Virgin Fram PH8A Cut open for Testing.

[splinter]

Originally Posted By: SilverC6

If I recall correctly, the 2 liter was German built just like the one in the first generation Mercury Capri.

In fact, Pinto and Capri shared the base British 1600 cc engine as well.

I always wanted one of those 2 liter Capris back then.



Yes, its engine was built by Ford of Cologne Germany and proved remarkably durable. Not the smoothest lump though.

Hot rodded it with Esslinger and Racer Walsh hardware (both of which are still in business) to beat up on the Datsun 510s and Chevy Vegas in HS, lol.
Poured over David Vizard’s writings to find some speed secrets. He’s still kicking, too!
Belted out a 17.45 @ 77 whilst stock at OCIR during an otherwise misspent youth.
Ironic that these days one of my first and best construction clients was into Ford for millions over their faulty rear end-to-gas tank engineering.

I couldn’t quite swing the Lincoln-Mercury Capri of that era, although its underpinnings were essentially identical.
Swoopy tinwork to be sure. Marketed as “The Sexy European” iirc.

On topic: Upgraded to the ‘esteemed’ Fram HP1 (w/ Valvoline racing 20W-50) when I had a few extra dollars from cleaning pools. woohoo

http://corporate.ford.com/our-company/op...s-cologneengine

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: Eddie
Looks good to me for a 3K oil change.


Fram rates it for up to 5K OCIs. I doubt Fram (or any other top name filter manufacturer) is going to rate it over or even close to what it could do in a normal engine. No filter manufacturer wants to be paying out lots of damage claims over their products failing.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: DirtyMoe21
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
The oil is flowing very slowly in the filter, and works its way between tightly packed pleats with no issue whatever. With as little media as the base model Fram has, the differential pressure across the media is higher because the flow rate per square inch is higher.


The other variable in the equation is the flow characteristics of the media. Nobody really knows what kind of "Flow vs Delta-P" curve the filer has unless they run it on a calibrated bench tester designed for that purpose.

Maybe the OP can measure the media area just to see what it is. Most "medium" sized Purolator Classics and PureOnes (as a reference point) have around 100 sq-in of media area.



The media out of the can is 4x49 inches long from my measurements and the calculator said 196 sq-in. I'm unsure of how you guys measure this, I just stretched the filter media out and measured it via tape measure. This filter media came apart relatively easy as well.


Sounds like you did the media area measurement correctly. I think the PH8A is a relatively large filter physically. 196 sq-in is quite a bit area actually. My records show the PL20195 PureOnes I've cut open have ~170 sq-in, and the 20195 is a pretty good sized filter.

 

[dlundblad]

The pleat spacing by the seam never seems to look good on these, but other than that, I don't see any issues with the filter.

I counted 46 pleats on my virgin TG8A media. I lost my skinny ruler, but the pleat depth looked to be a bit over .5".

 

[badtlc]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: Eddie
Looks good to me for a 3K oil change.


Fram rates it for up to 5K OCIs. I doubt Fram (or any other top name filter manufacturer) is going to rate it over or even close to what it could do in a normal engine. No filter manufacturer wants to be paying out lots of damage claims over their products failing.


I think it was already stated but it is rated for more than 5k if that is the standard OCI recommended by the car manufacturer.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: Eddie
Looks good to me for a 3K oil change.


Fram rates it for up to 5K OCIs. I doubt Fram (or any other top name filter manufacturer) is going to rate it over or even close to what it could do in a normal engine. No filter manufacturer wants to be paying out lots of damage claims over their products failing.


I think it was already stated but it is rated for more than 5k if that is the standard OCI recommended by the car manufacturer.


Exactly, just like the use statement from Purolator for their filters.

 

[GaleHawkins]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad
The pleat spacing by the seam never seems to look good on these, but other than that, I don't see any issues with the filter.

I counted 46 pleats on my virgin TG8A media. I lost my skinny ruler, but the pleat depth looked to be a bit over .5".



Pulled one and replaced it with another TG8A this week on the Ford 429. Years ago there was some quality issues long since addressed I have read. Since the truck has only seen 2000 miles in the past 5 years this week was only the second oil change since we drove it home. I like the long WIX too but we try to change the filter when to oil looks dirty so Fram works for that.

 

[Jimzz]

First oil change I ever did I bought a orange fram as they are everywhere and ads on TV all the time so they must be good.

I noticed a oil leak and my oil pressure was all over the place. I thought I did something wrong so had a mechanic look at it. I told him what was going on and before he lifted the car he asked if used a fram. I wondered how he knew. he told me all the problems he sees with oil filters was with a fram. Pulled it off and the media collapsed, you could see it looking down the filter hole. He put a wix filter on, never heard of them at the time.

I was more happy that it was not my fault but my opinion of fram was not high after that. Then after I became a autotech I saw more fram issues so now I just hate them.
There are filters just as good or better for less money so why even use them.

 

[Jimzz]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: Eddie
Looks good to me for a 3K oil change.


Fram rates it for up to 5K OCIs. I doubt Fram (or any other top name filter manufacturer) is going to rate it over or even close to what it could do in a normal engine. No filter manufacturer wants to be paying out lots of damage claims over their products failing.


I think it was already stated but it is rated for more than 5k if that is the standard OCI recommended by the car manufacturer.



On their site they say "For everyday drivers who perform routine maintenance on their vehicle every 3,000-5,000 miles."
So if you go over 3000miles they have a legal out on the number they give. If they say 5000miles alone and it goes bad at 4500 then its on them. If they say 3000-5000 and it goes bad at 4500 then they have a out as its up to 5000miles.

 

[SilverC6]

Originally Posted By: Jimzz
First oil change I ever did I bought a orange fram as they are everywhere and ads on TV all the time so they must be good.

I noticed a oil leak and my oil pressure was all over the place. I thought I did something wrong so had a mechanic look at it. I told him what was going on and before he lifted the car he asked if used a fram. I wondered how he knew. he told me all the problems he sees with oil filters was with a fram. Pulled it off and the media collapsed, you could see it looking down the filter hole. He put a wix filter on, never heard of them at the time.

I was more happy that it was not my fault but my opinion of fram was not high after that. Then after I became a autotech I saw more fram issues so now I just hate them.
There are filters just as good or better for less money so why even use them.


Wix remains one of the most dependable oil filters in the business.

"Real" mechanics, not just oil change guys, rely on Wix (and NAPA Gold).

Commercial filter manufacturers are all about upselling to their top (most expensive) filter.

Wix gives you everything you need for a good price.

 

[Nyogtha]

Here's what I copied from the Fram web site for the Extra Guard.

•Cellulose and Glass blended media provides protection for oil change intervals up to 5,000 miles1

The footnote 1 reads as follows

1 Follow recommended change intervals as noted in your vehicle owner's manual

I read this as owner's manual frequency or maximum 5,000 miles, whichever comes first.

I started using PH8A on a '69 Plymouth Duster with a slant 6 in 1979 (my second vehicle).

I've used plenty of Fram (when on sale) in my younger days on much older engines (as well as STP, SuperTech, boatloads of Western Auto brand filters, KMart brand when they had their Penske line of stuff, etc.) with never a lubrication problem in any engine of any vehicle I've owned.

But now I own a vehicle with Multi Displacement System so I'm definitely more concerned about particulates potentially lodging in the solenoid valves this system employs. Plus the owner's manual has a service schedule OCI of 6 months or 8k miles, much more than any other vehicle I've owned. So now dirt holding capacity and efficiency are raised in importance for me.

I put a Mobil 1 M1-210 on today. The Fram Ultra Guard and Xtended Guard need some more field time for me to be real comfortable with them vs. the Mobil 1 time in field with few complaints.

Having said that, there's a Fram Xtended Guard in the garage for the next oil change on my wife's car

She's been running 7k-8k miles OCI on what the AAA Car Care Plus place installs already.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: Nyogtha
Here's what I copied from the Fram web site for the Extra Guard.

•Cellulose and Glass blended media provides protection for oil change intervals up to 5,000 miles1

The footnote 1 reads as follows

1 Follow recommended change intervals as noted in your vehicle owner's manual

I read this as owner's manual frequency or maximum 5,000 miles, whichever comes first.


I can see how it could be interpreted like that. But since the statement didn't actually contain the words "whichever comes first", then it could literally be taken as "follow your vehicle's owner's manual". I agree it's not perfectly clear and can be taken both ways.

 

[SilverC6]

I interpret it as saying have enough sense to buy a better filter if your owner's manual permits an OCI greater than 5,000 miles.

5,000 miles would be the cutoff for me for a FRAM Extra Guard, Purolator Classic, or STP.

 

[Nyogtha]

It certainly doesn't say "OR follow your vehicle owner's manual" either.

It really doesn't leave room past "up to 5,000 miles".

If all I cared about was price (like an older technology engine - no turning cylinders on & off) and 3k miles OCI's, I'd stock up on the Quaker State filters for $1.99 at Menard's right now.

http://www.menards.com/main/p-2277654-c-9112.htm

QS states new car warranties are in effect when these filters are used in accordance with the engine manufacturer's specifications and recommended service intervals.

http://www.quakerstate.com/#/products/oil-filters

It doesn't say it won't work for a 8k miles OCI, or 12k miles, or any other limit.