exhaust styling

[SteveSRT8]

A recent thread about the 2014 Accord with a single exhaust got me thinking.

I really hate exhausts that look like an afterthought. Old Devilles are my favorite, the mufflers look like they came off a truck and were just painted and welded on like "whoops we forgot exhaust pipes"!

The Ram I am driving has beautiful pipes frenched right into the bumper just like we used to do when I was young. My car also features a decent through the valance panel design that has good looking tips on it.

Why do so many manufacturers ignore the butt end of their car? At least do like BMW did with my old 540i where the exhaust was nearly invisible from behind the car...

 

[wemay]

I can't agree more. The rear end/exhaust layout of vehicles is a major shopping point for me. Of the newer vehicles, the Chrysler 200 is impressive. Our Santa Fe Sport is very nice. The Sonata's exhaust is hidden but the rear end has a nice flat black lower valance.

 

[Hokiefyd]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
I really hate exhausts that look like an afterthought. Old Devilles are my favorite, the mufflers look like they came off a truck and were just painted and welded on like "whoops we forgot exhaust pipes"!


I had a '97 Seville that looked to have HUGE mufflers stuffed up under the rear, with the quad trumpets sticking out the back. I didn't care for the quad trumpets myself, but I did like the look of those massive mufflers under there. Perfectly symmetrical.

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
The Ram I am driving has beautiful pipes frenched right into the bumper just like we used to do when I was young. My car also features a decent through the valance panel design that has good looking tips on it.


I think that's what the Accord owner wants with the OEM dual tip setup. You could say that they're frenched into the rear valence.

Frankly, I think they look pretty ace myself. They don't use the fake chrome tip that a lot of manufactures have gone to now...where the chrome exhaust tip is molded into the valence and the unfinished exhaust pipe just kind of "points through it". Honda used real stainless tips and the dual outlet design is perfectly symmetrical. The Y-pipe is hid well and doesn't look like the system was cobbled together at the last minute. I think it looks pretty classy.

You mentioned about the 540 having invisible exhaust. Some are going back to this. My parents' 2014 MDX has no visible exhaust in the back. The new RDX is the same way. The previous versions of both vehicles had rather noticeable bright exhaust tips at the rear, much like the Accord in the picture above. The current generations of both the MDX and RDX use a single outlet exhaust that's mostly hidden from view. I told my dad that it seems that Acura's sort of changing its image from one of "performance" and "speed" to one of understatement and efficiency. And he said that the dealer said the exact same thing: they're emphasizing the performance look less (even though the cars continue to outperform their ancestors), and going for more of a "quiet" look, to try to speak to the vehicles' efficiency and luxury aspect.

I dunno. I guess there are seasons for everything. Dual exhaust outlets are pretty fashionable now. Dodge did a great job with the Ram, doing what most people in the south have already done with their trucks: put dual trumpets out the back. I think Honda's done a similarly tasteful job with the Accord.

I sympathize with the new Accord owner. I, too, would probably choose the EX-L model, but I'd like to have the Sport's exhaust layout.

 

[Hokiefyd]

BTW, here's the tread I started a few years ago about the then-new trend of the faux chrome exhaust finishers molded into the bumper. It seems that that trend hasn't gone away.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2468098

 

[01rangerxl]

I kind of like the Ram's frenched exhaust from a "show truck" perspective, but I am glad it is just an option because I probably wouldn't buy one like that. I like simple, side exit exhaust on a pickup. No tip unless it is welded on. I hate the look of the clamp on tips.

 

[morepwr]

I agree on the exhaust look. The car companies seem to just give up when it comes to the rear of a vehicle. I too like the look on the Dodge trucks with the bumper cut outs. Kind of like the Olds 442 had in the early 70's. I don't like the looks of a muffler stuck on the back of a car especially after the car ages some and gets a little rusty.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: morepwr
I agree on the exhaust look. The car companies seem to just give up when it comes to the rear of a vehicle. I too like the look on the Dodge trucks with the bumper cut outs. Kind of like the Olds 442 had in the early 70's. I don't like the looks of a muffler stuck on the back of a car especially after the car ages some and gets a little rusty.


Or my favorite when the owner has had painting work done and the exhaust pipe and/or muffler has overspray on it!

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: 01rangerxl
I kind of like the Ram's frenched exhaust from a "show truck" perspective, but I am glad it is just an option because I probably wouldn't buy one like that. I like simple, side exit exhaust on a pickup. No tip unless it is welded on. I hate the look of the clamp on tips.


Hey, that's my new truck you're talking about!

But seriously, how many trucks and cars do you see with ridiculous added on tips? UGLY isn't strong enough...

 

[BowNisPar]

Nothing is worse than those large, interestingly shaped exhaust tip surrounds that look molded into the bumper. They would look fine if they were actually the exhaust tip, but instead most manufacturers seem to enjoy putting some ugly [censored] actual exhaust inside of them. Hideous!

 

[HerrStig]

Unless there is some back pressure advantage I can't see paying extra for a Y pipe. REAL dual systems are a different story, but it is very hard to do on a transverse engine.

 

[eljefino]

I remember being stuck in traffic in the early 1990's and seeing the undercarriage of a taurus wagon in my headlights, including suspension, exhaust, maybe the gas tank. One just didn't "see" that stuff before then... or it wasn't as naked/ shiny. Now most unibody SUVs are naked below the bumper.

I like an exhaust outlet close to the body so I can see it jiggle slightly when the driver guns the engine, making it shake in its mounts and moving the exhaust as a result.

 

[aquariuscsm]

Nothing looks worse than a HUGE fartcan that's angled to the side and completely dwarfs the rest of the car.

 

[BearZDefect]

Regarding the Accord and other similar vehicles, does a 2.x liter 4 cylinder engine really need dual 2+ inch pipes to exhale?

I don't care for those exaggerated ovals with gray filling that try to make the tips look larger, to me they make it look more like a toy. A simple round stainless or chrome tip is more genuine and looks good.

But it's all a matter of taste, and the auto makers will shoot out whatever they think will sell the best.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Unless there is some back pressure advantage I can't see paying extra for a Y pipe. REAL dual systems are a different story, but it is very hard to do on a transverse engine.


I agree, nothing sillier than bolting more excess weight and aero drag under your car!

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Nothing looks worse than a HUGE fartcan that's angled to the side and completely dwarfs the rest of the car.


X2! Saw a car like yours with two of the BIGGEST I had ever seen stuffed under its butt. Looked hideous (but sounded pretty good).

Originally Posted By: BearZDefect
Regarding the Accord and other similar vehicles, does a 2.x liter 4 cylinder engine really need dual 2+ inch pipes to exhale?

I don't care for those exaggerated ovals with gray filling that try to make the tips look larger, to me they make it look more like a toy. A simple round stainless or chrome tip is more genuine and looks good.

But it's all a matter of taste, and the auto makers will shoot out whatever they think will sell the best.


There is no need on a regular 4 cylinder for anything more than one pipe out. Most people forget the way most 180 degree fours fire means the pulse has cleared before another comes along. You just need correct sizing.

And yes, I have seen new Lexii and a Mercedes with hideously ugly factory valences and big chromed cutouts.

 

[Hokiefyd]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Unless there is some back pressure advantage I can't see paying extra for a Y pipe. REAL dual systems are a different story, but it is very hard to do on a transverse engine.


A GM powertrain engineer friend of mine said that there is an advantage to splitting the system before the mufflers. He said that, in general, exhaust restriction increases as noise attenuation in a muffler increases. We know that to be the case...at least in most conventionally-designed exhaust systems (without flapper valves, etc). Our discussion was specifically related to the Northstar Cadillacs, and why they had dual muffler systems that split from a single pipe. He said that they can reduce the restriction in each muffler without the increase in volume because each muffler is processing only half of the flow.

I think the current Dodge Ram's factory dual outlet option supports that; there is a resonator on each of the two outlet pipes. My guess is that they can make the main muffler freer flowing and make the individual resonators freer flowing than if they had one pipe all the way back.

This isn't to say that a 4-cylinder car "needs" a dual muffler system...clearly it does not. But it also isn't to say that there cannot possibly be any gain with two mufflers.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Exhaust design must account for engine design as well as sizing.

A V8 has a completely different firing order than a 4 banger, firing every 90 degrees of crank revolution. No matter the design, the 180 degree 4 only fires every 180 degrees.

 

[Hokiefyd]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Exhaust design must account for engine design as well as sizing.

A V8 has a completely different firing order than a 4 banger, firing every 90 degrees of crank revolution. No matter the design, the 180 degree 4 only fires every 180 degrees.


Sure, but exhaust pulsing is just part of the equation. If you can split flow among two devices, each can be made less restrictive without a corresponding increase in volume and, perhaps, the overall system can benefit.

I'm not saying that it's a significant improvement or even a worthwhile improvement. But I think a categorical statement like "fake dual exhaust can't possibly have any benefit other than looks" doesn't necessarily take all factors into account.

 

[HerrStig]

I understand that Corvette is going back to a true dual cat dual pipe system after years of being stuck with the Generos Motors "One cat per car" policy. I'm sure the aftermarket guys did a good business in dual systems, especially in non-emission conrtol states like FLorida.

 

[meep]

Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Exhaust design must account for engine design as well as sizing.

A V8 has a completely different firing order than a 4 banger, firing every 90 degrees of crank revolution. No matter the design, the 180 degree 4 only fires every 180 degrees.


Sure, but exhaust pulsing is just part of the equation. If you can split flow among two devices, each can be made less restrictive without a corresponding increase in volume and, perhaps, the overall system can benefit.

I'm not saying that it's a significant improvement or even a worthwhile improvement. But I think a categorical statement like "fake dual exhaust can't possibly have any benefit other than looks" doesn't necessarily take all factors into account.


What that engineer didn't mention, is that the same "efficiency" could be gained on a single system if they used a muffler with larger capacity., ie., bigger. Duals sell. "Extra large muffler" does not. OTOH, it may be harder to package an extra large muffler.

I like duals when they are true duals and sound like true duals. beyond that, I'm good with a single.

The dodges look dam* sweet. For my money I'm going to pay more attention to other aspects, but I wouldn't complain one bit to have it.

And to be fair, mine has just a brown pipe sticking out behind the wheel that came straight out of the 80s and prior It's not even cut to reduce the aesthetic. it's not elegant at all.

 

[JetStar]

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
I understand that Corvette is going back to a true dual cat dual pipe system after years of being stuck with the Generos Motors "One cat per car" policy. I'm sure the aftermarket guys did a good business in dual systems, especially in non-emission conrtol states like FLorida.


I'm pretty sure they did that a number of years ago.