mistakes. I'm sure gas will NEVER go back up in price, right?


People never learn. Like Colbert said last night "gas is down for a week so sign me up for a 5 year lease on a land barge with the aerodynamics of a brick!"

John


It's not that simple. Not everyone has gasoline cost at the top of their vehicle choice parameters.

The fact that sales of these vehicles go way up when gas prices go down, and the exact opposite when gas prices go up, show that most people DO have gasoline cost as one of the top priorities.


DING! DING! DING! We have a winner!

 

[earlyre]

Originally Posted By: SilverC6
My wife would probably like a new Escalade.

And I believe I received a $4,000 off coupon the other day from Cadillac.

The solution to the problem is to have more vehicles.

Own gas guzzling large/powerful vehicles for when you "need" them.

Then have a miserly fuel sipping car or two for when just getting there is the goal.

Then you can use the money you save on gasoline to offset the additional insurance and car payment costs you incur.





I agree with you , and wish my brother could get this lesson right, but of his current 4 cars, he has triple repeat on the 2 door rwd v8 sports car category.
his Current Stable:
1998 Mustang GT 5 speed manual(14,500mi) - has IRS rear end from a 99 Cobra waiting to go in it.
2006 Mustang GT Auto,roughly 70k mi, with Ford racing CAI and Tune, was his DD Jan 2010-Aug 2013
2007 Dodge Dakota SLT quad cab 4x4[/u], HO 4.7l V8 - Driven very sparingly, only when he needs to tow/haul things, or when he has out of town visitors (his only 4 door)
2013 Dodge Challenger R/T Blacktop 5.7lHemi w/MDS, and 5 speed auto.(Current DD)

 

[MalfunctionProne]

Originally Posted By: John_K
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
I heard on KRLD this morning that the GM plant in Arlington is working extra shifts and overtime to crank out full size SUV's. Sales have picked up with the drop in gas prices. One of the vehicles they build there is the Cadillac Escalade.

Alas, human beings are incapable of learning from their mistakes. I'm sure gas will NEVER go back up in price, right?


People never learn. Like Colbert said last night "gas is down for a week so sign me up for a 5 year lease on a land barge with the aerodynamics of a brick!"

John


Remember, gas is "supposed" to cost $7/gal. US DOT said so.. as the "correct" price for gas. I forgot to laugh.

The staristics on Escalades prove the above, that most people dont care HOW much gas costs.. they will pay it.

I tried getting a gas saver car and they stole it so.. I may get something else, too. Though, interestingly, Escalade is the most stolen SUV. I did not know cars could still be stole n. Apparently, the technology matters not.. how hard is it.

It is like the saying: People don't want to eat, they want to smoke.

 

[bepperb]

Originally Posted By: exranger06

The fact that sales of these vehicles go way up when gas prices go down, and the exact opposite when gas prices go up, show that most people DO have gasoline cost as one of the top priorities.


Is that a fact? Where did that come from? I'd be interested since the reality is the exact opposite. Here's something you might read that really is a fact (you know, ones you can reference back to a reliable source):

As gas crept from around 1 dollar to 2.50 during the late 90's early 00's the sales actually increased as did the stock market:

Yukon/Tahoe sales per year

1998[ 182,590
1999 175,493
2000 206,131
2001 279,573
2002 286,255
2003 285,303
2004 272,732
2005 225,765
2006 232,967
2007 209,687
2008 130,642
2009 102,665
2010 104,456
2011 114,777
2012 96,722
2013 111,804

In the cheapest year of gas prices in the last 10 years (2009) sales of the BOF GM vehicles were the lowest they had ever been. If you wanted to make a fact about this one might say the sales of these vehicles rises as gas prices rise, both a result of the economy as a whole.

Sorry if my facts of vehicle sales and gas prices get in the way of anyone's made up ideas about this topic.

 

[MalfunctionProne]

Originally Posted By: bepperb
Originally Posted By: exranger06

The fact that sales of these vehicles go way up when gas prices go down, and the exact opposite when gas prices go up, show that most people DO have gasoline cost as one of the top priorities.


Is that a fact? Where did that come from? I'd be interested since the reality is the exact opposite. Here's something you might read that really is a fact (you know, ones you can reference back to a reliable source):

As gas crept from around 1 dollar to 2.50 during the late 90's early 00's the sales actually increased as did the stock market:

Yukon/Tahoe sales per year

1998[ 182,590
1999 175,493
2000 206,131
2001 279,573
2002 286,255
2003 285,303
2004 272,732
2005 225,765
2006 232,967
2007 209,687
2008 130,642
2009 102,665
2010 104,456
2011 114,777
2012 96,722
2013 111,804

In the cheapest year of gas prices in the last 10 years (2009) sales of the BOF GM vehicles were the lowest they had ever been. If you wanted to make a fact about this one might say the sales of these vehicles rises as gas prices rise, both a result of the economy as a whole.

Sorry if my facts of vehicle sales and gas prices get in the way of anyone's made up ideas about this topic.


Not only that, but check out resale values on land yachts:

Durango
Envoy XL
Expedition
Trailblazer LTZ
Excursion
Hummer (*discontinued.. hmm, wonder why.)
Suburban
Tahoe
Denali
Yukon
Yukon XL
Sequoia
Land Cruiser
GX470
LX470
GL450
Q7

Etc.

Some large SUV have value so abysmal, you might as well keep it.

 

[surfstar]

So, because ALL vehicle sales were down during the recession, along with oil/gas prices, that means the above assumptions don't hold true?

What about 2014? The economy hasn't had a boom since last year, yet
http://autos.jdpower.com/content/blog-po...d-suv-sales.htm
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/02/business/Automakers-sales-rise-led-by-SUVs-and-trucks.html?_r=0
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/04/business/automakers-report-us-sales-for-october-2014.html

oil/gas down, truck sales up.


Never underestimate the idiocy of the American consumer.

 

[Hokiefyd]

Originally Posted By: bepperb
In the cheapest year of gas prices in the last 10 years (2009) sales of the BOF GM vehicles were the lowest they had ever been.


It's also true that the first year when fuel prices generally started becoming alarming to many (2008), the Tahoe/Yukon sales saw nearly a 50% drop...and since fuel costs have generally been high since...or at least at the front of consumers' minds, sales numbers of these vehicles have never recovered to the very consistent 200,000+ annual numbers they enjoyed prior to 2008. At the same time, however, the economy was also poor.

There's a correlation here, but I'm not sure that A necessarily causes B.

One fact we know for certain...truck sales sure are strong lately.

 

[bepperb]

Sorry, you're not going to sway me. The numbers speak for themselves. If you want to pick a 6 month window and some arbitrary values like "and economic boom" that's fine, I won't argue those. If you care enough to use excel to map sales, gas prices and consumer confidence it will be obvious that
large SUV sales correlate with the economy as a whole, and not with gas prices at all. If anything the American consumer is an idiot for not realizing the stock market gains may be short lived, not that low gas prices may be short lived.

But really these vehicles don't get the terrible fuel economy they used to. An 8 passenger vehicle (8 adults, not like a 3 row compact SUV) getting 16mpg isn't any different than a 4 passenger getting 32mpg, something no one would think twice about. Of course whether one used this capability is up for debate, but with sales less than half of peak at least some of the people buying these as 1 person commuters are no longer doing so. Discretionary purchases should be the first to go, for those who really need a vehicle that can tow and fit this many passengers there is really no other option.

 

[exranger06]

Originally Posted By: bepperb
Originally Posted By: exranger06

The fact that sales of these vehicles go way up when gas prices go down, and the exact opposite when gas prices go up, show that most people DO have gasoline cost as one of the top priorities.


Is that a fact? Where did that come from? I'd be interested since the reality is the exact opposite. Here's something you might read that really is a fact (you know, ones you can reference back to a reliable source):

As gas crept from around 1 dollar to 2.50 during the late 90's early 00's the sales actually increased as did the stock market:

Yukon/Tahoe sales per year

1998[ 182,590
1999 175,493
2000 206,131
2001 279,573
2002 286,255
2003 285,303
2004 272,732
2005 225,765
2006 232,967
2007 209,687
2008 130,642
2009 102,665
2010 104,456
2011 114,777
2012 96,722
2013 111,804

In the cheapest year of gas prices in the last 10 years (2009) sales of the BOF GM vehicles were the lowest they had ever been. If you wanted to make a fact about this one might say the sales of these vehicles rises as gas prices rise, both a result of the economy as a whole.

Sorry if my facts of vehicle sales and gas prices get in the way of anyone's made up ideas about this topic.

So, you're saying sales increase as gas prices increase? Well that explains sales plummeting 58% in 2008 when gas prices were at their highest.

And all these stories from 2008 about people unable to sell their gas guzzlers because of gas prices were all made up too, eh?
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/money/economy/2008-04-25-1306896965_x.htm
http://www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/wayoflife/06/12/suv.irpt/index.html?_s=PM:LIVING
And how the Big 3 were experiencing lower sales of big SUVs during that time too?
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/24896359/ns/business-autos/t/gas-prices-put-detroit-big-three-crisis-mode/

And during these times of high gas prices, fuel efficient cars like the Geo Metro were selling WAY above book value?
http://www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/wayoflife/05/20/geo.metro/
http://abc30.com/archive/6157817/

 

[DBMaster]

Here's an experiment for any of you who want one of these vehicles, don't mind buying used, and do not have fuel cost as a top priority.

Wait until gas goes back up again and buy a gently used SUV. I guarantee that the market (resale) value drops substantially when fuel costs are higher.